to want another child although strictly speaking we can't afford it?

[melonandpapayaandmango]

If we had a fourth, no one would starve, no one would go barefoot and no one would be homeless.

DD is 5, DS1 is 3 and DS2 is only 3 months. I've always wanted a big family, DH was happy with 2 children but I persuaded him to have a 3rd - he agreed and now he has said he likes the idea of an even number.

at the moment my two older children share a room (DS2 is in with us) but we hope to move house in the next 2 years but it would probably be a 3 bedroom property meaning the two boys would still have to share - a third DS would go in with them, a daughter would share with DD.

it's mainly the living space - any thoughts?

given salary now and expectations, i think it would be doable actually.

with regards to after school clubs,i think they are important actually. my elder 3 all play and instrument and 2 do sports clubs. then they all do swimming and swimming is VITAL!! its a life skill.

we have to budget carefully but it is doable and depending on your mortgage and other outgoings i would say it is possible :)

and YES to food, four boys and a girl here and the amount of money we spend on food is mad! bread, milk, cheese, cereal and fruit, you would not believe the amount we get through!

I'm suggesting scenarios that I have personally faced I know other people will have different outgoings. One of my children passed the 11+ I doubt the next one would so I was faced with a lesser education for that DC or private school or literally pouring every penny into tutoring that child to get her through the process. Equally could apply to a child with a talent for swimming or art or music. Is a sibling more important than piano lessons if music is your life, especially one that doesn't actually exist. Probably not.

I've always dreamed of a big family but I will fully admit I have a rosy tinted and romantic view of it

Yes, I do worry a bit about 3 DSs sharing a room, and also if we had a DD there would be about 6/7 years between DD1 and her sister - would that be fair when DD1 is 15 and sharing a room with an 8 year old?

If we magically won a 5 bed house I'd have a 4th like a shot so I think it is just the house thing really - everything else we can work out easily enough - well apart from uni fees actually

What happens if you lose your income through redundancy or ill health? Could you support all of them on one wage?

Clubs and hobbies are important to children, if you having another means they cant do these then you are wearing rose tinted glassesif you think they would all be very happy with no extras but another sibling.

Its time as well, i grew up in a large step family and hated it. No privacy, no personal space, no one to one time or things just for me. Its hard living like that.

What happens when the next child is past the baby stage, would you then go onto have another?

And things change in 2008 we want nearly £100,000 between us, nowhere near that amount now do you can't bank on an increase.

My 2 brothers have an age difference of nearly nine years and they shared a room, I don't see that it's an issue.

if your eldest is still only 5 then i really dont think you can realise how much older DCs cost

once they are 8/9 they eat adult amounts of food

at 10/11 often have to pay adult fares for activities/trips/travel

i think with 4 in the house (with small gaps) that is MORE reason to provide them with after school clubs so they have a bit of escape time from each other

what if one is really into a certain hobby- do you say no or cart the other 3 to matches every saturday morning?

hand-me-down clothes wont last 4 DCs unless they are very expensive good quality brands

and the thought of 4 teens at once!

the logistics of what you are planning are vv hard work- 2 out to school in the morning, one at 3 hour nursey and a newborn- THAT is harder than little ones at home all day

I agree with 5madthings post (although seem to have got away with about £130 for shoes for my lot!).

The only other thing to consider is what happens if your fourth is twins? Mine was . I'll admit that that this adds a completely different dynamic to the finances and despite this I wouldn't change things. I do still wonder what life would have been like if we had stuck with three though.

We already had a big car when or twins were born but have had to buy a bigger dining room table, more chairs and now the older ones are getting physically bigger we might have to consider more living room furniture for them to sit on. Also, beds are another thing that we have had to replace, for bunks etc (I love Ikea by the way!).

On the plus side we have a small living space which we don't find to be a problem as long as it is well organised.

I am pregnant with 4th .............and broke. Just contemplating telling dds they cant go horse riding this month.

hand me down clothes have lasted my 4 boys very well and they certainly have not all bee expensive. they do all get new stuff as well tho, i have to top up wardrobes, esp as trousers get holes in, but tops etc have lasted fine.

baby clothes have been worn by all 5, tho i have bought dd plenty of her own clothes.

oh yes twins! we have twins in my family, i was paranoid about having them!

food does get more expensive, we had to buy bigger saucepans to be able to cook the amount of pasta we need in one go!

bagpuss my childrne have wide feet with ahigh instep so no clarks or startrite for me, unfortunately i have to go for european shoes, ricosta, geox etc, hideously expensive.

travel wise on trains and buses they dont pay adult fare until 16? on the tube they are free until age 12 as well. get a family railcard! also tesco vouchers etc for big days out are great.

we have a citreon c8 tho are looking to upgrade, dp would like a vw transporter... its the stuff you have to take away on holiday that is the kille,r even with a roof box etc.

i do agree if your eldest is only 5 you have a bit of shock instore with regards to how much more expensive they get!

having said that althought we do have to budget carefully and the house is a bit small, it is fine and i wouldnt change it for the world, infact if we coudl afford it i would have one more! but that is NOT happening

After just getting home from a shopping trip to kit out my two teenage boys in full secondary school uniforms, pe kits, football boots, trainers, school shoes, rucksacks and god knows what else.....I would say there is a lot more to think about than just accommodation!!

I know quite a few people with large families and they manage somehow - it depends on what you are willing to do or not do as a whole family. If money were no object I owuld say go for it.

