to think that a 3 year old girl shouldn't be in nappies

[missymarmite]

Quick background. I have 1 DS 9, we live with DP and his eldest DD 10, and we have his other two DD, 7 and 3, every weekend from thursday/friday to sunday.

The 3 year old had her birthday last month. I put my foot down and took the executive decision to try toilet training her. Every time before that, I mentioned it to DP he said it was up to his XW to sort it as the resident parent. So one day I just put her in some old knickers and let her run round outside in a dress. She got a bit upset when she wet herself, but over the next couple of weekends she began to get the hang of it. You can tell when she needs to go, because she kind of holds herself down there. At night and when we go out we put nappy pants on her and then she doesn't ask for the toilet, but in knickers she does.

DP told XW that she won't ask for the toilet when in nappy pants, but she has made no effort whatsoever to toilet train her, despite the fact that she only works part time and has every weekend child free, while both DP and I work full time and are exhausted most of the time, we still make the effort.

Am I BU to be frustrated and annoyed at this woman?

We used cloth. DD was out of them at 3, DS1 is not reliable yet at 7, and is still wet at night. DS2 PT himself at 2.5. After the pure hell of DS1, I wasn't even going to try training DS2 until 3, but he decided that he didn't need nappies one day and has never had an accident!

So, cloth= early training = bollocks. Star charts = bollocks. Taking nappies away = bollocks, plus withholding, anxiety and distress. Sweeties for wees = bollocks. Waiting for readiness = bollocks. Anyone who uses toilet training to point score parenting ought to have their brains recalled as they are clearly faulty.

Oh, and having DS1 in nappies (as he still is at night) is not lazy parenting FFS. It's necessity. expensive, stinky, unpleasant necessity.

binthere, nope, Ireland. The County Childcare Council are putting pressure on the playschool to change the rule but the staff refuse. Even in a case like mine where I could send him in a pull up and would come up to change him myself.... so not a staffing or training issue.

Just as an example for the 'Any child can do it' brigade:
I changed ds2 (3y8m) earlier (he's leaking poo due to constipation from withholding so having to be changed every hour even when he does keep himself dry). Whilst I was getting his clean clothes I suggested he go do a pee and he agreed (that doesn't happen often, 70% of the time he refuses to go near the loo and freaks out if I try and insist). He was sauntering happily in when he suddenly grabbed himself and yelped. He starts whinging, I ask what's wrong. He says 'It's starting to come out'.

So even with pants off, and discussing the toilet, he had no idea he needed to pee or that he was about to release.... it took him completely by surprise. This is our third attempt, we've been TT over a month, last time before summer it was 2 months and he didn't do a single pee in the loo in that time.

crunchy... sympathies, dd is the same age and still wet every night too. It's a nightmare.... the smell is soul destroying, her room stinks even with bed mats and frebeze bought in bulk

Because the children in nappies seem oblivious it is often only when one of the staff or other children notice the smell that we know the child needs changing - not a pleasant task for staff to change a 4 year-old's nappy when they've been sitting in it for a while.

That surprises me, although I am no expert, but DS was always distressed by a soiled nappy long before he was ready for for PT, and was really miserable until he was changed.

susitwoshoes Dd2 was like this. I had no idea what to do as dd1 just decided at 22 months that she didn't need nappies and was dry & clean within a few days. It took us months of patience encouraging dd2 to sit on the potty, letting her choose a potty, pay for it, carry it to the car. Then she wouldn't do anything on it, she'd freak out if she started to dribble. She'd hold her wee for hours until she was totally and utterly distressed by it and obviously in pain. In the end it was going to nursery (free 15 hours) that made her decide she wanted to potty train but I had to get rid of all the nappies to do so cos she was quite happy to hold it until she had a nappy on. We still get a wet bed at times but it's only been a couple of weeks.

"Unfortunately ReallyTired a lot of children aren't actually diagnosed until well after nursery age."

That is a problem that is far more serious than being incontinent. If a child struggles to acheive continence after 3 year old it can be a sign of a more serious issue. It does no harm for a child to have a development check and the parents to have a chat about potty training strageries 3 months before starting nursery.

