to be getting really fed up with this? Thoughts, please.

[friendslikethese]

We live in a terraced house. When I sit in the garden, I can see next door's garden clearly.

My next door neighbour is also a friend and has two little girls. The youngest is 5 years old.

We have a dog (chocolate Labrador) who is completely harmless. He does the occasional "woof!" in joy when the door first opens and he has freedom that is it - one bark, he isn't a "noisy" dog in the slightest.

However the youngest of the girls hates him - OK, can live with that. But I can't live with:

• Screaming hysterically when he is in our garden and she is in hers; crying, yelling, howling.

• Screaming hysterically if he's going for his evening walk and they are going in/out of the house at the same time.

• Screaming hysterically when she was around here one evening with her parents and sister. Dog was banished to the kitchen but on one occasion someone left the door ajar when they used the downstairs loo and he stuck his head round. Scream, scream, scream.

I broached it with my neighbour, nicely, and tried to explain that it is pretty unpleasant (I didn't use those words) - she just got defensive and said her DD wouldn't change, she has "always been scared of dogs" and for her, children come before animals.

Am I really being SO unreasonable though? Surely he's got a right to go for his walk in the evenings (he is on a lead by the way) or have a roll in the garden without being screamed at?

Im with you on this thornrose.

Whether the parents caused or enable the fear in this child, the chikd fears the dog.

If the OP had come to say her DH was agraphobic and shes really fed up and had enough of his panic and crying when it came to leaving the house to see the doctor etc would people really suggest to him to 'stop screaming' or 'have a word'.

Far, far too often on mumsnet I see some peoples fears sympathised with and some peoples fears totally poo pooed.

It doesnt matter if a dog bite or her dad caused the fear, thinking that a simple as of 'stop screaming' will work is ridiculous.

I agree OP that if a child of mine was getting so upset, anxious and traumatised by something they could encounter every single day, I would be seeking professional help.

You can't go around letting a child become so upset. It's up to the parent to do something.

YANBU. If she's that scared, then she can go indoors eh?

I would make no concessions TBH. You have him on a lead, you are keeping him in the garden, you aren't letting him jump all over her.

Your neighbours sound incredibly precious. She doesn't need to scream. There is a screamy child in my family, she's not indulged, she gets taken away from whatever she is doing until she desists.

Evie, we HAVEN'T bloody well done anything wrong!

Walked outside the door? How COULD we do anything wrong with that?

If my daughter screams at the neighbours when she is 5, I will deal with it, trust me.

And I do get a bit offended when my dog is referred to as "nasty" "smelly" and "bitey" when he isn't. OK, he stinks a bit sometimes

TwoSteps, that wouldn't work - see my post when she was round and he stuck his head round the door.

It's not bad parenting to 'let' a child become o frightened. But it is the parents responsibility to help a child get help to get over the phobia.

Sorry that post made no sense. .
I meant the parent should seek help for their child.

And this is where I am going to get beaten into the ground but here goes:

But I am not going to not have a pet because some people have an irrational fear

Actually if that someone were the daughter of a person whom I call a friend and to whom I live next door friend and neighbour I might consider it (especially if I were 'just SICK of it' but then I am one of those lunatics who do put people before animals.

excusetypos I totally agree with that. Absolutely.

But the OP is being U, if she thinks her having a word would help.

You are walking a dog, not a ravenous lion

This reminds me of singing kettle (?) song from my childhood:

Whenever people see me, they shout "LION"
But I've never telled a lie in all my life!

Evie, we HAVEN'T bloody well done anything wrong!

Well you're certainly getting very angry and I'm wondering if the little girl has picked up on it, but in fact I didn't say you had done anything wrong, just that your attitude seemed to think you were unquestionably in the right. Do you disagree with that?

If my daughter screams at the neighbours when she is 5, I will deal with it, trust me

Well I hope so, but I think Thorn's heartbreaking situation indicates that we don't always get exactly what we expect exactly when we expect to get it.

My ds friends are scared of dogs, the youngest screams if my dog so much as blinks. They are now banned from our house and garden as I can't be bothered with it.

Just ignore her screams and carry on with walks/garden, it really shouldn't affect you other than the noise. Not really your problem.

It's pretty hard to get over a phobia, many people have them for life. How many adults scream at mice or spiders?

It can't be nice seeing a 5 yr old so distressed either.

Tge parents arent going to do anything, is she a young 5? Maybe your dog could send her a letter and a present (a book about dogs), explaining that he would never hurt her and he just wants to be friends?

But none of what I have said should be taken to indicate that I don't sympathise with the dilemma of Friends...just that I think that the neighbours are probably having a far harder time of it and that circumstances are as much outside of their control as the OP feels they are out her hers IYSWIM

Maybe your dog could send her a letter and a present (a book about dogs), explaining that he would never hurt her and he just wants to be friends?

