To feel utterly depressed about my MIL?

[Crystalballs]

I'm afraid this is long but I should give some background to put things into context.

DH and I have been together 8 years and have a child. My mother in law pretends to my face that she loves and supports me but it has never felt very genuine. Despite this, over the last 2 years I have started to trust her and believed she had grown to love me in some way. Obviously I'll never be one of her own and I know that, but I felt we had a good relationship.

Yesterday my friend and I overheard her making some bitchy remarks about me (we had taken my DC to visit her at her place of work, and she thought we had left when we were around the corridor after using the bathroom). We overheard MIL speaking to her sister (my Aunty in law), she said that I wasted her son's money (I don't, and one third of our household income is from my earnings), and that I should be more than happy with my lot as I've done so well in marrying her son compared to the rest of my family who have nothing.

Just 5 minutes beforehand MIL had told me she loved me. I feel so hurt and depressed by all this. It's as though we've regressed back to 6 years ago when I first became pregnant and had DC. MIL found it very difficult when DC was born and accused me of keeping her from DC because I wouldn't let her give DC first bath, let her look after DC alone and stay the night at her house at a couple of weeks old etc. I felt at the time very threatened by how much MIL thought of herself as 'mother' to my child. She even referred to my DC as her 'firstborn'.

DH is very supportive of me however it's difficult for him to act on this. The last time he did catch MIL speaking in this way about me, he confronted her but she burst into tears and basically sulked for one month whilst we had numerous phone calls from my sisters in law pleading for DH to apologise to MIL and stop her feeling so sad. In the end we gave in.

If DH or I confront MIL with this latest event it's 100% likely she will again sulk and make herself the victim. I obviously feel like I want I give her a very wide berth for a while but there's only so long I can do this before the sisters in law get involved and all side with MIL because they feel sorry of her.

I am completely fed up and feel so stupid for believing MIL thought well of me. I can't cope with this stupid childish woman any longer.

It sounds like your MIL thinks that, having overstepped one boundary (ie being caught out slagging you off) that she can overstep a whole lot more - hence these little visits. And in a way she is right - nothing happened to her as a result of being a total bitch to you, did it?

I'm not blaming you - just perhaps stating how she might see it. It is therefore essential you quietly and firmly enforce boundaries in your own home.

No, I am bathing DD tonight. Thank you, but no, I am bathing DD tonight. Repeat, quietly and firmly, not raising your voice, not getting cross. Just stating facts. If you can manage it, it is actually very empowering.

And like another poster said, be absolutely honest with your DD. She will know on one level what's going on & needs to know she can trust you to be honest with her - else she'll be mightily confused and thus open to manipulation from your MIL. Nothing wrong with stating facts to your DD. I think you did right when explaining the playgroup scenario.

You can do it. It might take practice. You might not manage it all the time. But please try, as she will continue to overstep the mark if she thinks she can get away with it.

Good luck, and I'm so sorry you're having to deal with a situation that must be horribly stressful.

Btw, who cares what the rest of the family think if you enforce boundaries? Make something up: DD was massively overtired, on the verge of a tantrum, e.g. Keep it calm and factual. Just don't engage with MIL or her minions!

I think you need to start standing up to her more, so re the bathtime, say loudly, "MIL, I am doing bathtime, you can sit and watch if you like, but please stop trying to take over." You might upset her, and she'll sulk, but bit by bit, she'll learn you don't back down.

Now you know part of her technic is asking over and over until she gets her own way, you need to step in and say "Granny, DS has already answered that, don't ask again."

Basically, she doesn't like you and doesn't care if she hurts your feelings, so time to give the same treatment back. She might get upset, but you need to accept that if she does get upset by you being reasonable, that's not your problem. She can sulk, cry, throw a tantrum, but it will only work if you decide you have to fix that. If you ignore it, then perhaps she'll realise it doesn't work with you. (Or she'll sulk and stop talking to you.)

Time to be cold, distant and not giving her what she wants.

Re the "she doesn't mean it" try saying to your DH, "but the problem is she does mean it, you say "she doesn't mean it" because you don't want to deal with the truth is that she does mean it."

oh op that's vile and she's a bitch.

completely agree with birdsnotbees

I guess you are upset because you thought she had grown to like you, don't let her upset you as obviously you are twice the nicer person than she is.

to add not all mils are horrible. mine was great and i welcome ALL my kids girl/boy friends as you never know if it's the one.

keep calm and carry on asserting yourself.