If there are undiagnosed special needs then a development check would hopefully get the child referred for help. A home visit would also rule out issues like neglect.

But they would still officially be NT until they were diagnosed. Besides which, it's often nurseries themselves that spot signs of potential SNs, I had no idea that aspects of my DSs development weren't normal and I had spoken to the HV. In hindsight, she did mention that he was "very spirited" and gave me a leaflet about discipline but that was it, and at the time it didn't mean much to me. I left feeling unsupported and insulted, and struggled on until he went to nursery and they (badly) raised the possibility of ASD. It took five years to get a diagnosis and only now does he have full protection under the DDA. If he hadn't been allowed into nursery, goodness only knows how late he would have been diagnosed.

Hello optimistic

Exactly, DS1 was not DX'd until 4.8. Bit late! He was still in nappies then.

Oh hello m'lovely how are things?

Not bad, will catch up later if these people ever go to sleep!

I have read this thread with interest.

I am struck with the vitriol and plain nastiness directed towards the OP.

I also don't get this righteousness of the 'mother knowing best' brigade. So everything a mum does (or not do) is never due to laziness or ignorance or her own emotional baggage. Oh no, it is in the interests of the child, because 'mum knows best'

What happens when kids go to nursery at 3 these days. In my kids day they had to be out of nappies to go

3 seems very late for a girl to still be in nappies in the day, special needs excepted, maybe less so for a boy!

in my dds nursery plenty start in nappies, it is unlikely they would nee changing in 3 hours.
Legally a nursery cant refuse to accept a child because they are in nappies

Flatbread you are so right!

So many of the posts seem to take the fact the OP wants to potty train the three year old as an attack on their choice/reason for potty training their own children later!

Calm down, you all seem to missing the point!

I disagree. The 'vitirol' directed it at the OP is because she has taken it upon herself to potty train someone else's child and is being high handed about it.

The 'vitriol' directed at another poster who is insisted that children should be pt at a certain age is because she is rude and insistent that she is right and everyone else wrong.

Perhaps you should take a little time to read the thread before you start patronising grown women flowerygirl :)

I don't think she is bu......... sorry.

my ds4 was in nappies when he started pre-school, it wasnt an issue they let him know where the toilets were and gave him the chance to use them if he wanted (he didnt want to!) and he never pooed at pre-school, and so the nappy was fine, fresh on in the morning then i changed it once i got him home, it wasnt a problem and was very common as was wearing pull ups and lots of them having accidents etc, we just had to provide a change of clothes in case they were needed.

When I taught preschool it was hard. A lot of our children were still in diapers. There was a diaper changing area next to the sink in our room but the director of the center did not want it used as the children were "too old". So we had to take them to the bathroom. But stay in the 1:10 ratio. So if I had twenty children and an aide and child with a poo filled diaper that needed changing, or one that had had an accident, I had to take that child and round up 9 others, no matter what they were doing, and take them with me, then get back to the room to find out it had happened again. TOTAL SCREAMING NIGHTMARE, but more the director's fault than anyone else's.

OP; I apologise as I haven't read the billions of post, but have skimmed through a bit and got a general gist-...

overall I think it's fine what you're doing. It's a normal life skill. The BM isn't going to be instrumental in every single milestone. I don't see this as being any different tbh. If she's with you so much, and your dp is in agreement, then I don't see the problem at all.

and I agree with you about all this mother goddess stuff. As long as you are doing it in a kind way with the child and not letting on to her how frustrated you are with her mum.

Sorry you've had a hard time on here.

I don't think you are being unreasonable OP. I agree with what Flatbread said. If the mother isn't doing it then someone has to, right?

CheerfulYank. Were they not missing the point, somewhat, if you merely transported all the children to the bathroom with you?
How was that giving the child in question privacy? What a farce

Flatbread, the OP seemed not to mind that the father of the child was blase about the nappies too. Neither of the biological parents were pushed about the situation. The OP persuaded her DP that training was necessary and put him in the situation where he had to start the conversation with his XW.

If the mother isn't, then surely the father has a say? Why should the matter be just between the women involved?

FloggingMolly she was indeed. It is but one of many items on my list of Why She Was a Terrible Director, believe me!