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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be upset dp doesn't want to marry me

502 replies

bellabella10 · 18/02/2014 08:38

As background we've been together for 5 years and have an 18 month old together. When we first moved in together about a year into the relationship we would talk, possibly jokingly, about getting married and having kids at some point in the future. Our baby was a surprise although we love him so much.

Whenever i have brought up the subject in the past two years (not often) he just changes the topic. Last week i approached it head on (I want to change my name anyway so we all have the same surname old school) he said he doesn't want to get married and doesn't know why. I will change my name by deed poll i suppose but it still upsets me.

I didn't even want a big do (although i get a tiny bit jealous when i see my friends getting married) and would be happy going to the registry office with only a few close friends and family.I have a feeling is because he had family abroad but they do come over and we could have a small ceremony in both countries.

OP posts:
Chunderella · 19/02/2014 14:40

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

motherinferior · 19/02/2014 14:41

Er, actually that's not a given either, LBP.

I've just edited a major public policy report that looks at how the 'maternal pay gap' (because you are talking about mothers, not women - married women without children who choose not to enter the paid labour market are pretty rare) could be closed. In countries with affordable, flexible childcare women are working a damn sight more, and earning a damn sight more too.

No, it won't change through 'wishing'; but political will and legislative change (in the same way that rape in marriage is no longer a crime, and it is - ostensibly - illegal to pay women less than men) can make a difference.

LittleBearPad · 19/02/2014 14:41

I'm not telling you to stop posting but you're banging on about how things should be without acknowledging how they really are

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 19/02/2014 14:43

I'm in agreement with JoinYourPlayfellows throughout the thread.

I'm also bemused that 'pulling the plug' on your partner is seen as any kind of 'priviledge'. I'd probably say that a parent is the best placed to decide; they have no axe to grind or selfish calls on their child but surely, somebody can set up a power of attorney/living will anyway?

OP, marriage isn't a 'bit of paper' but it's not the be all and end all either. What it means to you is what it means to you. If you partner doesn't want to marry then really, that is that. You can't make him marry you and if you do manage to coerce him into it, you'll always know it.

For me, I wouldn't have children without marriage but that's my just my personal view. If marriage is important to a woman then that's what should be clear at the outset because having a child whilst unmarried possibly weakens your position.

I hope that you can have a discussion with your partner and come to some kind of resolution that works for you both.

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 14:44

bear,you don't like the sentiment so you're trying to dismiss as banging on
I can accept I don't agree with others,I however don't dismiss it as banging on
So in answer to your question,no I will not refrain from making my points

Chunderella · 19/02/2014 14:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

motherinferior · 19/02/2014 14:48

I hope you're not calling me reasonable, Chunderella? Grin

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 14:52

Men don't hold power Over women in regard to whether they marry her
They only have that so called power if it is conferred to them.so don't be so deferential
Calling men who won't marry mother of their child selfish,is bizarre and incorrect

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 15:00

So called wishes can through action,agitation become legislative social changes
It's a good job people banged on about equal pay
And policy,social attitudes do change.yes,incrementally,sometimes slowly but social attitudes and legislation can change

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 19/02/2014 15:04

Moomin - you are wrong. Marriage does give protection and it is NOT just a piece of paper Hmm.

OP - nothing wrong with being upset that he doesn't want to marry you are the moment but don't let him make all the decisions about YOUR life, he is no better than you and isn't in charge of you.

Chunderella · 19/02/2014 15:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 15:10

And equally to Bella partner don't let op make all the decisions about YOUR life, she is no better than you she and isn't in charge of you.
You see that advice must apply equally to Bella and her partner.to be equitable

ToffeeOwnsTheSausage · 19/02/2014 15:50

Agreed, scottishmummy.

I am reading this thinking I married DH because I loved him, wanted emotional security and to have children within marriage. I have no family at all, no income of my own (other than CB) and I guess if he left me I would be stuffed. Fortunately we have been through so much trauma that I am as confident as I can be that he won't leave me and if he does I would stay put and he would go to parents as they would never see the children go without and have plenty of money. They have also said I could go to them if needs me. I am sure people want to tell me I can't assume anything and I am daft to trust but don't waste your keyboard.

IfNotNowThenWhen · 19/02/2014 15:51

I agree that legislation must be fought for to redress the balance of children/ work for men and women. In the eyes of society, women have children, men don't. Hence " working mothers" and the " debate" over whether women can "have it all", and the assumption on both sides that the womans career is less important. I know things are changing a bit- I know a couple of dads who are main carers, but on the whole it goes like this: a couple have a baby, the woman goes part time, and I don't think all that much thought actually goes into that.
Also, lets face it, most of us have jobs, rather than careers, and, at 25 when you are bored of your job, and shacked up with a nice man, the idea of getting pregnant and being a mum is appealing. I know a couple of girls like this at work; it is just taken as inevitable that they will quit work/ downshift when they get pregnant. They don't think about ten years from now, when maybe their relationship is showing cracks, and they are pretty much dependent.
The younger women i work with also do all the housework, and iron their dp's shirts, and i know they think i am a bitter old mare when i warn that when the kids come along, they may start to resent the current set up..
I guess it takes some will on the part of women and men to rethink how families work.

