Re FIL sharing a bed with my DC?

[LoppLopp]

I'm a regular NC for confidentiality.

Here is a bit of background so as not to drip feed:
My PIL are lovely people. I have known them for many years and am as sure as a person can be that they love my DC and would not intentionally harm them. They have just had my DC to stay for the weekend, to share some happy times and give me and DH some time alone which we rarely get and really appreciate. They have fed them, played with them, even washed their clothes. The boys have returned happy and safe.

During their stay, it turns out that DS2 (5) slept the whole time in FIL's bed - i.e. they put him to bed there and when FIL went to bed he stayed all night. DS3 (3) slept on the floor in the same room. DS1 (8) slept in another room in a double bed alone, with a spare bed in the same room - so there would have been plenty of space for his brothers to share with him.

I feel slightly uncomfortable about this. It just doesn't feel right. I wouldn't have wanted to share a bed with my grandfather, and I wouldn't want my own father (or mother) to share a bed with my DC either. AIBU to feel this way? WWYD about saying something?

I also have another concern. They all went out today to a farm park type place. Whilst they were there, MIL let all three of them go into the Men's toilets alone, without an adult. When they were in there on their own DS3 needed a poo, so DS1 left his brothers in there to go and tell MIL that he needed a bottom wipe.

I don't feel that a 3 and 5 y.o. are old enough to go alone yet. Apart from the obvious that DS3 can't wipe his own bottom yet, I'm not convinced public urinals are clean or that they'll wash their hands, and in the unlikely event that they met a 'nasty man' or even an older boy who was mean to them, they wouldn't know what to do. It just seems a bit short sighted of MIL to let them do this.

I really need to know if others would feel the same way I do, in which case I need to think very carefully about how to talk to my PIL about this without offending them.

A poster has recently said ''We as a society see danger everywhere sometimes in the most innocent situations''.

When i was a kid it all Stranger Danger!

Now we are learning that children are more likely to be abused by family members or close friends. In seemingly innocent situations. For some it's tricky to acknowledge this information and know what to do with it. Perhaps this is why society is becoming more suspicious of each other? I don't know.

Anyway - back to the OP. The OP is not saying ''i think FIL is a paedophile''. She is expressing a discomfort with something.

It's nice to post and say how wonderful your own family are and how you slept with your GPs and how happy you are with your DCs to sleep with theirs, to give the OP some perspective ... but don't use it as a stick to beat her with. It's not fair.

If someone posts about concerns about their husband we don't see a million posts saying ''i have a wonderful marriage - what's wrong with you!?'' - it doesn't help.

Personally i have no experience of sleeping with GPs all night. I had my own bed when i stayed over, and if i wanted to get in with my nan for a book read or a game in the morning i would. I would be a bit funny about my DCs spending the whole night in with a GP. Especially if there were spare beds.

Different kettle of fish if the child has got in with GP during the night or in the morning.

Uncomfortable with posters saying ''you cant say or do anything. It would break their hearts''.

You can't go around not saying anything or doing anything about something you're uncomfy about in case you upset someone.

Having said I found this thread a bit surprising, I retract my comment. I can see why bed sharing is odd to people who are not comfortable with that level of physical contact. My family expresses love with lots of physical affection but I know plenty of families who are equally loving but show it in different ways.

I can't see why grandmother being elsewhere is odd- OP said there was a good reason. Are we really saying that men on their own will abuse and they must have their wife there to keep them in check?
8yr old don't generally share beds, 5yr old and 3yr olds do. He wasn't on the floor- he had a mattress.
Either OP trusts him or she doesn't and shouldn't leave them. Parents can't control when they are not there, although a lot don't seem to realise this.

What's odd about the grandmother not being there? Are grandfathers not capable of looking after children?

Given mil was away it sounds like grandad did what he thought was easiest, eight year old fine to be on their own ams then can read etc, and little two who may wake up, need a wee etc in with him, plus it eliminated the possibility of them playing up at bedtime.

I would imagine if the kids and said they didn't want to sleep there grandad would have arranged things differently, but the excitement of being at grandparents and bunking in together was probably fun.

I dont see it as overstepping boundaries, it seems like a grandparent doing what he thought was practical.

Quite sad that some posters would stop overnight stays due to this.

If the children were being forced to sleep there or expressing they didtn like it then fie say something or change arrangements but the op says kids didn't mind.

