AIBU to feel annoyed when it appears that a vaginal delivery is an "achievement"

[walkie]

Sorry for the rant, family member has just had second child, and other family members are repeating "amazing" "she did really well" "she only needed gas and air" "it only took X hours". I can't help wanting to say, well, I didn't exactly choose c-section & various other complications - I hate that this feels like somehow her natural delivery is more "worthy" than any other routes? There are no A*'s in childbirth (or have I missed something?)! (This is really just about me & how I feel - I know the most important thing is that mum & baby are safe & well.)

Why women might be oversensitive to remarks is as important, if not more so, as whether others might just be being rude though.

Gosh even people who are normally pretty damn nice are being harsh to the OP. Yes, she might be projecting, but likely only because of what she went through with a c-section and because of the cultural negativity around c-sections in general. Have a little sympathy before start saying all women are bitches.

If I had given birth 'naturally' yes I would be proud and call it an achievement, but after a failed induction and a c-section I will admit that I do get twinges of envy/annoyance when I hear people being congratulated for their natural birth. NOT every time, it depends on the tone. 'Well done you', is fine, 'Well done you for doing it naturally' is less so.

I have had people saying to my face that a c-section isn't giving birth properly. They'd forgotten that I'd had one. They soon realised. But they didn't apologise, they just laughed it off nervously. This happens all the time!

I know friends who've had rotten vaginal deliveries so I'm not going to say one option is easier than the other. Both can be pretty damn hard.

And I won't say I did 'nothing' during my son's delivery either. I was induced and in labour for hours. Effectively I did both bits 'natural' and c-section.

It does annoy me that I feel a block over the c-section. I don't really feel an instinctive pride over the process. I don't really feel like he was 'born', more like he was 'removed'. These are my issues and I fully understand that - but I am grateful whenever anyone tries to be sensitive about them.

I wish I didn't feel (emotionally) like I failed in some way. But it's the way we're taught to feel about it all, even if people who don't have to think about it (because they didn't have to do it) can't recognise that. Sigh.

Sometimes I feel completely alone because of this attitude. I don't want a "Birth experience", I just want a healthy baby. And if, on my deathbed, I looked back and thought that achieving a vaginal delivery was an achievement rather than a biological process, I'd be pretty disappointed with the rest of my life. But then we're all different. It seems to me that the OP is right. People become very funny and woo about something that millions of women go through every day. If you choose an ELCS you either grovel apologetically and talk about how you have medical reasons or risk being looked at as less maternal than those that don't mind risking incontinence for the rest of their lives. OP, just ignore them. People often don't know what to say about birth and so they just make inane comments. The only thing that matters is that the mother and child are fine. Everything else is woo nonsense.

I think you are right but then everyone who has had a baby probably deserves to be told they did well.

I can sort of see that not opting for lots of drugs if you can help it could be an achievement as you might get an easier/quicker delivery and it could be less risky.

But mostly what happens during childbirth probably isn't a choice.

Doesn't really matter what people say though as the main thing is that you get lovely dc at the end of it (although am sparing a thought for those who experience real tragedy in saying this).

You are projecting massively here. No one is saying you failed in anyway because you had a c-section. I don't understand why some women insist in giving themselves a hard time because they had sections. And I say this as someone who has had 2. Someone else had a natural birth in a few hours? Good for them. I'm happy for them. Mine didn't work out like that. Hey ho. I have 2 beautiful children and don't feel like a failure of less of a woman.

flossietta I don't think there can be any harm done by using relaxation techniques in any circumstance , you had a serious condition but came through it and are ttc again! good for you. You should be proud. To explain myself better, I was trying to say women might use non medicalised forms of pain relief if the circumstances are right and if that's what they want.

I just wish equal airtime was given to positive birth stories and alternative ('woo') pain relief because I genuinely think this could benefit many women. Non medical birth shouldn't be denigrated (as it has been on this and many other threads) just as any other woman's choice shouldn't be.

I had decided adamantly not to have dc having had graphic details of birth trauma from in particular two of my best friends, dd was a surprise and the best thing that ever happened to me, I do wish someone had said something more positive about birth earlier in my life so I could have started younger!

It was an achievement for me that I did it the way I wanted to do it. If it hadn't gone to plan, I'd have been a bit disappointed, but I'd still have had a gorgeous baby girl. Birth is a rite of passage for many women - let her have her moment.

Anyone who judges how a woman gave birth is rude and obnoxious. C-sections are often not easy and carry higher risks to mum. Don't listen to the daft family members.

catellingtion you are very much under the misaprehension that we all preferred a medicalised birth. I was adamant I didn't want drugs or gas and air because I hate the idea of not being clear headed. The very idea of an epidural terrified me. I read and studied for hours while pregnant to try and avoid this.