I don't have an income and DH's job is secure - he's an assistant headteacher. If he was made redundant then we'd struggle with 3 children as well as with 4 if you see what I mean - it isn't likely, though.

HappyMummy - eh?! I don't want another 'baby' as I have a baby. I've always wanted a large family and both DH and I would like to have one (ONE more child.

Obviously if its twins or triplets or quads then deal with it ... they don't run in our family though which isn't to say it won't happen of course.

I suppose it's different strokes and all that, I grew up in a family where we constantly went on holiday and had different activities every night of the week and hated it.

I wouldn't say money was no object (if only!) but yes we'd be stretched to our uppers. Mind you I think we'll be stretched anyway, with 3.

5madthings I knew you would say that wrt shoes! My small bill is only because we have a shoe shop which offers twin discount and every seventh pair is also half price. I have planned my shoe shopping to coincide with a discount. The killer is when they all want Converse for out of school though .

I forgot about bigger cooking pans too!

I will say that when I found out I was expecting twins I didn't think we would be able to manage, but we are, even though dh has since had two redundancies.

Would you be looking at returning to work eventually? Finding suitable care for two or three is hard, but 4 would be harder. And the cost! And the sheer logistics of so many people doing different things. Sorry - sounds like I'm putting you off, just giving examples.

I understand - I am just longing for another baby!
DD is 15 months and I can see her babyhood ebbing away day by day and I'm clinging on to it. I am so sentimental.
My career has got back on track very well, thanks to help from my parents. (my husband is incredibly busy and travels a lot, so mum and dad have been a godsend). They have said that while they are delighted to help, they wouldn't be so keen on doing childcare for a toddler and a baby.
DH says we can have a nice enough life financially as things stand, but that we would struggle if we had another child.
I am 37, so it's not a decision to postpone for too long. However I conceived first time 2 years ago, so we've probably got a good few years of fertility left - or is that a silly assumption??
Sorry to ramble - it's just that this thread is so interesting to me.

OP, you have said that no-one would starve or go barefoot, and if you're fine with kids sharing rooms, then maybe you should go for it. Students often share rooms in uni halls of residences, and lots of boarding schools still have dorms and shared rooms, so i think it's fine.

wow a twin discount! thats good and a pair free every seven pairs!

the shoe shop we use has a discoutn sysemt whereby we have a tab and every time we buy a pair of shoes 10% of the price of each pair goes on the tab, i cant take that off the next time i buy a pair, but i tend to let it build up until i get a free pair of shoes!

my problem was all of them needing them at once and dd had outgrown hers in a month! i bought her new shoes in july and had to buy some again this month! dam toddlers and their ability to grow overnight!

toilet rolls as well, we use a scary amount of bog roll! i think tho that you just cut your cloth accordingly tbh. it really depends what kind of lifestyle you are used to. dp and i had ds1 when we were at uni and POOR! and then he worked and i have always stayed at home, so we got used to surviving on one income and have never had childcare costs. we also bought a house in the cheaper part of town etc.

my children also share bedrooms, 2 boys in each and dd is in with us for the time being, co-sleeping...or no sleeping as the case may be

Seoladair - I think ultimately I'd like to retrain but that would have to wait until I'm about 40 anyway :) Until then there's little to no point working due to childcare costs.

I don't know how I feel about the DCs sharing rooms, to be honest.

We don't go on holiday, there's no way we could provide private education, and so I don't care about those things to be honest. But I do feel it would be nice for them all to have their own space ...

We are cramped at the moment!

On MN it is funny how the tone changes re room sharing when it is not social housing but only last week we had a very long thread with lots of teeth gnashing about the new rules coming in for hb and children being expected to share.

But back to the op i think it is doable but at the cost of what you can give your existing family. Babies are cheap but pre teens and teens are not.

"DD is 5, DS1 is 3 and DS2 is only 3 months.."

You want another one? Are you completely insane?

If you can afford another without resorting to benefits then go ahead. It's your money so you can decide how far it can stretch and you no doubt are happy giving up things for yourself, holidays etc.

I want a third, if not a third and fourth, but absolutely not possible financially until DD and DS are in school. I do worry that I'm being unreasonable, I am a less good parent to two children than I was to my PFB, but they do have each other to make up for that. I worry that if I don't, I'll always regret it. But I also worry that I'll always feel that 'just one more baby' urge.

I have a good friend who has 2 DS's and 2 DD's. Then an accidental Ds arrived, so now 5 in total. All under 9.
Her DH earns the same as yours, & they are finding things very very tough. My friend never has any spare cash, she can't even afford a glass of wine in a wine bar.
I have 4 kids, 3Ds's 1DD. 3 who are teens &1 Ds who is 8. As a family it is so very expensive! We earn more than my friend, but with teens the costs are sky high. My food bill is extortionate!!! Forget this feed your family on £50 a week lark, mine can eat £50 of food in one sitting!
Kids are expensive, needy, time consuming cause constant worry, make you furious beyond belief. I love them with all my heart.
But 4 or 5 is a couple too many!

Gabby - I've always wanted 4 to be honest.

So how much do you all spend on food bills, those of you with teens/older DCs? Although I'd hope by the time they are teenagers DH will be on yet more money and I'll hopefully be working as well.

But yes it's really the bedroom thing ...

How would you cope if you were divorced?