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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To refuse to allow my 12 yo DD to travel unaccompanied?

280 replies

ItsDecisionTime · 29/05/2013 21:27

As part of a pending contact order, ExP who lives in the USA, is asking that our 12 year old DD travels as an unaccompanied minor on her flights from the UK to US (to save him the time and cost of collecting her). It goes against all my parenting instincts on the basis that if anything had to happen on those flights, it would be everyone for themselves. I know people do allow their kids to travel alone but for me, that's just lazy parenting and something I'd only consider in an absolute emergency. She has only just started going into our town on her own but only when she is with a friend. Personally, I can't even contemplate what kind of father would even push for it in court when he knows I'm so set against it.

OP posts:
olgaga · 30/05/2013 00:09

It's a hell of a long way to go and visit someone you hardly know. How long is the visit for?

I'd be seriously thinking of taking my holiday in the US at the same time, travelling there and back with her!

SeaweedAndSandDunes · 30/05/2013 00:14

YANBU. You shouldn't give a toss what other people would do, or how safe it may or may not be. If my DD was in tears about going on a plane she would not be going, end of. Especially alone to a dad who clearly doesn't give a toss about her to push this against her wishes anyway.

He should come to see her if she doesn't want to travel, where on earth has all this "the child must travel" rubbish come from. Contact is meant to be for the child's benefit not the adults convenience.

Even if he does get a court order, how on earth is he expecting a 12 year old to be manhandled onto a plane she doesn't want to go on.

olgaga · 30/05/2013 00:20

It sounds to me more like the ex punishing the OP and DD than the OP punishing the ex!

marcopront · 30/05/2013 00:20

OP, if you are still here would you be willing to explain why you think letting a child fly "unaccompanied" is so wrong, given that the reality is it means unaccompanied by family. Maybe someone can help you alay those fears.

If the problem is more about her relationship with her father, then that is a different issue. Does she talk to him? My DD's dad is in a different country to use and we use Skype as a means of communication, so she can "see" him. Maybe start a new thread about that issue.

goodasgold · 30/05/2013 00:31

Olgaga I agree, is there a reason that he can't visit dd and stay near you for at least a couple of days. UM flying usually costs a bit more, he could probably get somewhere to stay and see dd on her own grounds. I think that would be better for dd in these circumstances. My dd flew UM to attend her best friends birthday party, not to see some relative that hadn't bothered with her for the past six years.

Original poster
ItsDecisionTime · 30/05/2013 03:02

Thank you TheDetective and Charlie, you echo my thoughts exactly. I was beginning to think I had two swivelling heads! If I left my DD in my own house with someone I didn't know for 9 hours, before I knew it SS would be called and I'd be labelled an unfit parent. Just because some people are happy to hand their children over to strangers in this situation doesn't make it right, it just makes it right for them. I can't see I'll be playing fast and loose with her safety or her feelings on the matter.

OP posts:
MrsTerryPratchett · 30/05/2013 03:12

If I left my DD in my own house with someone I didn't know who is trained, CRB checked, has done this type of childcare hundreds of times and is in public for 9 hours, before I knew it SS would be called and I'd be labelled an unfit parent. I worked for SS. You absolutely wouldn't.

Original poster
ItsDecisionTime · 30/05/2013 03:15

Pratchett - By my exP I would. He's done it before when I had to travel overnight on business and I left dd with my best friend who is a teacher. He did it because HE didn't know her.

OP posts:
goodasgold · 30/05/2013 03:16

Pfff aibu? yes. Well two people say I'm not.

Oh Ok then we'll go with those two rather than the majority.

Why bother?

Original poster
ItsDecisionTime · 30/05/2013 03:20

I think you'll find gold that there are lots of people who feel the same way, these were the latest posts that's all. What I was hoping for was an unbiased opinion on whether it was a reasonable request if I didn't agree with it, not whether other people have done it so it must be right.

OP posts:
TolliverGroat · 30/05/2013 03:20

Um... if you left your DD in your own house for 9 hours with a responsible adult who was qualified and CRB checked and whose job it was to look after her I think it's rather unlikely that SS would be called or that you'd be labelled an unfit parent just because you didn't know them personally.

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/05/2013 03:22

If he called SS over it I hope he was told it wasn't a child protection issue and to stop wasting their time.

FanjolinaJolie · 30/05/2013 03:40

It depends on the child. I don't really have a problem with being an UM at age 12 on an international flight. They group all the children together and the cabin crew look after them well. I understand that they don't have an actually chaperone sitting with them.

My SIL flew her just turned 5 yo as UM on a four hour international flight. I was Shock at that IMO 5 is too young. DN appeared white and stressed on arrival but cheered up quickly when she saw her relatives.

MrRected · 30/05/2013 04:06

You need to separate the two issues.