Littletabbyocelot · 19/02/2014 17:39

I completely agree that just because the OP wants to get married, doesn't mean the OPs partner should have to. However, surely in a relationship if something is important to one person and the other person doesn't want it, you discuss it? For example, it's an absolute given that sex in a relationship is optional. However, if the OPs DP came to her and said 'actually, I've decided I don't want to have sex any more, it's not for me', she'd be entitled to feel hurt, to question whether he really fancied her and to also question whether she wanted to continue in the relationship since it meant she'd be living a life without sex. It also would not be unreasonable to expect an open discussion about it, and for him to look at why he didn't want sex - e.g. was it a medical problem, was he depressed, does he not fancy her, or is he genuinely not that sexual a person.It seems like the original assumption was that marriage was on the cards long-term, and it clearly matters to her, so surely it deserves more than 'I don't want to, don't know why'

Ifnotnowthenwhen, I don't see how we can change attitudes to childcare if we don't allow it to be a positive choice. The assumption that people would only choose to be a primary carer if they didn't know any better, or had never been committed to their career makes it much harder for men like my DH - who would be very happy to be a SAHD for a couple of years - to do so. There must be something wrong with you to be a SAHP right? A woman might not know any better, but what possible reason could a man have for doing it? And why would anyone want to employ them afterwards?

Seriously, would you choose a career where people looked down on you & 'warned' you about your choices.

Viviennemary · 19/02/2014 18:37

And what about inheritance tax on a house if people are not married. This is something a lot of people won't have thought about if they have a house that is worth a substantial amount.

LittleBearPad · 19/02/2014 18:49

so surely it deserves more than 'I don't want to, don't know why

This is very true.

As is the point about caring for children being looked down upon. Only one man I know has considered taking time out of their career to care for a child and the circumstances were unusual. And it was largely done (with working from home too) in academic holidays so didn't really mean turning his back on his job.

alistron1 · 19/02/2014 19:13

DP and I have been happily unmarried for 21 years. We have 4 kids. We have joint PR. If one of us died/left we have the ability to be self supporting. All our assets are legally joint and my pension is worth more than his!

We just don't see the point in getting married, never have and never will.

scottishmummy · 19/02/2014 20:45

Yes,of course Two adults can have enduring fulfilling unmarried partnership
No man needs to marry a woman simply because they had children and vice versa
As with most significant things,make an informed choice

IfNotNowThenWhen · 19/02/2014 21:54

The point is littletabby, is that it rarely IS a positive choice, to become the main carer. Its just taken as a given. And whether being the main carer is looked down on or not, the fact is, that in the event of a relationship breakdown, the main carer is in a much worse position.

LaGuardia · 19/02/2014 22:03

also, if he were to die before you, his assets (house? money) would go to his next of kin, i.e. his siblings. NOT your kids.

^^this is a really good point. Get the immature twat to make a will in your favour, at least.

Littletabbyocelot · 19/02/2014 23:27

Ifnotnow: I agree that the main carer is in a financially worse position if the relationship breaks down & I think that it should be a decision a couple take jointly about who does what and that they should both take responsibility for that. There should be better protection there - and marriage provides some of that protection.

But I don't agree that it's rarely a positive choice. I guess we can only go by our own experience. For me, I would say that I don't know a single woman who meets your description of having a 'job' not a career and is just marking time till they meet a nice man and pop out some babies. The SAHP I know (and that includes my dad, who was my primary carer till I started school) have all made an informed choice, as have those who work part-time and those who continue with both people working full-time.

My best friend - who happens to have a PHD and a high flying career - spent 5 years as a SAHM because she wanted to. To me, the way some people (almost always women) act towards her and her husband - she must be stupid and he must be sexist - is as anti-feminist as those who assume a woman's place is in the home.

MistressDeeCee · 19/02/2014 23:33

What sebsmummy said - I believe thats the truth of it, as blunt and simple as that. Men protecting themselves financially & also not going the full commitment way 'just in case'. Its a real shame marriage is looked at in this way..including women who enter marriage thinking about protecting their finances. Makes it sound as if everyone who enters marriage is in it for monetary gain, or goes in with a whats mine is mine attitude. Of course that isnt the reality out there, many marriages mean sharing. Thats as it should be. I think if money is at the forefront of one's mind then they probably shouldnt marry, as there is no guarantee that they wont have to spend some money on their partner. Marriage is a joint thing. Not everybody however is money orientated but its an issue when one is & one isnt. Its as well to remember you cant take money to the grave with you, theres no guarantee of a long career into old age, so somehow perspectives may have to shift. Again I do believe people share, but its a shame its not often talked about underneath all the money and negative talk

IfNotNowThenWhen · 20/02/2014 09:31

Littletabby, I would not say that women I know are marking time until they can stop work and have babies, just that if your job is that- just a job- it doesn't feel like such a big sacrifice. I know a few people with careers, but in reality. The majority of people in this country have jobs. I know I do.

Writerwannabe83 · 20/02/2014 11:20

I agree ifnot, I imagine that if finances weren't an issue a woman who has a standard job us more likely to say, "I'll give up work" than a woman who has a career. Making sacrifices to a career is much harder than just sacrificing a job and I imagine plays a large part in women making the SAHP or return to work decision.