I think the sleeping arrangements are odd. Why bed share if you don't have to? Planning to bed share without a good reason (and I would include the child wanting to as a good reason) is strange.

It is also completely different to getting into grandparents bed for a snuggle in the morning because that is child led. Actually that's hit the nail on the head about what's weird: an adult led activity that has no obvious benefits for the children. I am assuming from the comments about the dh this was not how he was raised.

We bed share in this house because the children want to be in our bed and won't sleep alone (the 4yo goes to bed in his bed but comes in about 6ish) and the choice is that or no sleep. But I cannot for the life of me think why you would do this if the children would sleep elsewhere and don't actively want to sleep with you?

Yanbu re the toilet thing.

I don't think he's a paedo. But I'm puzzled why one kid slept on the floor instead of in the bed.

And I would ask, in a very nice, polite, way

"Why did ds2 end up on the floor instead of in the spare bed?"

And probably everything would become clear from there.

I wouldn't be afraid to ask an innocent question such as this for fear that he might think, that I think he's a paedo!!! WTF?!

Only odd in that you'd think GM would want to be there-to put the GC to bed & get up with them the next morning-not that she needed to be there!

Obviously something else was more important.

Op said grandma had a good reason for needing to be at friends, she was there to take them out to farm etc.

My dad often comes and visits on his own and so does my mum if one of them is busy or vice versa.

When I had ds3 my dad came and stayed overnight to look after ds1 and ds2, my mum stayed at home as it was just before Xmas and she had stuff to do. Ditto when my boys have visited their house, sometimes both my parents are there other times' one may not be.

Grandfather are just a capable of doing a bedtime routine and getting them up in the morning! It isn't a woman thing. If she had to be elsewhere I can quite see why she wouldn't want to do either- not when it was being taken care of quite adequately.

There are actually more important things than bedtime routines when you are not necessary for them!

'Obviously something else was more important.' diddl

Sometimes my boys go to their grandparents and it is only the one.

They have own lives and are often babysitting so we can do something. As long as there is a responsible adult there it doesn't matter.

If I had even the tiniest inkling that their grandfather was not 100% trustworthy then I wouldn't leave them with him no matter what and sleeping arrangements then wouldn't matter.

*I don't think any member of my family is a pedophile and I love them very much

But if I found out that any of my children had shared a bed with any one of them,over nights would stop.*

Why would you deprive your children and your in-laws of spending time together because they happen to share a bed with them sometimes? Sometimes, children want to feel safety and comfort by sharing a bed with a close relative they love and adore. As I mentioned in my previous post, my in-laws have all 7 of their grandchildren staying with them at their summer house for 2 weeks every summer. Yes, the children go to the house every summer and we've spend Christmas there many times and we celebrated my family occasions, BUT their beds there are NOT their everyday beds. They love the house, but it's not THEIR house. Therefore, they may feel insecure especially during night. All 7 cousins sleep in a big room and sometimes when the younger ones, who are 2, 3 and 4 are afraid they wake up and go and sleep with my in-laws at their bed or with their older cousins at their bed! There is nothing wrong with that!!

Would I ever consider not allowing my son to go to the house every summer and spend time with his cousins and grandparents? NEVER!

I don't see the problem with this. My son spends alot of time with my parents and always ends up in their bed in the morning.

He has also slept in the same bed as both my parents separately when he has managed to convince them, so the other is left in a single bed.

He see sharing a bed as a treat as he thinks that sleeping on his own is very unfair.

I love and trust my parents and in laws but I wouldn't want my DSs sharing a bed with them - much as I wouldn't share a bed with my parents, or shower with them in the room - it's private and we are just not that kind of family!

Doesn't mean anything is wrong with anyone, just that we are a bit keen on personal space.

Obviously if a DC was ill or scared in the night I would expect them to be comforted and as a last resort brought into bed, but I wouldn't expect it as the norm.

Some parents are going to have trouble explaining things to adult children- as in 'you couldn't stay over night with grandad because you shared his bed aged 5yrs'!
Either grandparents are trustworthy or they are not - it is a weird situation where you can leave them for a day but not overnight.

That is OK if you are keen on personal space Ozzie- maybe someone else's DCs are not. Your own DCs don't automatically feel like you.

Grandparents, believe it or not often have something more important than bedtime- they may even like an excuse to miss it! My mother found it exhausting.

