To feel physically sick......

[frannie1981]

that ITV documentary on now is treating cold blooded murderers as normal human beings. They are showing no remorse but detailing their crimes, I think it's awful they are even being given airplay, done get me started on the perks they have (Christmas dinner) etc. The poor families of their victims is what I think.....

I don't care where you work, because I know what I'm saying is right. It may differ in your area, but I know AS A GENERAL RULE they get homed, or rehomed as a matter of urgency.
I've seen it with my own fucking eyes, I've been in the houses they've then bragged about getting. With their nice shiny tag boxes set up in the corner afterrwards. So don't tell me what I'm saying is rubbish.

There's housing schemes and 'strategies' for housing ex offenders for the reasons of 'rehabilitation' which seems to the be the buzz word in this topic.

The people you used to hang out with, WW, might they not have been stretching the truth a bit to impress you and/or each other? Pretending it was all a big laugh or joke to hide their real feelings?

I'm sure some offenders do laugh at so-called do-gooders, but I don't think taking away their TVs and GCSE courses in prison is going to make things better.

I don't care where you work, because I know what I'm saying is right

Obviously no point in my conversing with the stubborn and the ignorant.

Oh says the one who replies with 'rubbish'. I known I'm right, so why should I bother. A note:

Support with gaining stable housing is a critical need for ex-prisoners in the period immediately following release. Without it, many other goals ? such as seeking employment or trying to live free of drugs ? are much more difficult and, for many, these additional difficulties result in a return to prison

And what I'm saying is bollocks is it?

And no thefarside. This is first hand, second hand experiences. They know I wasn't impressed. One actually did something to get himself back in there to 'have a rest and sort my head out' as he put it.

Hardly a punishment.

Support with gaining stable housing is a critical need for ex-prisoners in the period immediately following release. Without it, many other goals ? such as seeking employment or trying to live free of drugs ? are much more difficult and, for many, these additional difficulties result in a return to prison

I'm not disputing that: it's a crucial factor in addressing reoffending. I'm disputing the tosh about released prisoners getting large family houses.

MANY prisoners leave prison NFA or to unstable housing arrangements, I know this as a fact due to where I work. There's no obligation on ANYONE to house them. I don't know where some people get their facts?

MANY prisoners leave prison NFA or to unstable housing arrangements

Absolutely.

Why didn't you say that before then? Instead of trying to make out it was all a load of rubbish? What was your point in saying you go out to the gate with them.... You've obviously changed your mind

Yes they do. I have already told you I have been in them. You chose not to listen.

There's a limited number of council houses. The ones usually on the market for bidding are the family homes, there's not nearly as many flats. So they end up in bigger houses because of ease and speed.

LucieMay, yes there is. It is the governments responsibility to rehome them as they are seen as 'vulnerable adults'.

The death penalty comment.... SERIOUSLY. I would emigrate if the death penalty was brought back into this country. I'm already considering leaving, but even if I wasn't that would put me on the earliest flight.

I don't know if anyone read my posts way up the thread about my feeling in regards to the death penalty and this sort of draconian punishment some are in favour of. Can you not see it is fundamentally hypocritical aside from being morally wrong.

I think what WhiteWidow says is interesting. I think there are groups of what are effectively career criminals (wonders if anyone saw the guy on Gordon's show with 79 convictions). If there is a right way to do something there is a wrong way to do something and I believe there will always be people who break the law and live as career criminals.

Obviously all crimes have victims but there is a differentiation to be made between those such as the lifers, the violent types and shoplifters and petty criminals. I would assume they need different approaches in their rehabilitation. I don't personally know any statistics, would love to hear form someone with lots of knowledge on our penal system, but I sort of guess that if you look at the current prison population it would be found a small percentage are those in lesser need of rehab and instead a kick up the arse, the majority would infect be shown to have problems which do need addressing in order for them to live 'straight' lives.

I said I pick them up from the gate to demonstrate that I work closely with them. If they are supported into housing it is invariably into private renal property. In any case housing benefit is only payable to under 35s up to the value of a room in a shared house.

Of course ex-offenders are helped with housing WW but you are implying that they are moving into luxury mansions.