DH and I have just argued over it. I suggested he talk to her again and he says the problem is between women and he can't understand it. He thinks MIL does not mean to be mean and that she and I need to communicate more.

It's almost an complete about turn. He was saying the opposite last week. He just doesn't want to deal with it.

She sounds a bit like my MIL except thankfully mine lives a couple of hours away! OP I really think you have to draw some boundaries here and stick to them. It might help to think of her like a petulant toddler - you wouldn't give in to sulking and tantrums from a toddler and you definitely shouldn't with a grown woman!

What has really helped with dealing with my MIL and FIL is deciding what is and isn't OK for us and acting on it. We gave up trying to reason with them as frankly that was just rewarding their bad behaviour and as someone mentioned upthread, they simply aren't capable of a reasonable discussion. I'm afraid we also had to stop caring about sometimes looking like the bad guy: tbh MIL is never happy anyway so we might as well stop bending over backwards trying to please her.

You did the right thing not letting her take your lo to nursery. If she turns up at bedtime, simply smile and say something like, Oh LO's so tired tonight, I think we're going to skip bathtime and I'll just do a quick story - say bye bye to grandma, LO. etc etc etc. Whatever you do don't get into a debate, don't lose your temper and don't back down.

It will all be an awful lot easier if you get dh on side.

Just saw your last post OP. Struggling to see how she said that I wasted her son's money (I don't, and one third of our household income is from my earnings), and that I should be more than happy with my lot as I've done so well in marrying her son compared to the rest of my family who have nothing. could be construed as not meaning to be mean ?!!

Yes yes to what shoewhore said: treat her like a toddler. That's what I meant with the calm reinforcement of boundaries: you don't get cross with a toddler (they're not rational), so you just repeat, repeat, repeat until they have no choice but to back down. Or at least do what you want.

And if your DH won't help, well then all the more reason to do what YOU want in your own home, regardless of what the rest of the family might say. Sod 'em. (Besides, I find it hard to accept that they do actually agree with your MIL; they're just going along with her for an easy ride.)

Definitely agree with everyone re: the assertiveness.

I'd also be tempted to try and always have at least one other person within earshot when you have to deal with her. People like that will make up any old rubbish to try and make it seem like you were being nasty to them.

The trouble is she's had years of her own family being used to being manipulated and possibly not even realising it half the time.

She's more likely to turn on you because you can see what she's up to, and emotional manipulation with the tears etc... is less likely to get sympathy from you and that's annoying for her!

Be very firm but not rude.

Every time she says anything aggressive or intended to manipulate you or your child don't let it go unnoticed.

It will take a while but she will maybe realise that in order to get things she wants there are better ways of doing it - like having a normal respectful relationship with someone!

Unfortunately a lot of people like this never seem to get it as they're so used to operating in a particular way.

She may well sulk and tell tales to get sympathy, but let her carry on and keep your own mind clear about what "actually" happened regardless of what anyone says.

You'll still feel better that way than if she's allowed to play mind games with you and you end up fuming at every interaction with her.

You're not responsible for how she chooses to behave. She would like to make you feel responsible though so don't let her into your head!

your dh is an idiot who should support you but it is what it is so I would start pulling up the shields, be icily polite to mil, don't let her do anything for dd and if she challenges you tell her you overheard her being nasty and you are ahocked and hurt.

you have a witness to the conversation.

deflect them all.

however this lack of support from your dh must hurt.

Argh, awful situation. Your DD is likely to know perfectly well at some level what's going on, even if it's in terms of 'mummy didn't like that'.

My father's mother was like this and was horrible to him through my entire childhood. My parents worked very hard to keep my sibling and I from being aware of it right up into our teens as they didn't want to influence or spoil our relationship. We picked up on it anyway and my mother saw us do it from the time we were toddlers. To us she will always be someone who made our father unhappy and we knew it even if he said and showed nothing at all. And that was the end of it, our first loyalty was absolutely to him.

The other thing was that as soon as we were no longer young children, the manipulation games began to involve us. I can vividly remember her charming the socks off a friend of mine in front of me, playing 'poor misunderstood grandma' to the hilt while I'd been so stressed about seeing her that morning I threw up. Your DD sadly won't be exempt from it, but she might be helped by seeing you deal positively with it and knowing between you and her that it's not ok. Children are well aware when they're being 'used'.

She sounds exactly like my MIL.

My DC are grown up now and they have no relationship with her because they saw right through her.

