To keep unvaccinated step children away from my newborn?

[sydneycat]

Its a bit of a long one but here goes.

I am a step mother to two boys 4 and 6. The 6 year old has autism which my partner attributes to jabs he recieved at 6 months. As a medical professional I know there is no substance to that at all but my partner won't be swayed.
I love both boys very much and am very happy to be a part of their lives. However I am very concerned as both boys are constantly sick with colds and various bugs. We also live in a area with a low vaccination rate. My baby is due to be born in winter and there have been worsening outbreaks of whooping cough.
I am concerned about them spending time with the baby before it has its shots as the baby will have no protection against whooping cough which is highly dangerous and often fatal to very young babies.
My partner is extremely anti vaccine given his eldests autism. I love him and we are extremely happy but I am not happy about putting my baby at this much risk, what is the best way to broach this?

Info on transmission from the health protection agency - so they should be providing the correct info. And unless you know who exposed you it cannot be said that it ' 'must' have come from an unvaccinated child in the playground. For starters a child with a bad cough is more likely to be home than an adult with a mild illness:

Protection against whooping cough infection is not life-long and even after natural disease, individuals can get re-infected and spread infection to others. The same is true after whooping cough vaccination, although infection in fully vaccinated individuals is normally very mild. Because of this, the disease still continues to occur in cycles despite the high coverage of the vaccine. Protection from vaccination against serious whooping cough is very high for the first few years of life, when the risk of complications is greatest. Protection is extended further by the booster dose given shortly before children go to school. However, vaccinated people can get a mild infection, particularly as immunity wanes in late adolescence and adulthood, and these people may spread infection to those children who are too young to be vaccinated. When pertussis is circulating, this boosts people’s protection and eventually helps to stop transmission. However, a few years later immunity wanes again and infection can spread more easily – leading to these intermittent epidemics

So avoiding a well unvaccinated child would be a bit daft unless you're planning on avoiding vaccinated older children & adults as well (& whispers - unvaccinated adults are usually not particularly unwell with whooping cough either)

I expect it was an unfortunate but small chance thebody - it sounds like you did everything you could to minimise the risk. Unfortunately no vaccine is 100%, it just vastly reduces the chance of catching the illness and sometimes reduces the seriousness if it is caught. It wouldn't necessarily be an unvaccinated child - it could just be general exposure which happened to affect your baby.

I doubt there are that many kids going around unvaccinated against whooping cough as it's been part of the DTP for at least 5 years (when DS had his done) and diphtheria and tetanus - tetanus especially - are taken seriously by most people.

Sorry xposted.

thebody, DS caught it at a similar age and he was our eldest (and we didn't randomly hang around with other people's children), so how we were supposed to have caught it "from an unvaccinated child in the playground on the school run" I don't know. The truth is that they haven't the foggiest where you caught it from. You can easily catch it from an adult who thinks they have a bit of a sniffle/slight tickly cough who sneezes or coughs near you in the street. And you can easily catch it and pass it on even if you've been vaccinated as immunity is only partial and only lasts a few years. Telling you that it "must" have been from an unvaccinated child is about as reliable as telling you that it must have been from a tall dark left-handed stranger whose name begins with a J.

when dd4 was born I had her in a face me sling and kept random kids away from her until she was vaccinated

These are not "random kids" they are the babys siblings! Did you keep her away from her brothers and sisters?

Sorry, I need to make this point again.

They are not "the step children" they are this babys brothers and/or sisters, yet the OP and many of the replies read like they are little strangers that pop in from time to time. This is a family and if there is one guaranteed to destroy it, it is the OP acting as if they have less right to their father and their home than her PFB!

Hmm I was incredibly unwell as an adult with whoop ibg cough although I know that's not always the case. A friend was off work for two months and as a self employed person was very difficult for the family. My mother in law is v older, was also very ill and now had some lung damage and difficulty singing so can't return to her choir.

Minimising the seriousness of the disease doesn't help.

I think the point was that an adult is less likely to be seriously ill with it than a child, hence is more likely to be out and about infecting other people. Yet it's always "unvaccinated children" who are blamed for spreading it.

Because most adults are vaccinated.

So are most children!

But their odds of an adult having it are virtually the same whether vaccinated (unless it's been in the last couple of years) or unvaccinated.

I'm reasonably sure that I caught it from an adult (because I'd barely been within spitting distance of any children for weeks; we were making the most of remaining childfree time).