As for your perspective on what offenders think, I guess the ones you hung around with were a certain type of criminal (are you talking drugs & theft?) and not the same as the ones on the Lifers programme.

In any case, I still don't have a problem with treating all offenders like human beings while they are inside.

Anyway I've had enough of this now, you do gooders go kiss the arses of criminals. I'll stick with my view that they should be punished for their crimes.

Sure I'm living in some sort of reverse reality

I have a cousin who has spent his life going in and out of prison. The last reason, to which he is still serving time for (I don't know how long, as not bothered with him for 10 years) is attempted murder. He never boasted of being in prison. In fact, from what I heard, especially the last time, he begged his dad to help keeping him out.

My other cousin is awaiting sentencing in a few weeks for serious assault. Given the fact he was out on conditional bail (think that was what it was?) for attempted murder, he is sure to get a prison sentence. I know the first time he was in, he didn't treat it like a holiday. He kept appealing, attempting suicide etc.

I, personally am glad both will be off the streets, but this idea that it is like a holiday for them doesn't ring true to me. I have the attitude though of "They knew the consequences, if they didn't want to deal with them, then they had a choice. Twats"

I don't understand why they reoffend. But I highly doubt it is because they get an easy life in prison.

For indeterminately sentenced prisoners (of which lifers are one type) and "high risk" prisoners, probation will usually ensure they are going out to a probation hostel (which have strict conditions) or other supported housing due to the nature of their crimes, the risk they pose, and the time spent in prison and the need to readjust to society. But the vast majority of prisoners are serving short sentences, sometimes even a matter of days. There is NO TIME to do anything with these prisoners. Probation aren't even involved if the prisoners are serving less than a year. There are so many wildly ridiculous misconceptions about prison and the justice system.

The reason they have tellies is because of the Strangeways riots. You lock up a load of (usually angry young) men in a small confined suffocating environment (and anyone who has spent any time in prison will understand this) with very little to occupy them for 24 hours a day and they WILL revolt. Tellies, rightly or wrongly, do help pacify them. The safety of prison staff has to be paramount. And there are STILL many attacks on prison staff anyway.

It is the governments responsibility to rehome them as they are seen as 'vulnerable adults'

If they attend a housing assessment on release they are generally found a place in a hostel. Housing services then work with them to find something more stable. The government is not under an obligation to house them.

I didn't say luxury mansions. However I will expand on the few people I've seen rehomed.

1. A 23 year old who got sent down for torturing his girlfriend came out, and was given a 3 bedroomed town house. Front and back garden. Dinging room, living room etc.

1. A 27 year old, repeated offences. 2 bedroomed house, one bedroom with an en suite.

1. A 31 year old female who after battering a girl and giving her brain damage, was later released and given a luxury furnished apartment in the centre of town. Streets from where the attack actually happened.

I knew some unsavoury people, I don't deny that. But I'm glad because I don't have this stupid rose tinted view.

Whitewidow, I work in a large local prison dealing with many different types of prisoners (lifers, remand, sentenced etc) and one of my jobs is processing their discharge paperwork and I can assure you that MANY prisoners are discharged nfa or to unstable housing. Not sure where you're getting your facts from?

you do gooders go kiss the arses of criminals

LucieMay your explanation is obviously wasted on someone so ignorant and ill informed.

I'm sure one day something will make you question what you believe in.

Hiding now, night folks.

Thanks Ruby - you've said what I was trying to say much more coherently about different types of offenders. (I was actually wondering earlier whether murderers might be nicer people than those who rob old ladies and rip off the vulnerable.)

I am currently working with people with learning disabilities (IQ below 70%), many of whom have records and have been in prison. They are another category of people who I genuinely believe don't always have the capacity to know right from wrong or the cognitive ability to reason or control their impulses. They are certainly not running around bragging about their huge council houses.

Just found this don't know if some of you have read it, but found it really interesting, think I am going to read up more on this topic.

I found bottom of page 9, middle of page 11 (bit about reoffending) and page 16 to be the most interesting.

Interesting post Shullbit and agree Lucie that there are as you say "so many wildly ridiculous misconceptions about prison and the justice system".

These one dimensional views put forward by some posters depress me.

Thanks Ruby