Is my husband a massive idiot or do I owe him an apology?

[obvioussockpuppet]

DS (5) has a real intolerance to anything mint flavoured. He says it burns his mouth/gives him a poorly throat so I tend to buy him strawberry flavoured toothpaste or similar. I did an online shop a few weeks back and they sent me mint toothpaste as a substitute for strawberry. Rather than chuck the mint stuff out, I put it in our bathroom cabinet with the intention of giving it to my mate for her DCs. It is still in there.

A few night back, DH accidentally brushed DS's teeth with the mint stuff and DS really sobbed. He just hates mint, really really hates it. So last night, DH tells DS he is having his teeth cleaned with the mint toothpaste Ds obviously protests but DH then proceeds to make him have his teeth cleaned with it. DS cries loudly so I go upstairs to see why he is making him use the fucking toothpaste.

I snatched the toothbrush off DH and washed the mint stuff off, then gave him the strawberry stuff to clean his teeth. DH then starts saying that DS is crying to "play us off against each other" he is "crying for attention" "he cries for nothing" I said that actually I think it is borderlining on abuse to force a child to consume something that provokes such a violent reaction in them. DH is a vegetarian, would he like it if I stuffed a wodge of wafer thin ham in his trap?

We didn't speak for the rest of the night and he has just text me saying that what I said was serious (about borderline abuse) but I think I am right. I also said he is power-pissed where DS is concerned. I hate hearing my little boy sobbing over something as lame as toothpaste and I WILL stand up for him! Fancy making him use that toothpaste is he hates it that much.

It sounds petty written down.

I am a regular under a NC by the way because I am planning on showing DH this thread.

A bully because the kid doesnt like the taste of mint?!
Its not going to kill him!

yanbu

Rice and semolina won't kill me Duck but I wouldn't eat them.

Why do you think a 5 yo should be forced to use something they dislike when there's an alternative available right there btw?

I will add to the long list of people saying that their dcs would never have accepted minty toothpaste at that age.
I can also see how it could be constructed as bullying/abuse (no difference in my book tbh)

What I find much more worrying is the fact that:
1- he seems to be so not attuned to his sons that any grumble is taken as 'playing up' and 'crying out for nothing' (Err I haven't met a child who at 5yo will be crying out for nothing btw. They might be crying for not obvious reason to us but the reason will be clear to them even if they can't express it).
2- most/all(?) bedtime end up in tears
3- you felt the need to say it was abusive. As such, this incident in isolation isn't really 'abuse' but I am gathering that this is NOT the only/first time something similar happen hence you reaction.

Time for a discussion on what parenting means to you and for him to learn more about how children grow, their needs and what is normal child behaviour (NOT control, playing up etc...)

seriously duck?? the fucking strawberry was right there??!!! why purposely use the alternative, that feels like it's burning?

Gosh Duck, you sound lovely.

I have a friend whose son felt a similar way, she spoke to the dentist and he explained it is a recognised condition where some people's mouths are just super-sensitive to some things.

Maybe speak to your dentist and see if he can spell out the facts to your husband.

And FWIW I think it was a brutal way to treat a child. I have to buy different pastes for two of my DCs and yet my youngest prefers only the strongest toothpaste

^A bully because the kid doesnt like the taste of mint?!
Its not going to kill him^

No it wont kill him - who said it would? An yes, the husband is a Bully. Anyone who uses force to bend someone else's will is a Bully.

And why should he have something he hates? Is there a taste you hate OHforDUCKScake? How would you feel if it was forced on you?

ActuallyGreenEyes, I am wondering how many of the people who said 'oh fgs it's just mint toothpaste' would actually agree to eat, not just rice that may seem too neutral and innocent to most people but, lets' say snails?

Anyone happy to be forced to eat a plateful of snails, with plenty of garlic? You know it is GOOD for you and it's just meat. It's not going to kill you.

Or is it .. just the most disgusting thing ever?

Seriously, it's about RESPECT.
I do not believe you can raise children who will become respectful adults if you are not respectful towards them in the first place.

Yanbu- your son has feelings that ought to be respected.If this is a genuine issue for him he ought to be heard.I remember my mum forcing me to eat liver and onions at the dinner table-literally squashing my cheeks together and prising open my lips to make me eat the damn stuff.To this day I can't understand why she did that.

Everyone is assuming that he deliberately went for the mint over the strawberry.

I know if my DP did this (I have a mint hating 5 year old) he would have just gone for the mint without properly checking for the strawberry.

It wouldnt make him a bully ffs, just someone who didnt look properly.

I've got an issue with a lot of toothpastes. Oddly - the only one which is OK with me at the moment is SR which is really minty. But other toothpastes make my mouth and throat burn. It's really horrible. So I wouldn't pass this off as "doesn't like the taste". I wonder if it's more than that.

