to think that he is entitled to refuse this

[messclearer]

I have name changed for this as it is very sensitive to me and my family and I’ll try to keep it as broef as possible.

My sister is gay and her and her wife (they have a civil partnership) have wanted to have a child for some time. I have a younger brother who is 19 and one months ago Dsis and DSil asked him whether he would donate sperm for artificial insemination. DSis has implicitly stated that this is what was going to happen was going to happen for the last few years without ever telling him and no-one in the family has ever challenged her (I accept that this is partly my fault). My brother initially told them that he would need to have a long think about it but last week told them that he did not to do it. Since then my sister and the family and some of our family friends have reacted very nastily towards him, my mum and dad uninvited him from Christmas dinner and my sister sent him some very nasty texts along with telling everyone that he is dead to her and that she has no brother etc.

I feel that it is his choice though and the reason he gives for not doing it (he would feel uncomfortable around a child he had biologically fathered but was not their parent) is a reasonable one regardless of whether you accept it or not. I saw him yesterday and he is shell shocked by the whole thing and the way that most people he has known since he was very young have turned on him. I feel terrible for him as he has suffered vitriol from most member of our family in the last week or so for making a legitimate choice. DH seems to think that the initial reaction is expected and although it is unpleasant at the moment, it was an inevitable consequence of this decision in an emotionally charged environment but that it will inevitably blow over. I feel horrendous about the whole thing for him as so many people have turned on him for making a choice that is acceptable in my opinion alongside the ridiculous assumption on the part of my sister that he was certain to agree to this request.

I'm not sure if this has already been said but if your dsis wants to have a child she shares 'genes' with then why doesn't SHE carry a child and be the biological mother and use another sperm donor , definitely not her own brother !

Actually , your dsis and her partner sound totally unfit to have children , they sound nuts

grimbletart

Anyway, I am not seeing the 'gross' factor that people are finding about the dad/uncle role (though I doubt he would have a 'dad' role, a donor is usually just a donor I think??).

I'm with Notjustacigar - given how they've reacted/shown true colours, he must've intuited it would be awful to stand by and watch a child he'd fathered being parented by these women.

OP don't let him be bullied into this - stand up for him.

Just wanted to add to the people who have suggested you show this thread to your poor brother. It might really help him to know that there are many, many people out there who support him and his right to make his own decision. I too think your parents have behaved abominably.

Oh, very few of us are 'fit to be parents'. I'm certainly not. I'm not defending them in any way, but I really don't think that's the route to go down.

why would anyone think this is a good idea

how complicated do you want to make life sperm donors are usually not connected to the child for a reason. it is not as simple as a child having loving parents

you sister and her wife really need to think this through

I can understand them asking but refusing to accept his thought out answer is unacceptable.

It's also unacceptable for the whole family to try and bully him into something else.

There no saying how he'll react to being the DC biological father, how the legal ramifications would affect him or how any future partner might view the situation/family dynamic. I can't believe his own parents aren't looking out for him and respecting his decisions in the matter.

Presumably there are other males in both women family who can be approached and the have option of donor sperm.

I could understand disappointment for a long cherished plan not happening but not to attempt to bully someone really isn't acceptable behavior.

Your sister and her wife are hideous. As are the other family members who have turned against him.
Show your brother this thread so that he knows he is doing the right thing and that this is his choice.

Your brother has done nothing wrong.

Your family seem a little like mine, they get together and plan things without asking the people most involved and then are shocked that someone can't or won't go along.

Give him a big hug from all of us here and tell him to stay strong.