And a greater proportion of children are vaccinated than adults, if we're going down the "because most adults are vaccinated" route. When I was born in the early 70s pertussis vaccine uptake was around 80% but it dropped off markedly in the mid-70s because of the vaccine scare. In contrast, vaccination rates over the last ten years have run at around 94%.

Bear in mind that since we recovered from the mid-70s slump, pertussis vaccine has had excellent take-up rates. There aren't hordes of unvaccinated children running around the place. It's just that whooping cough isn't a disease where you can build up herd immunity because the vaccine is only so-so in terms of how effective it is in the first place and how long it lasts in the second place.

I wasn't minimising the seriousness of the disease. I was pointing out in terms of transmission of pertussis (which this thread is about) then you're probably safer around a well unvaccinated child than an adult (vaccinated or unvaccinated) with a cough.

The description of it as a mild illness in vaccinated adults was from the health protection agency , not me. I added that it was often mild in unvaccinated adults as well to make the point that any adult with a cough whether severe or mild, vaccinated or unvaccinated could have whooping cough. It is not easy to diagnose in adults and many adults with it do not realise they have it.

When I was researching vaccines with DS, I read that the Pertussis vaccine is only designed to cover the child until they are 12 months or thereabouts anyway, because it is not considered dangerous to children over that age because it is easily treated.

So I would say that in fact it wouldn't make any difference whether the children are vaccinated or not.

Also IME if you are vaccinated they are less likely to formally diagnose you. I caught Really Bad Cough and passed on to infant DS. Infant DS (unvaccinated) was officially diagnosed and appears in the official wc statistics for that year. I (vaccinated) was never officially diagnosed (even though I have to have had it to give it to him) so I don't figure in the statistics. There wasn't necessarily a sinister agenda behind this (by the time DS was diagnosed I wouldn't have been infectious any more, and the diagnosis for pertussis is a bit invasive and takes ages, so there wasn't much practical benefit to be gained) but it can't be an uncommon pattern.

Right, but they're not nieces or nephews or friend's children are they? they are siblings. Half siblings yes but still siblings.

Any other child would not be coming 2/3 days a week, and view the house as their home, and have a parent living there!

These are not random chdren, they are this baby's siblings, and te baby's father's children.

Has it been mentioned yet that WC seems to have mutated, and so the vaccine may not be particularly effective anyway?

I have a link somewhere which shows the number of cases for each vaccine preventable disease (actually probably notifiable diseases now I think about it) in each area per month. That might be useful to the OP to look up the likelihood of WC infection as her due date nears.

I am a step parent, btw. And I had my step children staying with me when dd1 was born. And I had no idea of their vaccination status, other than it was strongly suspected they were not up to date with all vaccinations (we lived abroad, and so it was particularly important that several jabs were given. The info was deliberately withheld, despite asking several times - all before I was even pregnant, so nothing to do with that). And so I do know what the OP is going through. And I still think she is wrong to try to ban or quarantine her step children

I'd quibble over the "easily treated" because whooping cough itself isn't really treated at all (if you catch it very early you can give abs, but the research is a bit woolly on whether those actually do anything to reduce severity of symptoms). But the possible complications are more easily treated over that age and you do tend to recover on your own eventually.

OP There is Whooping-cough-vaccine-while-pregnant

Aside from having the vaccine and breastfeeding there is nothing more you can do practically to protect your newborn from the virus unless of course you are contemplating separating from your DP.

Would you separate from him? Even if you did he might seek a contact order.

Very very difficult situation. I was lucky that I didnt have to face this. DSD was 4.5 when DD was born but luckily DSD was vaccinated.

The vaccination for pregnant women does not guarantee whooping cough immunity for the baby.. Theres a good chance they would receive some protection but not guaranteed.

the baby's life is not automatically in danger if the stepchildren go near it.

the OP cannot unilaterally ban her DP's children from the house. it is unlikely that her DP will see his children as the walking timebomb they are being made out (by some) to be, and so is unlikely to agree to his children being excluded.

as Chunderella said, an unenviable position.

and, btw, it is not 'for the sake of principles'. The OP's DP belives that on of his children was damaged by vaccination. This happens. It is likely that he will have misgivings over this baby being vaccinated. this is a far bigger discussion that the OP needs to have with her DP than the contact arrangements with her stepchildren.

Chunderella you are right, a contact order for a new born would take months to come through and then be v limited especially if she was bfing.
To end a relationship over this, practically and emotionally this is very difficult stuff.

OP difficult as it is a child cannot be protected 100%, not matter how much we want too.

Im glad Im not in your shoes