I seriously think this is lovely and must be worth a try!

Evie, all right, you would. We didn't live here when we got the dog actually but that is largely by-the-by.

When I first went to the doctor due to being unable to conceive I was given the brush-off. Eighteen months later and pretty desperate (mid 30s) we started the first cycle of IVF.

The reason my husband and I survived is largely because of the dog. He's brought us nothing but joy - can't say the same for people. He isn't a puppy, he was bought from a rehoming centre as his original owner went into a nursing home. Very calm, gentle dog.

He means a great deal to me. Walking him allowed me space to think my thoughts and to feel calmer and more sorted about everything. IVF wasn't the only difficulty - close family bereavement and a horrible work issue as well as that, I really thought I was going to break down completely sometimes. I put that down to him.

Now bear in mind I have been politely tolerating being screamed at for well over a year now. It's become worse lately as I am back at work after maternity leave so it's now impacting on my daughter, who is a human. She doesn't like being screamed at either, and it is upsetting everybody. I do not feel my dog is the issue here.

Ah binger let's hope none of your dc ever develop an irrational, inconvenient phobia.

Having had a child with an unexplained phobia of dogs I have to say that the majority of my sympathies are with yor ndn tbh.

I understand that he is your pet, but your attitude is not coming across as very sympathetic to a child who is clearly terrified. My son was terrified of dogs (and cats actually. A problem only discovered when we got a kitten!). I could not stop him being scared or reacting when we saw dogs in the street. However, over time he got over it in his own time.

He is now still cautious, but would be able to tolerate a dog in his near vicinity much better. He is fine with cats now (except one of ours who sits on the bottom step and pounces on anyone who walks past!).

Reacting badly/ taking offence at her reactions is only likely to prolong the phobia for all involved.

Evie - I am angry, because I wanted to enjoy my weekend (first one back after ML) with my dog and daughter. Yesterday we were going to have a lovely walk in the woods. Instead, I spent the walk to the woods shushing DD and the dog was decidedly subdued.

This morning the door was open and dog went snuffling off into the garden. Scream, scream, scream.

Then dog goes to go on his evening walk ... no sign of neighbours ... I come back and they are getting out of the car and SCREEEAAAAMMM.

I can't put into words how infuriating it is, I feel trapped in my house!

We have tried "look at the nice doggy, here is a letter from the doggy." The doggy even buys her Christmas and birthday presents.

I tolerated it, to a point, when we first got the dog but now I've reached that stage where it is just driving me absolutely crazy! That's the "anger" - I'm just so frustrated. It's a lovely evening and I'd like to take him out to the canal and have a drink at the pub but feel I can't as they are outside!

"Putting people before animals" ought to include getting people (of whatever age) help to overcome phobias that are having a serious effect on them.

My middle child was terrified of dogs and certainly to begin with would have done hysterical screaming. It took a good couple of years for us to work through it with her, but now she's five and (finally!) doesn't have an issue with dogs at all.

Giving up and deciding that a child "won't change", and reinforcing her fears with your actions and the language you use, is not doing that child any favours. It's certainly not putting her first.

I would have virtually killed to have a nice friendly dog living next door when we were trying to get DD used to dogs. We had to make do with relatives' dogs who lived several hours away.

I don't think there's anything the OP can do about this situation, though. The neighbours don't appear to want to help their DD.

Yes I really understand that your dog is important to you, and that's lovely and I wouldn't really suggest that you rehome him..as you say, I possibly would, you wouldn't and your reaction is every bit as valid as mine.

But clearly you and he are part of the issue (which is not the same thing as its being your fault) , just as much as the little girl next door and her parents, and the sooner you acknowledge that the sooner a solution will be found.

They should at the very least tell her not to scream. If she's afraid, fine, fair enough, she can go inside and be removed from the situation. But she is certainly old enough to be told to be quieter particularly when her noise is disturbing other people. They are being unreasonable by not doing anything to deal with the situation.

But solutions can only come from her parents - I can't enforce anything, other than rehoming the dog, which isn't going to happen.

I really think, judging from the posts on here, we're going to seriously have to look at moving, which seems extreme but I am so hacked off and fed up with this!

how many of these 'phobias' are actually real phobias tho.....seems quite fashionable these days to have a spider 'phobia'....i'm sure some people really do have phobias. its a word bandied around too easily imo,like 'depression' and ptsd...they lose meaning and impact when everyone jumps on the bandwagon

the parents brought her round to your house op? now wold someone with a child with a true phobia do that? I mean,WHY would they do that? they know the dog would be there.....

I developed a severe phobia of an everday object as a child. Rather than expecting the rest of the world to acommodate it, my family arranged for me to see a child psychiatrist. Free on the NHS.

OP, YANBU.