Why does it get to be about your MIL and her family? You are in charge in your family so go ahead and piss her off. Soon everyone will be saying "you know what Crystal's like" in respectful tones.

My MIL also tried to muscle in after DD was born. I adopted a confident, busy persona (even if I was uncertain/nervous inside) and after a while it became natural and now I have a reputation for "knowing my own mind" or somesuch.

I feel for you, I really do, but you NEED to stop worrying about your DH's family's needs and start thinking about your own.

You need some powerful language.

Fuck off probably isn't appropriate, sadly.

Try "unfortunately"

Unfortunately MIL we're meeting friends at playgroup so today isn't good. How about we do x (short, specific, your terms) tomorrow instead?"

"Unfortunately MiL dd has said that she'd like me to bath her"

Etc. very hard to argue with as it's just factual, calm, you are in charge. Don't let this woman EVER be in charge. She's forfeited that. Your house, your dc, your rules.

Stand calm, firm and implacable.

As for the thick skin: when she's being a cow tell yourself the story of what she's doing in your head in the 3rd person. It'll entertain you, stop you engaging emotionally in the same way and mean you can follow her agenda and retain control.

Your house, your dc, your rules.

Grandparents have no rights. They are granted access, they cannot demand it.

My DH sees her current behaviour as her trying to make it up to me (the horrible things she said). Because he knows she is emotionally immature and unable to actually bring it up with me or apologise, he thinks her coming over and offering to help is her way of showing me she is sorry.

I could look at it like that but I don't believe it's the truth, and I do find it difficult to forget once someone has done something like that.

I will be more assertive because in some ways I was held back in the past by thinking maybe she does really love me. But now I know she doesn't and after all these years I don't think she ever will. So I do care less now what she thinks.

Thanks for the tip on thick skin MsPickle!

I have been feeling very tired and rundown with a virus so maybe she has just caught me at my most vulnerable the last couple of times. What was worse though was when DH doesn't see it because I do care what he thinks.

He says her taking over bedtime for DC and the repeated asking of bathtime is just his mum desperately trying to spend another few minutes with her grandchild.

Shy has no other grandchildren apart from mine. If she did it would certainly take the heat off!

My Achilles heel is when DC shows preference to MIL over me, which does happen frequently because MIL gives DC toys/sweets that I don't approve of (there have been many make up sets!!!), also MIL has never and will never tell off DC for bad behaviour so I do often look like the wicked witch when MIL is around. It hits a very raw nerve that my relationship with DC is being threatened by this woman. I already have my insecurities about bonding when DC was a baby because of MiL's interference some of which explained in my first post.

Hmm yes I have to say my MIL has been much better since SIL and BIL provided multiple other grandchildren

Your MIL cannot and will not threaten your relationship with your dc, I promise you. How frequent are the unsuitable toys and sweets? If occasional then I would try not to worry too much. If often, then you can always let your dc have a sweet and then put the rest away for later. Really really unsuitable toys can always be binned put away after a few days.

I think I just need to believe that Shoewhore - that MiL cannot threaten my relationship with DC. Because it feels like it is her life's goal at times. She has nothing much to keep her occupied as does not work and all children are grown up.

Because I have managed to get by without a mother figure I don't really have that belief that a mother's relationship is the most important one.

No - I know it's the most important one but I can't quite articulate what I am trying to say.

I don't think MIL is a good role model to DC, she is everything I don't want my DC to be

This hit a note with me, this is also true of me, our values are polar opposites. I think mine is dreadful and would not want in any way shape or form mine taking anything from her.

I disagree on threatening your relationship.

She is already causing arguments between husband and wife, she is contradicting you in front of the DC, I feel she thinks there is no holes barred now.....

Mine also has nothing to do and no more DC and I also feel like its her life works to get her hands on my DC, as she can do everything better

It would make her day If I came down with a terminal illness.

You would be surprised at just how mad these women can get.

Especially when they feel they are loosing their grip.

She has caused many, many arguments between me and DH sadly.

With the DC, the worst moments have been when I have had to put my foot down in front of DC and say no to something, and DC have left MiL's house crying with me looking like the bad guy. Example, she will ask DC if they want to stay at her house the night without checking with me first. And of course it's usually not practical because DC has an activity the next day or we've made plans with friends. I also say no to this because I want to show her it's not going to be that easy to manipulate me and create a situation where she calls the shots on when she sees DC. She DOES have to ask me first.

How old are your DC Elf?

It's all a stupid power game. So fed up with it!