I was woken with contractions at 4am but they were only 5min apart. I got up and started using a birthing ball to do exercises I'd learnt, then I went for a walk. I spent the rest of the day alternating between the birthing ball and walking about as the contractions increased. I didn't go to the hospital until 22 hrs in but I was only 6cm.

After 38 hrs of contractions they sent me to the ward to get some sleep which I didn't get as contractions were never more than 2min apart, usually closer and quite intense. I tried to continue to move etc. When I hit 48hrs tiredness was making pain harder to bear. By 83 hrs I was sobbing with exhaustion and begged to be examined. All this time I'd been mobile 95% of the time no analgesia and was fully dilated.

About 88hrs in they finally gave me morphine as I was distressed about dd's head still not being engaged and was starting to hallucinated with tiredness. I was begging them not to give me any more it felt awful. At about 96hrs in I asked why dd's heart rate was dropping said I didn't fee very well either, everything was going swimmy and fuzzy. I remember buzzers going and lots of people in scrubs. The last words I heard were "shit, she's bleeding out, theatre now!"

I came round a few hours later, not sure exactly how many. I was in recovery hooked up to lots of things. Turns out I not only have a deformed vagina but a deformed pelvis also. But obviously that had nothing to do with it, eh catellington? If only I'd been more informed, used proper techniques I'd have given birth properly. Was all to do with my choices during birth, if I'd chosen properly my deformities would obviously been irrelevant .

Not read the whole thread yet, but I empathise OP.

I had a very complicated first birth that had started out as a smooth homebirth. Mentally it took a lot to get my head around, especially as I believed all the natural childbirth books I'd read that epidurals can lead to more problems - I had one, lots of complications, I felt like I was totally responsible for making bad decisions.

I distinctly remember a morning, curled up in ball on the floor of the kitchen in tears with my dh trying to reassure me, because we'd received a birth announcement text from a friend which said.....

"Baby X born at 7.30am. My amazing wife did it all on just a whiff of gas n air. Now THATS an amazing woman"

It totally gutted me

Also I do feel there are a lot greater achievements in a woman's life than the manner in which she gives birth, which is probably at least 80% of the time not a choice.

If you don't get the birth you want though it's probably best not to fixate as with anything that doesn't go quite right - you can't change it anyway. Probably easier said than done especially with post birth hormones, but in the long term it's better to take a superior attitude...

grumpy your experience sounds terrible, really But to repeat myself again I said when circumstances are right and when women want, to put it another way it's down to a mixture of luck and (if luck allows) preferences. I don't see how anything can be misconstrued there, where did I say that 'you all' wanted a medicalised birth? I thought I was being as balanced as possible ie there is no 'proper' way. Was trying to be supportive whilst giving my sentiments oh dear I obviously missed the mark there!

It was an achievement for me. My waters broke early so I knew they would induce after a while which I was terrified of as I thought the pain would be worse and even more terrified of a cs as I'm scared of being cut open and blood so I did everything I could remember that I was told speeds up labour. I didn't even have the placenta injection luckily as I'm needle phobic too. Yes, I really was probably the last person who should give birth ever. Not even any pain relief bar gas and air due to the needle phobia. I suppose the reason I'm proud of it was because I avoided everything I was scared of.

I understood where you were coming from catellington

I really REALLY wanted to avoid any meds/whatever (i wanted a nice waterbirth) and managed to go 24 hours into my induction with just a fucking useless TENS machine.

Once the fucking syntocinon was ramped up I was begging for mercy :) managed another couple of hours on a bit of morphine but in the end I was desperate for be epidural. Man that was the best thing ever. One of my good
Friends managed her induction on just gas and air, now to me THAT is impressive because OMG does induced labour bloody hurt!

But hey ho. I can see the funny side to the whole caper. I was off my tits on the morphine and laughing hysterically whenever I projectile vommed over DH and when my waters hit the doctor in the face when they were doing a fetal blood sample. :D

But this has taken me a long time to see the good in what happened.

I would never say anyone who had a normal vaginal delivery should never talk about it. Talk about it until the cows come home if you want! Be my guest. I think in all aspects of parenting though, lets keep any judgemental tone out of it and its all good.

I delivered DC2 by vaginal birth with no painkillers (not even a paracetemol), and with out DH present until the last few seconds when I was literally pushing DD out.

However, the lack of painkillers were not by choice!

DH was so proud of me that he went on about it to everyone for days afterwards. In hindsight, yes, he may well have mortally offended someone, but it simply was not a reflection of anyone else's experience. He didn't care about anything, other than my 'achievement'.

And besides, I didn't actually do anything, other than expel a baby from my nethers. I would've taken any and every pain killer going, if they'd been available...!

People are allowed to be proud of the ones they love, and if we mitigate ourselves every single time someone we loves does something to instill pride for fear of offending randoms, we'd have to go round with our mouths taped shut.

