to think that appearance shouldn't matter?

[JollyStoutGiant]

If you're looking to have a business relationship with someone surely you should simply require them to be good at their job. They don't need to have dry hair, make up on, a nice bag. Presumably the more time they spend on their appearance the less they spend on doing the job you require them to do.

Similarly if you're looking for someone to have an emotional relationship with. You need to get on with them. Surely whether or not they've ironed their t-shirt shouldn't be a consideration?

Why is it the case that humans, often, try to find someone who spends time on their appearance? Even on MN where there are so many feminist viewpoints the majority of posters still expect professional colleagues to look like they've made an effort.

I don't understand why these things are important.

To me, paying attention to your appearance is a sign of respect. To yourself and to others. I wouldn't be happy employing someone who neglected their appearance.

.... Completely disgraceful.

Really, do you think it would be acceptable for a university to give preference to slim candidates because the fat teenagers might be a bit lazy... Or decide that the applicants who smoke will probably get poorer exam results.

Or would that be absolute nonsense?

Your husband sounds like an ignorant, discriminatory recruiter. I may as well say that I refuse to hire people who sunbathevbecause they are risk takers with no respect for their skin.. Or refuse to hire tall women who wear heels because they obviously want to look down on their clients.

Or some other mad rubbish

I think wet hair just makes you look as if you are unorganised. But only if you turn up to something official. It looks as if you got up too late to dry it.

But that logic ONLY applies if your starting point is that everyone SHOULD have dry hair and that everyone acknowledges this fact (ergo the only conceivable reason that they don't is that they were too disorganised to do it). And that, as far as I can see, is a bizarre, illogical and arbitrary starting point. If I was to turn up with wet hair to something, why could it not simply signal that I don't want to blow dry it, not that I'm disorganised?!

It's such a random, unfounded judgment.

I like being well-dressed because it intimidates people. That's an important part of my job and it's not as if I can go around physically threatening them.

Hair is dry in its natural state. It's wet when it's being washed. So it's not that bizarre or illogical to expect people to come to work with dry hair.

I wouldn't want to attend a business meeting with wet hair because I don't think it creates the right impression socially. Like it or not, people will judge you for that before you're given the chance to show them how great your technical skills are. Friends house for a DVD night - doesn't matter. School run - doesn't matter. Business meeting/job interview - does matter.

Like others have said OP, no-one's forcing you or anyone else into anything, but just accept that this isn't something trivial that will go away because you don't happen to like it - it's part of us as human beings and was happening long before you were around... it's been happening since clothes, razors, scissors, etc were invented. It's nothing new. And I doubt you do your clothes shopping blindfolded, so you will place some value on appearances, however much you think you don't...

you might prefer NOT to wear a top but you would still look as if you forgot to put one on. Bare feet, a dirty face, your arse hanging out of a hole in your trousers. All valid choices to make but they would all be taken in pretty much the same way.

All of these have various much more valid practical or social reasons for being frowned upon (ideas of modesty/decency, hygeine/smelliness, and safety). Hair drying doesn't have anything to do with any of these.

People tend to dry their hair for mainly practical reasons so therefore if you leave the house with wet hair it is perfectly reasonable to assume you have done so because you didn't have time to dry it.

a) I dry my hair in winter for practical reasons (too cold to go out with wet hair. Why would it be perfectly reasonable for you to assume in the summer that the only reason I haven't dried it is lack of time? When it's actually because there's no reason on this earth I can think of why I would want to blow dry my hair in summer?
b) That's not the assumption that most people on here seem to be making. Most people who have expressed a dislike for wet hair seem to have some unfathomable personal dislike for it, and think it a social faux pas, rather than just a simple assumption that everyone chooses to do it for practical reasons.

Wet hair is okay in my office if you've no meetings. Most people would tie it back if long though and it would be damp, not dripping. You wouldn't walk into a new meeting with a senior manager or an external client with soaking wet hair though: it can't count for you really and could count against your overall presentation.

Appearance does matter where I work. In management appearing to do the job well is pretty important. Actually doing it well is obviously important, but given two managers with little between them in terms of performance, the one who has better presence, appears more organised & put together etc. will usually win out. Some of that is outwith our control, but looking reasonably well groomed is not.

Of course people do have different ideas of what constitutes well groomed. FWIW I don't expect masses of make-up, nail varnish, fashionable clothes. I do expect clean, no snaggy nails / mad hair and clothing appropriate for an office.

I wouldn't assume it was because of lack of time. I would assume it was laziness e.g staying in bed longer rather than drying your hair or you just didn't care about looking tidy and professional at work i.e work wasn't a good enough reason to whack your hair dryer on for five minutes.

It's interesting that your idea of valid social reasons include modesty, hygiene, decency etc. Are you not prepared to consider that another valid social reason to do something is professionalism?

I work in a professional job and think that making the effort to look smart and presentable with nicely ironed clothes is really important. (In and out of work). Im not saying you should be done up like a dogs dinner every day of the week, but its all about having some self respect and a bit of pride. You do not have to have designer clothes/handbags to look presentable either. If I was having a meeting with someone who turned up looking like a crumpled old tramp with wet hair I would not be impressed. Don't think most people would either. Also, I think Fromparistoberlin has a very good point.

MrsD

same here.

we do have a hairdryer somewhere - I use it probably twice a year, only in the winter, when say baby is sick in my hair so I have to wash my hair before doing school run....

it's actually MrZing's, he had it for decades. I never bought one.

Respecting yourself, being organised and doing a good job aren't connected to appearance at all. Professor Mary Beard (who I think looks fine, but has been criticised for her appearance) or Barbie? I know who I'd rather work with.

Since when was someone else's attitude towards their own appearance some kind of message to you? It's not about you. At all.

Spot on woozlebear.

Why would you go out with wet hair, especially in the winter.
Surely it make you more cold, I shiver just thinking about it.
You'll catch your death you know

I used to work with a woman who was really rather minging. Unwashed hair, scruffy un-ironed clothes. Tatty un-polished shoes. Just really tatty looking. (No effort whatsoever) Everyone used to comment on it. I personally think she had no self respect or pride in herself.

The phrase "making an effort" always comes up on threads like these, as if simply being clean and ordinary-looking isn't good enough.

I'd rather people made the effort to challenge their own prejudices about what others look like.

Blow-drying my hair actually makes it worse!

So for some of us it's not just a case of 'whacking on a hair dryer for 5 minutes'. We're not all Nicky Clarke

The phrase "making an effort" always comes up on threads like these, as if simply being clean and ordinary-looking isn't good enough.

Thank you Coupon - you speak so much sense (and so succinctly too!).

Why does making an effort mean hair-do, make-up, etc? I'm clean, my clothes are clean, I don't smell. Why do I need to jump through further hoops?

Just googled Mary Beard images. Was expecting something horrendous. She dresses really nice and smart. Very presentable. Her hair looks very clean as well. I would be more than happy to work/have a meeting with her.

MrsDeVere you are totally right.

MrsD - it's all the comments on here about how quick and easy it is to do your hair that are irritating me. I've never been able to do my hair. My ex actually used to say that there was something wrong with me because 'all girls can do their hair'. My Mum's the same.

My hair is hateful. It's really thick, wavy/frizzy, I have a kink in my fringe and I'm all fingers and thumbs with straighteners/hairdryers, etc. I don't like the fact that some people think it's just a quick blowdry. For me, if I take a hairdryer to my hair, I end up looking like a lion (to use DDs phrase), which then has to be tamed with straighteners. This is a long, drawn-out, stressful episode for me.

I'm just pointing out that it's not just 'a quick 5 mins' for some people.