AIBU to feel annoyed when it appears that a vaginal delivery is an "achievement"

[walkie]

Sorry for the rant, family member has just had second child, and other family members are repeating "amazing" "she did really well" "she only needed gas and air" "it only took X hours". I can't help wanting to say, well, I didn't exactly choose c-section & various other complications - I hate that this feels like somehow her natural delivery is more "worthy" than any other routes? There are no A*'s in childbirth (or have I missed something?)! (This is really just about me & how I feel - I know the most important thing is that mum & baby are safe & well.)

Sorry was addressing madambossyboots not you mumofboyo. I apologise.

I'd love to know what makes people judge that an ELCS isn't necessary? Who made them the decider? How can anyone say something so stupid without knowing the woman and her circumstances? Do people really believe the Obstetrician would carry out an ELCS if they didn't deem it necessary? Do you think they perform major surgery just because the woman unnecessarily fancies it? What a ridiculous thing to say.

When I announced I had had a boy I was told "never mind, you can have a girl next time." I also didn't name him properly as his name is nothing like mine .

You were not referring to those who choose without any medical reason (who are these women anyway? Does anyone actually know one or are we just reading the tabloids again?). You said ELCS. It does not mean what you think it means. If you're going to judge people at least get your terminology right.

Again, I'm going to ask the question... do you know why most women who CHOOSE to have an ELCS do so? Are you able to provide me with a profile of a typical women who does so?

Then I'll tell you if it matches anywhere close to the research on the subject...

I think your expectations determine how you will feel about your birth. I went in hoping for the best but accepting whatever happens as long as we both come out alive and healthy so was grateful for an emergency caesarean because it resulted in the most important outcome. I was too proud of my gorgeous baby and relieved that it was all over thanks to an amazing medical team so the possibility of feeling bad didn't come into it.

Women really don't have much control over what happens during birth, if nature fails then you just have to hope that there are competent professionals around you.

The best thing women can do for their mental health is avoid all books/documentaries from natural birth nuts, their propaganda is designed to create paranoia against doctors (who are all out to cut you open for the fun of it apparently) and guilt if you need pain relief or medical intervention.

Having a baby is an achievement whatever way it comes out. Women shouldn't place importance on the method because really only the outcome is important (although obviously a quick, easy birth where baby pops out effortlessly would be preferable if we could order one, some people do get so lucky). Your relative did do well by the sounds of it, or at least her body did, lucky for her. That's not a dig against you.

I chose without any kind of medical reason. Well...they did say he was going to be massive and would more than likely crack my pelvis, but I had made my mind up way before then.

There's no medical reason. Not for me to want the birth I want. Or for someone to choose to sit in a bloody great paddling pool, when another might want to have a certain type of music. There's no medical reason a husband should cut the cord, or that someone wants to give birth at home. It's called knowing what's best for me and my boy.

The people saying you're ignorant and rude. They're right. Add judgy and narrow minded to that. There's another list you can dislike.

madam I was booked in for an ELCS for dd2. As I went into labour early it turned out to be technically an emergency section.

When I arrived at the hospital I said I was booked in for a section. She smiled and said "oh maybe we can try for a VBAC". She came back with my notes and I watched her face change and then her rush out the room saying "I'm going to get the dr a VBAC may not be possible". The dr looked at my notes, examined me and said "this birth is likely to go thr same way as the last". I had an emergency section. Is that OK? Should I be ashamed that I had booked an elective section? Who is to say it wasn't necessary? Two obstetricians have told me I can't give birth vaginally. I nearly died trying to give birth vaginally as did dd1. If I were to fall pregnant before i get my sterilisation (abortion is not for me) you can bet I would ask for an ELCS.

I had an EMCS 2 years ago after being induced for preeclampsia. 3 days of hell ended up in EMCS. The hell continued with a catalogue of postnatal fuck ups resulting in a very sick newborn and breast feeding was a bust.

All that plus the absolute disgusting attitude I saw online and also IRL about what a pathetic failure I was contributed to pretty severe PND. baking you remind me a lot of me back then in how you are feeling. You are wonderful, please don't lose sight of that. Please don't bottle your feelings up, tell how you are feeling.

Nowadays thanks to yummy antidepressants (I'm coming off them now) and some time and perspective I don't give a flying fuck if people think I'm a failure for 'not giving birth'. People who think badly of me or any C section mum can bugger off.

And all this 'trust your body' stuff is bullshit as well. Birth is so individual, so varied. Everyone has a unique set of circumstances. Some are luckier than others.

I was so traumatised by the whole experience I have been adamant I didn't want any more children. But I've changed my mind and will be TTCing in 2 years. If I am lucky enough to conceive that sprog will be born via ELCS and I am very happy about that indeed. If people think that isn't necessary, so what? It's my choice, I'm happy with it and that's the end of that.

On a different note, having just had surgery I think women who give birth under GA are nothing short of incredible. I felt like hammered shit after I came round and I didn't have a newborn to look after.