Op, your sister and her partner are not fit to be parents. Seeing as your sister is the Golden Child, I wouldn't put it past her to be the "dominant" one in her own personal relationship with her wife.
Whether I find the uncle/father thing ick or not isn't a point that I will go into. The fact that for a good few years, your not long out of the age of minority brother has not been looked at as a brother by his sister or a son by your parents...the slave stud thing comes to mind.
For that reason alone, I feel that now that you have stood up for your brother, you have a duty to reinforce that he should not back down due to familial pressure. I know the dynamics of having narcissistic parents (not to this extent, thank God) and the temptation to re engage and "compromise" for the sake of family "love" and approval. Don't let your mature (for the reasons that you have given), brave and principled brother buckle for a quiet but not authentic life.
let your cheap ass sister do what many infertile or lesbian women do. Pay the money for an above board, anonymous sperm donor. Being gay is not a "lifestyle choice". Being a parent IS, whether Gay, Bi or Straight. Along with the decision comes sacrifices....the first being should be your sister's sense of entitlement to her brother's sperm.
What does your sister's wife really think about this or is she always on board with what your sister demands? If she is then I suspect that your brother is VERY intuitive about a lot of things about his family. Good for him and good for you for defending him.

poor lad. his sister wants his spunk? for her girlfriend? and your parents are up for that? well, i'm glad you and he have more sense.

On that logic, why doesn't the bio dad of OP + her sister provide the sperm (so he would be both grand-dad & dad).

I can't see any reason not to. Or perhaps a male relative of the Sister's wife. Why is the 19yo the only suitable donor to approach?

Absolutely his right to refuse. However these things can be great when all parties are on board. The more loving and wanting parents the better in my opinion. It needs to be a cold, clinical and legal agreement.

What an absolute awful overreaction!

It's hardly as if the brother is the final hope!

And even if he was he could refuse!

What other males are available, OP?

And genes are so important-has your sister considered having a baby herself?

If genes are so important sis could donate an egg to be carried by her wife. That way the baby would genetically be sister's, but the gestation and the breastfeeding etc done by the wife - both would have a biological link.

It would be expensive, of course, but it seems she thinks any sacrifice is as nothing compared to her having a child with her genes in the mix. Or is that only when the sacrifices are made by other people?

Bluntly I hope they're both infertile. They are not fit to parent at all.

I don't think he should be pressured into this at all. My gay friends used a sperm bank. They are now mums of a lovely two year old and are about to try for a second using this method.
There are loads of 'alternative family' websites to help them

OP, I'm wondering how supportive you're being of your brother.

You say that you went along with the idea, or at least didn't object to it, while he was still a child. Did you think this was ok?

I asked upthread what you planned to do to support him? I'm not being goady - I'm just wondering if he really has someone who is 100% willing to back him up on this.

You know there are financial implications to fathering A child,maintenance etc

I think your sister and your families attitude is very wrong.

However, the nasty nature of some of the comments and the ill informed perspective leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

First, the use of a (consenting and willing) male donor with the sister in laws egg is far from uncommon, eitheramongst lgbt or straight infertile couples. Its not incest. It works fine in some families, but not in others.

Second, there is no such thing as anonymous sperm these days. All donors in the uk are traceable when offspring reach 18. As a consequence, numbers have plummeted and it is very difficult, as well as expensive, to get sperm from someone who isn't known to you andewilling to enter a private arrangement.

Third, the couple are in a civil partnership, so those of you who have used girlfriend, please don't again. It isn't accurate.

Fourth, to stooshe and anyone upthread who has done similar, speculating who is dominant in a relationship is generally not on, and always has a rather nasty and prurient undertone in reference to gay couples (I bet I know who is the MAN if you know what Imean, nudge nudge wink wink, chortle - the seventies are over folks).

Fifth, if a man donates sperm to a civilly partnered couple and both are put down as parents, no he won't be chased for it.

None of these points take away from the fact that a)the brother shouldnt be leaned on and b) the sister and the parents sound pretty horrible about this, but please guys, lets discuss this accurately and respectfully. Because all of the misconceptions I've referred to above are used all the time in relation to perfectly lovely and kind lesbian couples, and using them anywhere perpetuates it and that really isn't on.

Dancingwithmyself, that is the best post ive seen not only on this thread but on the whole of mn.

Yes, it's lovely. Thank you.

To be fair, stooshe was making assumptions based on OP's description of her sister and would have done whether the relationship was hetro or homosexual, I think.

I don't see any point in derailing the thread because you're reading things that aren't there.

Dancing's post is spot on. Nevertheless the idea of lining up someone so young and then pressuring them to involve themselves in something so emotionally momentous (not like he's going to be an anonymous donor, is it) is sick.