Friend, her DCs, and me 'punishing' them unfairly.

[youarewinning]

Had my friends dcs (8&10) last night for the night as her and her DH had a child free family event. I'd booked cinema as a surprise.

She stayed for coffee when she dropped them off and kids went to park opposite to play on DS (9) remote control car he got for Christmas. I tell them to come in at 3pm as we're going out. Youngest tried to negotiate but I refused to engage and said 3pm please. Friend got a little defensive saying she always tells them 15 minutes earlier than she wants them in as it gives her negotiation room.

Anyway friend leaves and I get things ready for trip. DS comes in at 3pm and says the other 2 said they could stay out as it wasn't dark and their mum doesn't mind them being late.

DS is very upset (has SN and these things do upset him more than others) so I calmed him and gave him a snack. At about 3.20 I thought I ought to go and get the others as we needed to leave at 3.45. As I'm getting my shoes and coat on they come back. I ask them to go to toilet and get coats etc as we are leaving in 15 minutes. I also said to make themselves a drink. DS is finishing his snack at this time and youngest asks for one. I said no time now as late back but I had snacks for them. She gets in a strop and storms off. Tell other 2 to ignore her and get ready as we have to leave. Then finally persuade dc2 she won't drop dead of starvation in next half hour and we need to leave. By now it's nearly 4pm. Film starts at 4.15. Get to town at 4.10pm and park and then I tell them what surprise is. They were very excited. DS asks if we can get sweets but I said too late now as running late but I had some chocolate and crisps and a drink each in my bag. Walking up stairs I hear dc2 start slagging me off to my DS. DS shouted at her so even if I'd not heard the whole cinema then knew about it!

I tell her not be so rude and she should have done as she was asked if she wanted things to be her way after.

I'm not a teller, or a rusher etc, more a natural consequences person. So just kept going on with plans treating all 3 dc equally.

We went to Burger King after and they all slept well. Friend collected them at 10.30am stayed for a coffee and left about 11.30.

She rang me about half an hour ago telling me both her DCs were distraught, why would I refuse them food and drink, I should have gone to find them to come in when they were late for the 'curfew'.

I just said they were not refused, they choose to ignore the curfew and therefore had no time for snack, they had food at the cinema, and a Burger King. I then said her youngest had been quite rude to me and about me.

She then said I 'knew' when she gives her girls a curfew it was always 15 minutes earlier than they actually needed to be in/ she wanted them in to allow for them to negotiate later and/ or be late. (What I've witnessed is the youngest arguing over everything times she's been given for most things and her mum agreeing to a different time). Therefore she feels I punished them unfairly.

I pointed out she was there when I reiterated they needed to be in at 3 and they chose to come in nearly half hour later and they were not punished.

So who is right here? I'm left feeling like a prize bitch but yet feeling there wasn't much else I could have done other than make us late for the film?

I wouldn't do such a favour again and produce a surprise treat.

You weren't a bitch, both your friend and her kids were rude and ungrateful.

Goodness me, will your friend build in 'negotiation time' if there's an emergency that she needs them all to leave for immediately. Stupid woman. You're a good friend OP, I wouldn't be in a rush to help her out again.

If you had told them up front they were going to cinema they probably would have rushed back in as your DS had. They had no idea they would be late for something and so your rushing them through a snack/refusing them it felt like punishment to them. Their mother did remind you that they're crap at timings and perhaps you should have followed their mothers wisdom and given them 15 mins notice. I get the feeling you don't like her kids very much. Poor communication all round I'd say.

YANBU

your friend sounds awful (and the dc not much better), I wouldn't have them again

Do you think she tries to get the school to give them a fifteen minute negotiation time?

Your house, your rules. You were very fair and reasonable.

Anywhere else they would have specific dead lines - schools/clubs/appointments.

It's not appropriate for her children to treat your rules/timings with disrespect.

Personally, I think you were expecting too much of the eight-year-old.

My DD is 9 in March, and I wouldn't even have let her go out unsupervised in the first place. Much less punished her (by refusing her snack) for not coming home on time.

I'm shocked that the mum thought she could insist on everything being done her way.

Lovely to have a surprise by the way.

The kids reaped the consequences of their actions but clearly were not punished

Telling them about the cinema might have saved some of the to'ing and fro'ing but not definitely. It sounds like they'd still have arsed you about anyway because that's what their used to getting away with.
Rude and ungrateful - kids and their mother. I wouldn't be looking after them again in a hurry either.

I am a stepparent and 'my house, my rules' is vital to the happiness of all our children.
If I was lucky enough to have a friend like you,who welcomed my kids into their home for a whole night, they would be told to abide by the rules or else!