Well I wish I hadn't had a vaginal delivery. I had a horrendous time of it and finished up with a third degree tear and scar tissue. Don't see it as achievement, just a mug for believing all their clap trap about it bring better for you and better for baby, when it's really all about saving the nhs money. In countries that have private healthcare strangely the cs rate is way higher surprise surprise!!
Next time I am having a nice calm elected cs!

I'm one of 'those' women.... was no real pressing medical reason for my elcs. It was my choice....a great choice for me personally. A truly wonderful experience....
We are all so different....I would support women in their choice no matter if it were a clinical experience (as I chose). Or to have the most natural home birth they could achieve. Healthy babies and mums are the important factors. Nothing else matters.

Oh my. What a load of rubbish. There is no culture of competitive childbirth other than on mumsnet. Some of the things people are saying are terrible. I wish I hadn't read this.

but I think it's about choices you make early in labour that also effect the rest of the labour, choosing epidural for instance, or which positions you adopt, IMO these also have an effect.

My waters broke at 40+10 - no contractions followed and it wasn't until 3 days later I was admitted for drip induction.

I was on my back, bedbound, wired up to various drips and machines and when the contractions started, they were one on top of the other with no break in between.

I cba to carry on the story, but in.short, I was not able/allowed to make any choices and it is this,lack of control over my own body/birth experience that was incredibly traumatic.

I woulf choose an ELCS if I had another child because ime it would be the only way I would feel I had se control over the situation.

Even if the women decided to have a planned section because the father could be at the birth ( thinking military personal here), without any of the 'reason' Then as a female is 2014 I support that decsion.

hoppinghare Mon 06-Jan-14 20:45:40
Oh my. What a load of rubbish. There is no culture of competitive childbirth other than on mumsnet. Some of the things people are saying are terrible. I wish I hadn't read this.

And facebook.
And in the press.
And in magazines.

Mumsnet is also not cultural. Nor a reflective of culture. It just exists in its own bubble outside the rest of the world.

I think you have just done the internet version of stucking your fingers in your ears and going "la, la, la, I'm not listening! it'll go away if I pretend it doesn't exist'.

Even though my dentist knows my medical history, and we had been discussing it in relation to my future ELCS he still made jokes about me just bring 'too posh to push'.

I was not impressed.

hoppinghare most of the nasty comments that were made to me were before I discovered MN. There have been more comments than the one I mentioned. If you haven't met any of these nasty people then you are very lucky and I envy you.

Yunno, I bet if men gave birth they would be congratulated and applauded and told they were simply marvellous - no matter how the baby made it to the outside world.

I suspect this is a feminist issue OP.

All mothers should be as proud as fuck of producing human beings.

Hugs to all those who were put in distress by what I call the 'Institution of Motherhood' - a structure that makes women feel bad/competitive/isolated about motherhood. It's all bullshit.

Congrats to us all for coming out the other side alive, I say. And what a bloody shame that we aren't better looked after in modern childbirth - wouldn't be that way if it were men doing it, I tell you. Especially the emotional side which is heart on your sleeve when it comes to conception/pregnancy/birth/feeding, and yet so barely acknowledged.

Women have it bloody tough.

beachcomber - men get congratulated and applauded if they so much as do the washing up or whizz round with the Hoover! I'm pretty sure giving birth would be worthy of a Knighthood

It's horses for courses isn't it? For me, a medicalised birth puts the absolute fear in, I even found gas and air nauseating and distracting, but that doesn't make anyone else's preferences more or less worthy, that's just me.

I do take issue though with the idea that birth is inevitably totally beyond a woman's control. Yes there is luck involved but there is also plenty which a woman can do to help herself with positions, breathing, etc. if the circumstances are right. It's just that either these techniques aren't taught at the more popular antenatal classes, spoken about by midwives or maybe people just aren't interested.

I don't understand why we can't hear more about non medicalised birth, to inform those who are interested, not to shame anyone who prefers another approach. There is plenty of knowledge about epidurals etc through antenatal process but no alternative other than 'no pain relief'.

They don't always need to fight for an ELCS but sometimes they do.

Anyway I'll hide this thread now as if there is one thing that winds me up immensely is women moaning that they are being looked down because of the way they gave birth whilst at the time slagginh off other women for the way they gave birth.

Not this again.

Why shouldn't it be seen as an achievement, no matter how the child comes into the world?!

No wonder so many of us are scared of giving birth if apparently only difficult births stories are allowed to be shared for fear of upsetting someone.

This says way more about you than it does about the people having the audacity to celebrate a birth.

Catellington or maybe some people do all those things and still things go wrong? (Like me).

Some people seem to be confusing nasty remarks with simply being positive about another mother's experience.

Comment to you: Didn't you want to do it properly? This is rude and insulting
Comment about someone else: Well done! This is absolutely fuck all to do with you and you need to deal with your own issues rather than piss on someone else's parade.