Would you give up your seat on a crowded train

[akaemmafrost]

During rush hour, for a child, say between the ages of 5 and 11?

I would and have. It's just a discussion I was having today and I thought I would put it to MN.

Sorry Emma I missed that. I think the problem is that many people - and of course children - do look fine, as the disability is hidden, so I would just ask away - I'd hope people would happily give up their seat in the circumstances - I certainly would .

I would, for a younger child, maybe up to 8/9YO.

if i had someone with me who had difficulty standing, i would always book a seat

But the point is, I shouldn't HAVE to shout about his private health conditions on a crowded bus, which embarrasses him. People should just pay attention (as I do) to those boarding, see if someone is in obvious need, whatever their age etc, and offer them their seat if they are fitter and healthier than the standee.

Why SHOULD I have to shout personal information to get my DC with a disability a seat that I have paid full price for, just because I have to use a rush hour bus to get him to school as I can't drive due to my OWN disability?!

People should just be more aware of those in greater need, and less selfish IMO.

And nobody EVER offers. So every chuffing day I have to embarrass my DS2 by having to call out personal information in order to get him the seat that I have had to pay full price for.

oh couthy bus is harder than train...

You can't book a seat on the tube or buses though.

And yes, I DO usually ask politely to a few people first. Who always refuse. I ducking HATE my school run with a passion because of selfish arses who can't be arsed to help out a young child.

My DS2 won't be able to stand on a moving bus at 10, 20, 30, 40 or 50. But he LOOKS perfectly healthy.

(BAD BAD morning on the bus this morning!)

Couthy that does sound unfortunate; if he obviously has difficulty then of y=course you'd hope somebody would notice and offer him a seat.
Because he does have a disability, is there no school transport available? Forgive my ignorance if that's not the case.

people refuse when you ask couthy ??

I charitably have to assume it is due to disabilities they have themselves???

couthy I would be embarrassed to have to be asked to get up in the first place, let alone refuse to give up my seat.

This is my point. I understand that people don't want to give up their seat for strapping 11 year olds but how can a grown adult sit comfortably in good conscience while a Mum stands there being shoved about with her two children? (both of mine are tiny for their ages btw as their parents are shortarses ).

I've taken everything on board that's been said on here but that's what I think.

If I see someone who appears to need a seat, I'll always get up for them, and that would include a mum with a toddler, but tbh I might be deep in my book / phone, or dozing, or something, and not notice - I would ALWAYS give my seat up if asked though.

Couthy, on the one hand you say your son looks perfectly healthy, but on the other you say that people should notice and give up their seat. I may be being dense, but these 2 statements aren't really compatible.

No-one is saying that someone with a disability should stand. But I do think that children age 5 and over are PERFECTLY able to stand on a bus (excepting children with disabilities).

I am about fully grown healthy adults who would allow a 5 year old to stand while they sat.

All out of the ordinary issues aside, SN etc I would probably give up my to seat for children till they are about 8.

I just want people to understand that I don't ask for a seat for DS1, as he doesn't need it. I DO ask for a seat for DS2, because he DOES need it.

Why should I have to discuss his personal, private medical history with someone who feels that I have to justify his need to have a seat FFS.

Are they going to tell me or him their private medical history to justify why THEY need the seat more than him? No? Then why the fuck should I have to give a reason. The fact that I have asked for one child but not the other should be reason enough!

Nope, fit healthy, in their 30's adults. Who just say I paid for the seat, I'm not moving. Ignoring the fact that I have ALSO paid full price for a seat for a DC with disabilities.

Yes, I always ask a couple of people politely first, but invariably have to do the 'loud' explaining thus embarrassing my DS2, who is having difficulties coming to terms with his disabilities.

He looks perfectly healthy until the bus starts to move. And even when it becomes obvious that he ISN'T perfectly healthy, still no fucker moves.

And all these people saying that they would move if given a reason - do you give YOUR justification for wanting or needing the seat?

If not, why would you refuse to move if the person asking didn't divulge their personal medical history to you? Surely the fact that they have had call to ASK should tell you that they have a need for the seat?

I would really actually like to know the answer to this - because if you aren't willing to divulge your reasons for wanting it needing the seat, why does the person asking need to?

Do you not realise that some people might wish NOT to have to broadcast their disabilities to a stranger on a bus/train/tube, yet still NEED to sit down?

I don't get it. Genuinely.

Couthy, if you asked then I'd take that as enough reason that the seat was needed and get up.

Actually, if someone asked for my seat on a crowded tube I would explain to them that I am likely to have a panic attack if I have to stand.

And as on my buses, a child has paid exactly the same fare as an adult at peak time, why should an adult be more 'entitled' to the seat anyway, if both the child and the adult are fit and healthy.

I would expect my DS1, who IS fit and healthy, to give up his seat to anyone infirm, old, disabled, pregnant, holding an under 5-7yo, and people who genuinely ask him politely. Other than that, he's stating put.

If a fit healthy adult expected my fit healthy DS1 to vacate the seat for them, why should he? He was there first, and has paid the same fare. Why does a fit healthy 21yo take priority over a fit healthy 10yo?

I don't get that either. We are all human, a child is no less human than an adult, so why should they have to act differently?

A fit healthy adult wouldn't expect another fit healthy adult to move off a seat for them, they'd be considered rude and cheeky to even ask - so why is that any different for children?

Surely a child is just as deserving of respect as an adult?

So now you are assuming that the 21 year old is fit and healthy but begrudging having to explain that your DS has a medical condition. You can't have it both ways.

And that's why I am too nervous to ask for ds, everything couthy has said.

Always have done and probably always will (with the exception of when I was heavily pregnant and couldn't stand myself)

It has it's bonuses too - I can't count the number of times I've been upgraded to first class for offering my seat to someone's kid, as the gaurds are passing (unplanned timing I promise) and they always insist on moving you to first class if there are no other standard class seats free

CouthyMowWearingOrange
A fit healthy adult wouldn't expect another fit healthy adult to move off a seat for them, they'd be considered rude and cheeky to even ask - so why is that any different for children?

Indeed.
But a relatively fit, relatively healthy older adult - like me - would always stand for a pregnant woman, or a relatively fit, relatively healthy even older adult.

So, I shall bear that in mind next time I spot a fit healthy pregnant woman. Why should I move.

And, in fact, I might have stood for you as you were minding kids... but since you'd sit yours down, I'll leave my bad knee and lower back problems in the nice comfy seat that I have also paid for.