Trigger warning - I will say though, that I do know (of) someone who had an ELCS because she'd been quite brutally raped in the past, and the thought of being on her back, with legs apart, and a total sense of loss of control was too much for her. Clearly not a medical reason for an ELCS, but I think you'd have to be pretty hard-hearted not to grant someone one under those circs. And the wider point is - no-one knows for sure why someone might being having an ELCS, so pre-judging people is pretty pointless.

YAB a bit U

Its not a dig at you because you had a section. First and foremost its just one of those things people say because really, there isn't much else to say about the baby itself. They don't really do much.

Personally i didn't feel id achieved anything due to mode of delivery with my first two, both vaginal, uncomplicated (apart from them being a bit premature at 34 weeks). They were easy births. One 9 hour textbook labour, second 3 and a half hours with six minutes of effortless pushing. Gas and air and diamorphine.

With my third though, a few things happened i had very much feared. He was back to back, they wanted to put that drip in me, i had an epidural because i just couldn't cope. I do feel i achieved something in the fact that i managed to stand up for myself with a horrible snptty doctor who wouldn't take my history into consideration (id only been in labour a couple of hours, and with my second i dilated very quickly, i wanted a chance to do it without the drip and she was horrible).

I feel i achieved something in going through having an epidural - That one terrified me.

I feel i achieved something in carrying to full term finally.

And as for pushing him out, i did feel i achieved something there because at one point I refused to push, i didn't want to do it, it was painful and felt wrong having had two preemies a fair bit smaller. I had no desire to be pushing him out i just didn't have a choice.

If it had ended in a section i would (hopefully) be proud of other things relating to that. TBH consenting to one would take a lot for me to do, i am so scared of them.

I think every woman achieves something (aside from having an actual baby) during birth though for the most part. Whether its vaginal or section.

If you have a baby you did well and are be congratulated. It is weird that anyone cares how.
Must remember to congratulate my husband when he ejaculates for it being natural and if I go to the dentist and have a filling without pain relief, I am sure the experience will be so much better and one with nature.

Why the big deal about being mega proud of not having any type of pain relief at all. I wouldn't particularly admire someone who said "I have a belting migraine but I'm not going to take any painkillers COS I'M SO HARD" or somebody who wanted their mole removed without any local anaesthetic to prove how tough they are.

noddingoff when I didn't want painkillers it wasn't about being hard. Quite the opposite in fact, the idea of taking something and feeling woozy terrified me.

My sister and I both have 2 kids. I had both of mine drug free etc etc whilst she needed sections. Tbh our family had a lot more sympathy for dsis whereas I didn't seem to considered to need to recover, however, I don't think anyone was more proud of me than her and rightly so.

I was made to feel like a failure by some family members as I "gave in and had an epidural" after being talked in to it by the midwife. They knew by then I was having a big baby who was delivering in an awkward position and midwife said if I didn't have epidural to give some relief before last stage I wouldn't be able to push the baby out. Despite me telling family members all this I was still made to feel like I had "copped out" and not done it "properly". People can be so bloody insensitive, took a long time for me to learn to ignore them.

Well she did do well didn't she? Giving birth is hard work.
That's not to say you didn't do well in your circumstances either, although clearly this is not about you.

And you don't get points for being in pain - if you want pain relief then use it.

I had an epidural with number 1, nothing with number two and only gas and air (with a shot of pethidine 5 mins before he was delivered because they had to rip my hind sac open) with number 3.

I know which one I'd do again given the choice.

I think that the difference between taking pain relief for tooth ache, migraines, surgery and child birth is that you don't need to be physically involved in your tooth ache or surgery or migraine, sometimes in childbirth you do need to be actively involved. I live in a country where they don't give epidurals unless you are having interventions, they give mobile epidurals which are supposed to take the edge off the pain but you still feel the pain of the contractions and you still have free movement.

I spoke to my midwife after my birth, I mentioned that many of my friends in the UK had had epidurals and they could sleep or drink tea and were then unable or not allowed to get off the bed. My midwife told me that if I had had that situation my ds would not have been born vaginally as he was stuck for 2 hours with his head high up whilst I was 10 cm dilated. It took 2 hours of gymnastics and bum massage to get his head to drop down, if I had been immobile lieing on a bed he simply would never have come down and he would have been born by emergency c-section. I do feel proudof the way I birthed my ds but not proud or disappointed about my use of drugs, I feel thankful that I had fantastic advice and acces to pain relief.

It is not always a good idea to tout you had an easy natural birth. Images of a bucket come to mind.

But well done anyway.

Noddingoff it's not a way of showing how hard you are. For me personally I didn't have any pain relief because the diamorphine I was offered would have crossed the placenta and gone into my baby's blood stream, and the gas and air made me feel like I couldn't control my breathing and therefore anything else. So I didn't have anything.

That doesn't mean I judge anyone who does use pain relief. Your body, your baby, your rules. I do however resent the implication that I'm some sort of boastful knob for the way I chose to deliver.