to be concerned re. what is going on re. immigration and population growth?

[ClarityJane]

So many non-English voices, especially East Europeans, but so many different nationalities en masse it seems have moved here in the last 10-20 years - completely unprecedented historically. And in an already very over-crowded island.

Today I read Labour MP Frank Field say that the population increase due to immigration by 2031, i.e. less than 20 years, will be approximately 10 million and will require building something like seven new Birminghams! Or another London! Based on latest predictions in the papers today anyway.

Did Blair and Mandelson envisage this when they signed up for European Community rules on immigration and refugees? Or did they cynically not care because it meant cheap labour, cheap votes, increased profits (via membership of the European Community).

Did the architects of this policy not consider how it would affect housing, jobs and education and the resulting massive investment needed there, and the over-crowded population we have already.

I believe we have never been consulted or told anything honestly about what the consequences of EC membership was immigration-wise, if indeed there was ever any plan (doesn't seem to be, just a kind of opportunistic carpetbaggers philosophy approach of selling England by the pound).

I feel deceived and hoodwinked really. But are there any more positive thoughts on this? I find it v. depressing.

because people read and believe shite Captain. Shite that is not backed up by fact at all.

Maybe you should save yourself and us and move abroad OP.

I admit I am not reading this whole thread as it would probably be a right wind up. However, please read this www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24813467 which shows that immigration has a net benefit to the Uk economy.

I often find that those who shout the loudest diehard daily fail readers about immigrants nicking our jobs etc are the ones whose DP/DF/DD work abroad. But that's Ok isn't it? Totally different!!

Hmm. CaptainTripps. I wonder. Why do you think it does?

Mylovelyboy it wouldn't change my mind at all. ClarityJane why do you keep mentioning the last 10-20years. As if Immigration didn't exist before then.

And thanks OHuge, for at least a bit of interesting input on this discussion, like an oasis in the desert.

On that note, I also find it interesting to see the Little People's concerns i.e. most ordinary people (a traditional left-wing focus) real worries about level of immigration, being completeley and summarily dismissed out-of-hand. Its almost like there's no connection between ordinary people and the left-wing that are meant to represent them. So, maybe their support will go to populist movements.

On the DM and the media, they do indeed shape people's views. But it works the other way around too. I think people have been very patronising to ordinary people who really do see whats going around them, but in actual fact, the media takes years to catch up with reality.

Strumpetron hope you got my reply amongst this. Wasn't aimed at you was just playing the Bingo Card game. :)

Mylovelyboy & Clarity

I grew up in one of the roughest parts of Birmingham. Guess who was doing all the drinking/fighting/drug-taking/glue-sniffing/burgling/wife-beating/stabbing? Clue: it wasn't the immigrants.

You say so much yet so little!

What fucks me off is that I work full time. I live in a private rented 1 (yes 1) bedroom flat with my 13 year old ds. (we have to share a bedroom) 2 single beds all squashed. I cannot afford bigger place. I have been to our local council and been placed on the housing register for a council place. I have been told I will be on it for years as there is nothing available. I was fukin born in this country and I cannot get a council place that i am willing to pay rent for out of my wages. Yet this country is full of people who come here, get given council houses and live on benefits. Where is the justice in that.

misspixie sorry yeah I just saw it! Have you got a full house yet

And yet Clarity you don't see nothing patronising about saying "So many non-English voices". You had our attention right up until that post. Also it is not a traditional left wing response. I know plenty on the Right that all share the same view.

You've been given lots of 'positives' about immigration OP. That migrants make a net contribution to the economy, that this isn't an overcrowded island and the tiny amount of land that is built on, what a 'non immigration' country looks like Japan and the problems that entails. That the main 'driver' of poulation growth isn't immigration, but birth and ageing.
But you're not interested, you just wanted a little rant about forriners.
You're taking on board only what you want.
I think this is going to be one of those long and tortuous threads that generates a lot of self-righteous heat, but no insights.
Oh well.
You said it.

BINGO!

Who are these people who come here and get given council houses and benefits? Who? Where are you making this up getting your information from?

My SIL didn't get given anything when she came here. She found herself a room, rented privately, and got herself three jobs. And her room was in a fucking awful house.

Mylovelyboy please look up the term "No Recourse to Public Funds". Seriously.

JaquelineHyde . Is that a full house now?

this country is full of people who come here, get given council houses and live on benefits

Source?

Being a immigrant does not give you any housing priority. Go and look at your local council's housing points system and show me where being an immigrant pushes you up the list? You won't be able to because it doesn't exist.

But Heartbroken, that's not really the point is it? I didn't say immigrants were criminals, I think its conflating two separate things.

Yet this country is full of people who come here, get given council houses and live on benefits.

can you provide a link to back that statement up please?

My card is indeed full, I was just waiting for the immigrants and council houses fact and the I was born here claim!

oh, x posts with lots of others, sorry.

"Yet this country is full of people who come here, get given council houses and live on benefits. Where is the justice in that."

No, it absolutely isn't. The vast majority of immigrants over the last 12 years are LESS likely than native borns to be on benefits, or live in council housing.