I would find new friends.

My ds3 (7) plays outside unsupervised. He knows he must come in at the given time. I would have cancelled the cinema trip.

Three means three. Regardless of whether they know they are going somewhere or not. They ignored you and missed out. Tough crap.yanbu your friend is being totally rude and ungrateful.

I'd actually prefer that anyone who babysat my DS would be stricter than I am! Better that than getting, well x let me do it, for the next few weeks.

There is nothing wrong with what you did, but if the children are used to their mum's way of doing things, and your way is completely different, there is no way they could have understood and followed the rules to your standards. They were following your rules to their mum's standard, which is what they know. You expected them to know that you do things differently, and there's no way they could have known that, so they were bound to fail.
It's a shame. A little more effort all round and it could have been more fun for everyone, but they have learnt that different mums have different rules. I think you could have been more considerate of their level of understanding, especially as mum had told you how she does things, but there is nothing wrong with your approach. When kids understand it, natural consequences are far better.

YANBU and your friend is raising kids just as selfish and ungrateful as she is.

Mostwicked, at 8 and 10 they must be used to other peoples ways - at school if not relatives and friends parents. They are old enough to know that there are natural consequences to disobeying and that being rude about your host to your son is unacceptable.

Well, first off, I think your friend was very rude, and it was totally wrong for the daughter to be rude to you. And, your house your rules.

However... you know that not all children are alike, obviously, and not all children will respond the same way to 'come in at 3'. My eight year old needs to know the exact plan, the whole plan, and how all the timings fit. Surprises don't work very well for him. Well, they do, but the surprise has to be managed. So on his Boxing day cinema trip was announced on Boxing day, and we said how the day would work in terms of meals, travel, what snacks he could have there, what he'd eat out. He was perfectly able to stick to our timings, but only because he could see how the day fitted together. A sudden 'let's go to the cinema...' would send him into turmoil.

Again, I think you're perfectly reasonable with natural consequences thing, but I don't think all children are aware of what the natural consequences are. Clearly their mother doesn't say 'you need to be in at X, so that you have time for a snack before travelling, because the film won't wait for you...' I do this, so over 8 years, my son has worked it out. My daughter (6) not so much, and I still have to say over and over and over 'if you do X, it will mean you can't do Y, so are you sure about X?' She's far from stupid, but to her the world is immediate and brilliant and all things at once, and there are no consequences at all. Don't get me wrong; I give her consequences over and over, but her mind doesn't work that way.

So basically, you expected them to understand all of the consequences which they'll never have experienced before, with no prep and in the course of half a day.

I'm not saying you're unreasonable, and I'm clear that she was rude, but your expectations of two children who aren't raised the way you raise yours were possibly a little too high.

If someone was looking after my DD for me, and she behaved as you described, coming home claiming unfair treatment and being refused food/drink, I'd possibly phone my friend to clarify but would reiterate that the treatment she received wasn't 'unfair' and that the consequences she endured were of her own making. YWNBU. I'd also have words with her about her rude behaviour, and give her additional consequences and make her apologise to my friend.

Your friends sounds like she lets her kids do what they want.

You told them to be in at 3 because you were going out. They chose not to follow that. It is their fault they missed out on a snack.

My dd is 9 and has been playing out unsupervised since she was about 5. She knows that when i tell her a time i mean that time not a minute later.

I wouldnt have them over again.

Don't worry about it. You did everything right and the only issue was her children not knowing how to behave when at a friend's house. You didn't really tell her children off, just explained the practicalities of why they couldn't have what they wanted. You kept going with the lovely plans you made and didn't let anything become a big issue or ruin the day.
It is your house and they should have been brought up knowing you are polite and well behaved at others houses and respect the parents rules.
Your friend should be grateful for you having her children and taking them out (not cheap). I am shocked someone would bother to call you up and make accusations. She sounds very confrontational and ungrateful.
Seems very strange.

So you took your friends children overnight, including to thr cinema and BK so that she and her DH could go to a function?

All she should have been phone to say was 'thank you' and profusley apologise for her daughter's rudeness.

^ awful typos

rude yanbu. you told them when to be back. you treated them to the cinema? very poor behaviour. she doesn't deserve you

Yanbu at all, the weren't refuses food!

I can't believe after you had her kids as a favpur and took them out for a teat she phoned to complain!!! Rude rude rude.

Silly bat. It's precisely because she builds in negotiating time that her dc argue about everything. If she gave them one time and made it clear that it was absolute, she could save herself an awful lot of needless argument.

YANBU at all. Your friend is demonstrating poor discipline and bringing up ungrateful, rude girls who know how to manipulate their mother. I wouldn't bother with them again, tbh.