Is this how your Dh and his siblings were brought up? Sating a bed with each other and their parenst? Surely that the key question? If so, why hasn't he explained that to you. And you as a couple need to decide if you are ok with that happening with your children too.

If not , you or your Dh need to politely explain this to them. Eg " we find the boys sleep better when they are all in the same room together, so next time we d prefer it if they shared the spare room "

If it Wasn't how he was brought up or it W AS and he is uncomfortable with it, then that's a different matter and you ave more serious issues to deal with

I am putting this is a separate post just to make it clear that's it's not connected to my previous post, but is rather a point of information in response to other people's posts on this thread ( not the OP)

Sadly, " lovely " people sexually abuse children . Most children are abused by someone known to them, a freinds, family member, youth group leader, neighbour. It's rare for children to be abducted off the street and abused by strangers

Some adults who have been sexually abused by a adult will then, when they because parenst, allow their children to contact with the abuser. they do this because they mistakenly belive that it won't happen again.

Some believe that it was their fault in some way, they led the person on. Often they are ashamed, especially boys and girls who were teenagers, they believe they shouldl have been able to stop it. Or they persuade themselves that it wasn't so bad, perhaps it was innocent and they just misinterpreted it.

Or the abuser did it when circumstances were different eg its when he used to drink /take drugs/was single/ my mum wouldn't give him sex. Or they believe the person only abuses children of one sex. Or that they have "learned their lesson " . Or that they are old now and it was a long time ago. Or that to stop contact woudl cause too much upset to others . Or that they can supervise contact in some way that will keep their children safe

Sometimes it was another family member who was abused, eg a sibling or a cousin, and the family decided not to believe him/her.

If you are reading this and it applies to you or your partner -please hear this. It is NEVER EVER the fault of the child. Whatever you said, did, however your body reacted, it is not your fault . It is 100% the responsibility of the adult .

It it NOT safe to let the abuser have any contact with your children. You can't control them and make it safe. Whether they are old, frail, clean, sober, sorry etc is irrelevant. It's your job as a parent to protect them. This is more imprtant that upsetting anyone in your family.

There is profesional help available for adult survivors of child sexual abuse and I urge you to seek that out.

Thank you OP for letting me put this on your thread. I truly hope that it has nothing to do with you and your situation. But there were too many myths about abuse being perpetrated on this thread, I couldn't let them go without comment and perhaps expose another child to danger .

The OP was worried about 'Nasty men' in public toilets and family child abuse.

So what do you make of that?

Angela.

Because in my family grandparents are not close family members they are extended family no different to any other extended family member you see a couple of times a year.

If any of my children did not feel compleatly secure enough to be sleeping in a bed alone there they would not be staying without a parent but that's mainly due to the practicalities of visits and knowledge that the gp's would be disturbed.

There is a whole heap of difference between child led bed sharing and adult led.

I wouldn't need to deprive my children of a visit because they do not bed hop so it would not be something that happened but the op is talking about a adult led situation and that is what would make me uncomfortable.

I also made it perfectly clear it would not be confined to just in laws I feel exactly the same way about my family. If there are problems respecting boundaries then they will not be placed in a situation where it would be likely to happen. Over nights are not essential for a good visit or good relationship.

My family is just different to yours different things are important to us it does not make it sad.

Mammatj and others!! I think part of the concern here was exactly that it was GF who chose where boys slept. they had no choice - it was not a case of excited gc creeping in for a cuddle. That Is child led and completely not this situation

Just another one adding my experience of having shared a bed with my grandparents. I also had my own bed in their house, but slept in between them.
I vaguely remember my grandfather getting of those automatic beds that sat you up (like a hospital bed, but it seemed very exciting at the time) and my brothers and I piling in with them to test it out, and that turning into staying there for the night.
My exMIL also used to joke about getting her children to buy her John Lewis vouchers for christmas so she could buy a bigger bed, because whenever the grandchildren stayed, they would all end up in bed with her and exFIL until one of them caved and moved to the children's room.
So no, I wouldn't find anything even remotely strange about it. Equally, when EXH's nieces and nephews stayed with us, we would normally end up with one of them in bed with us. I think that is just what families do?

spare I don't think anyone disagrees with you it is the same in many families , mine included and I said before \I shared a bed with my 8yr old gs on Saturday, but it was because he came to me.
The discomfort for OP was that gf had arranged where they all slept with no choice