Actually I agree with your husband's opinion on the toothpaste. Unless there's a genuine "intolerance". Does your son get an allergic reaction, or does he just not like the taste of mint? Kids should know that sometimes they have to use toothpaste they don't like, and other things of a similar magnitude, without screaming the place down.

That said, your husband behaved really badly and I'd agree with the other posters who said he was bullying. I'm not surprised you were upset.

Duckscake - but if I'd inadvertently given my DD something she had a real aversion to - I'd apologise to her (radical I know) and change it. Not make it into some stupid I'm-in-charge battle. I am in charge. I don't need to forcefeed my child something she cannot stand to prove the point...

I was forced to eat food I hated as a child. I had to swallow it down with water if I couldn't bear to chew or taste it. It was physically uncomfortable, and humiliating, and it made me angry over something that should have been nice family time. I still remember it vividly - and not in a good way.

"I do agree, there seems to be more going on, does your DH think you are too soft in general?"

YES. I think he does.

I don't think there's much evidence to back this up, though. Aside from the occasional irrational benny, DS is a good kid. Honest. I just choose my battles more carefully or else I'd be shrieking like a bansheee every five minutes, I would get stressed, DS would tune out to me. I know when to let things go. Like this.

Another example: on sunday, we went out for the day for a picnic with some mates. DS and our friend's girls were climbing/swinging off a tree. You know, like kids do? DS broke a branch off. DH told him off but never said there was going to be any 'follow-up punishment' Then we went inside a stall that was selling loads of foody things. DH bought DS and teh girls a lollipop each. DS spotted astall selling macaroons. He asked if I would buy him one. I said to look round and see what else there was and at teh end I would buy the children a macaroon each. (DH did not hear this) At the end, DS remninded me about the macaroons. DH starts having a paddy "YOU BROKE A TREE you expect a MACAROON?????!!!!" WTF?! He didn't say that he had told DS no treats and he certainly didn't tell me and in any case, he had already bought them a lollipop each. So it's OK for him to buy treats and not me?

"Everyone is assuming that he deliberately went for the mint over the strawberry."

He did. He said as much.

In my day there was no such thing as strawberry toothpaste, so if you kicked up a fuss over mint it was tough, you'd just get told to pipe down! Sounds like this is a parenting style he favours, and once upon a time the majority on here would probably be agreeing with him and saying that children need to learn who is in charge.

Things change though, but whilst that sort of parenting style it may be out of favour in Western society now, he is just as entitled to make these decisions as you are, but really you both need to be on the same page and show a united front. It sounds like a good time to talk about both your attitudes to parenting so that you can agree how to deal with stuff in future without arguing in front of your DS.

You are both being a bit unreasonable. Mostly you are unreasonable for snatching the toothbrush off him and belittling him in front of your son.

My daughter used to tolerate adult mint toothpaste fine, until she discovered the alternative. Now if she has to use mint she cries and whinges and says it's too spicy and it hurts. Sometimes I make her use mint. I think it's something they need to get used to. They don't do strawberry flavored toothpaste for adults, and they'll need something stronger eventually.

I wouldn't have condoned a massive row over toothpaste, but, what's the fluoride content in the strawberry stuff?

It needs to be at least 1200ppm, even for kids, and most adult paste is around 1400ppm.

Most kiddy-strawberry-cartoon-y stuff is much less than that, so there is a point to this in that your son is letting a certain amount of fussiness potentially do long term damage to his dental health.

However - since I'm sure your husband hasn't got a clue about fluoride concentrations in toothpaste, he was just being an arse with the tooth cleaning.

Perhaps have a proper conversation about what he thinks your son's behaviour should be and try and sort it out from there

In my day there was no such thing as strawberry toothpaste, so if you kicked up a fuss over mint it was tough, you'd just get told to pipe down! Sounds like this is a parenting style he favours, and once upon a time the majority on here would probably be agreeing with him and saying that children need to learn who is in charge.

Things change though, but whilst that sort of parenting style it may be out of favour in Western society now, he is just as entitled to make these decisions as you are, but really you both need to be on the same page and show a united front. It sounds like a good time to talk about both your attitudes to parenting so that you can agree how to deal with stuff in future without arguing in front of your DS.

Apologies for the double post - stupid phone!

Everyone is assuming that he deliberately went for the mint over the strawberry

No we're not assuming anything. We read that that's what he did. In the OP like

Really? What were his exact words?

From what you've said since, this is beyond Mintgate, and youre both parenting differently.

punch and judy
I think this has been going for donkeys years bluegrass!!
tutti frutti flavour too

I spoke to the dentist about it, she said it's fine
A lot of it is about brushing the teeth, not what you brush them with