To state that suicide is NOT a selfish act ?

[Coffeenowplease]

Really riled by this. People who commit suicide are ill and by the nature of their illness cannot think rationally so therefore cannot be "selfish" and think of the damage it causes to others.

I am so angry by this I had to make a post just to get it out.

Feel free to discuss.

Yabu, it is a selfish act although perhaps not intentionally.

When my mum attempted I thought she was selfish. She was leaving 5 children aged 15 to 3 behind. I was 15 and looking after my dad and 4 siblings while trying to get on at school while she was sectioned. To me that was selfish, I shouldn't have had to become a parent figure to my siblings and keep my dad together.

Now I am 22 I understand more and how she was ill. I still dont fully understand why she attempted and probably never will.

Dunno really, what if someone with no history of mental health issues suddenly takes their own life just before their dd's wedding thereby ruining the occasion? I think the impossibility of understanding unexpected suicide makes it very difficult to accept it as a mental illness and thereby excuse it as such. But you know it's a very difficult and sensitive subject.

Not everyone who commits suicide is ill- they just see it as the only option. In thoses circumstances it's not an illness and it is selfish.

YANBU.

I can see your point, and it is a very complicated area however by its very nature even though not intentionally it is selfish the people who are left behind are left to deal with the lose and often whatever caused the suicide in the first place.

It is selfish, but they cannot be blamed for that because, as you say, they're not in proper control of their actions. There is a medical reason for the selfish behaviour.

In the same way, if someone with a mental illness or personality altering brain tumour attacks someone, it is a violent and horrible act, but if they're not in control of their actions they can't be held responsible. Doesn't make it any less violent or horrible though.

As someone who has been suicidal (never made an attempt), I think suicide is undoubtedly a selfish act; it is the background to the selfishness which might call for compassion and sympathy.

I think the loved ones of someone who kills themselves need to be able to feel anger at the person alongside - indeed as part of - their grief.

i think you are right. Suicide is a manifestation of illness and selfish is the wrong term but problem is that it is so final. Those left behind searching for a reason when often there is none other than the illness itself. Selfish is an easy way to bracket the anger and hurt they feel and which will never be resolved.

What is it then if it is not the ultimate selfish act? Please explain.

Yabu - it is selfish. They may be ill, but it is selfish. And tragic.

Of course suiside is selfish.By killing yourself you are only thinking of yourself.Just because your ill DOSN'T make you not selfish.

It is selfish, but not in a malicious way. Anyone who reaches that point is not thinking clearly and of course they shouldn't be blamed or judged, but yes it's by it's very nature a selfish thing to do (then again aren't we all selfish in one way or another?)

i do get what your saying but also feel it is somewhat selfish (basically sitting on the fence)

though anybody thinking of it /done it must be/been in a very terrible place and im sure at the time it seemed the only option

It isn't selfish, it seems like it is the right thing to do for everyone around you who will be better off when you are dead.

It's not intended to be selfish.

Sometimes if you are extremely depressed and feel worthless you actually rationalise you would be doing your dc and family a service by ridding them of your existence.

Yep, experience of that thought pattern. Unfortunately.

I just want to make clear -Im not in anyway saying it isnt awful for the family/people it affects but that as it is caused by illness likeoutraged said if it was caused by dementia or a tumour its not the fault of the person which equals not a selfish act.

Some may be, some may not be. We'll never know and can only speculate.

it can be a selfish act sometimes tbh. so YABU.

mostly I would say it's the act of someone who has lost all hope but there are times when people do it to hurt others.

My DM made several attempts at ending her life while we were kids, that sort of thing changes who you are. Forever. I absolutely believe it to have been extremely selfish, but that's probably because it's close to home ... It still makes me angry with her and not sympathetic, just how I feel.
It's also too simplistic to say every person is not of sound mind, how do we really know ??

coffee

That isn't how it works.

And not all people who kill themselves are mentally ill.

its hard, with the cases currently in the news who are trying to get assisted suicide legalised - at the end of a long painful debilatating condition YANBU, however in case of my exbf father YABU - completely so - my ex and his sister were abandoned in their early teens by their primary care giver with no explanation, no note, many questions and no answers.
How on earth do you get over that?! ex was so angry, so hurt - absolutely devasted - not even a note. I wouldn't wish that on anyone let alone the people i loved.

How can we know that they aren't of sound mind ? Those people that kill themselves but arent mentally ill ? We dont really.

Not every suicide is because off natal illness though...