A child of 12 is perfectly capable of flying. My DS1 who was 12 last week is 6ft tall and would be more than capable of flying overseas on his own.

The issue here is not about the flying, or your ex being lazy, it's about your daughter NOT WANTING to fly/visit with him (perfectly valid). The is the danger of drip feeding is that people don't read the whole thread and miss out on vital information.

You need to talk to your ex about her feelings on this and establish a different visitation pattern. Any reasonable parent, who loves their child, would surely be open to discussion about this, given her concerns?

MrRected · 30/05/2013 04:12

OP - you are just not helping your own cause by labelling anybody who has let their child fly unaccompanied as an unfit parent. Likening it to leaving a child at home for 9 hours unsupervised is just ridiculous.

The reason you are not achieving an outcome on this one, is that you cannot see the wood for the trees. You are getting all het up about your parenting standards. A solid dose of guilt is never a good opening gambit when trying to come up with a solution to a tricky situation. You need to approach this as an adult and stop labelling everybody (namely your ex and many poster on this thread) as unfit. Your DD's father has a right to see his daughter. You should be encouraging it and doing your best to make it work, despite the constraints. Long term, it's in her best interests (unless you have other information to drip feed about his real suitability as a parent).

tiggyhop · 30/05/2013 04:16

Lazy parenting? Thanks. My kids aged 10, 8 and 7 are off to the uk from the us on their own tomorrow. Lazy? No, I just wanted to give my kids to spend longer with their grandparents than I could take time off from work. And have a great experience too.

Fuckwittery · 30/05/2013 04:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DaemonPantalaemon · 30/05/2013 05:12

Just because some people are happy to hand their children over to strangers in this situation doesn't make it right

You are not only unreasonable, you are extremely ignorant to want to judge what is right for every parent in the world based on your own prejudices.

So you don't want your child to fly as UM. Well then, don't let her.

You don't have to make sneering comments about other people's choices simply because you are too lazy or stupid to find out how the UM system actually works. My DC has travelled on his own since the age of 6. His father and I live on two separate continents. That's simply how it is for us. We are not lazy parents, we love each other and our child. Our child loves flying as a UM. It works for us, it is right for us, and you are an idiot to think that we are bad or lazy parents simply because we use a perfectly safe service that airlines offer.

Sort out your issues without being so fucking judgemental about other people.

LittleMissLucy · 30/05/2013 05:15

YABVVU
I took transatlantic flights on my own from 13. Its 100% fine. The in-flight personnel look after you, you're put next to old ladies who chat too much and given crayons you don't want. Then you are literally hand delivered to your waiting parent / relative.
Get over it.
Sounds more to me like you want to punish your ex with extended international travel.

PorridgeBrain · 30/05/2013 05:19

Agree with others that the point you need to push in court is that dd has not had enough contact with her father in the past 6 years and therefore both she and you are not happy to send her alone to a foreign country with him in those circumstances. I think if you just focus on how she gets to him as being the problem you won't have a credible argument and its not the big issue here.

LoveBeingUpAt4InTheMorning · 30/05/2013 05:32

Op I think some people are jumping on that comment and taking it incredibly personally, either because they have done it as a child or to their dc.

Aybu? No I don't think you are because I cannot imagine sending my dd anywhere like that.

Your dd doesn't want to go which is more important, can he force you?

LoveBeingUpAt4InTheMorning · 30/05/2013 05:33

Op I think some people are jumping on that comment and taking it incredibly personally, either because they have done it as a child or to their dc.

Aybu? No I don't think you are because I cannot imagine sending my dd anywhere like that.

Your dd doesn't want to go which is more important, can he force you?

Mumonabroom · 30/05/2013 05:43

I work as Cabin Crew on longhaul. There are unaccompanied minors from the age of 5 on every flight. I have 2 young children and wouldn't hesitate to send them solo when they're old enough. The ground staff hand them over to us, we look after them, hand them over to designated groundstaff the minute we land, who then take them to their adult at the other end. They even collect their suitcase for them and have their passport etc etc.

If it's the flight you're worried about and nothing else then please don't. I know for a (very regularly trained and examined) fact that even in very very unlikely event of an accident she would be looked after.

Hope this helps.

MusicalEndorphins · 30/05/2013 05:43

Why doesn't your daughter want to go?
Does she like spending time with him?
Has she flown to the states before?
Is she afraid of planes?

LtEveDallas · 30/05/2013 06:15

DSD and her mate came to us in Cyprus as UM when they were both 12. They had a great time, even DSD who is a nervous flyer. They were with someone every second of the journey - even in Duty Free when DsD wanted to buy a perfume!

This shouldn't be about the flight. If you have issues with how your DD is treated by her father then be honest and make it about that. The flight is the least of your problems, and if you make it all about that rather than more real concerns then you will lose.

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