To think that my childminder puts her own children before mine?

[BlackholesAndRevelations]

of course I'm not stupid and I know she will do this... It's just that I'm getting fed up with her cutting corners for the sake of her kids, when I'm paying her to do me a service.

I'm thinking of sending them to nursery full time instead, so that i know where they are all the time (instead of on massive long car journeys), and can pick them up whenever i want (instead of waiting for them to return from long journeys)... despite believing that my baby should be with a childminder (he's 9 months at the mo but will be almost 1 when I return to work).

WWYD? (re: nursery or childminder)

Doing some homebased activities is fine. Spending all day every day doing them isn't there is a fine balance between giving the mindees a home from home routine and them coming second to your 'normal' life.

As for the idea of nurseries being boring and children being cooped up all day - perhaps in a crap nursery but most are far from boring and cooped up. You complain about people being quick to knock childminders while at the same time posting comments knocking nurseries.

Not read the whole thread as a little enraged by some comments...

Childminders offer home from home environments which involve doing things which are dailyhome activities.

I am a cm and work 8am -6pm Monday to Friday, I've taken mindee to the drs as there has been no other way round it. it would be much more inconvenient for a parent to take an hour out work so i can go to the Dr!!!

also..you mention you want to able to pick your dc when it suits you not have to wait around.

If i have something planned such as a pick up, a playgroup or activity and a parent was expecting me not to so they can collect early i would be saying get the dc before i go.

Childminders offer a service to parents they are not staff, i am my own boss and if a parent doesn't like the way i do things they can find someone else.

To be honest if i was ur cm id be giving you notice due to the fact you feel you employ!!

thebody - I am sure there are many CM who are very good and get the balance right although still not convinced by an hour school run daily for a baby/toddler. However - nurseries - whilst some might be boring and cooped up - just like with cm, there are also many good nurseries as well.

If it isn't okay to question childminders why is it okay to question nurseries?

Of course you are being employed, Skinny! They interview you, make the decision to employ you, pay you and can fire you!

Imperial you are wrong cms are SELF EMPLOYED. Parents can't sack you but can give required notice as per contract signed as can cm.

If you are using a service you can't employ/fire someone - you just stop using that service.

I wasn't knocking nurseries per se but you have to accept that a cm generally takes mindees out while nurseries generally don't!!

CM's are self employed.

-My sole reason for chosing a nursery over a CM was that I'm crap at putting my views across in RL and I knew if I was unhappy with a CM I would have real problems discussing this. In a nursery there's a manager, and a structure, and on the very few occasions where I did have small things to moan about, it was dealt with very professionally. CM wouldn't have worked for me.-

This is sooo ridiculous. Why wouldn't a CM deal with your complain in a professional manner?

Nurseries do take children out. Perhaps not every day but they certainly take them out. In the past month DS has been to the shops, the park and to feed the ducks with nursery and he is only in 1.5 days a week.

Lynette you would have choosen me for a cm as we usually agree on mumsnet.. as you say good and bad practise..

Not always though - DD went out somewhere very regularly with her nursery -shops, library, botanical gardens, local park, etc. And they had a huge garden which they went out in every single day regardless of weather and did lots of activities out there as well as free play. OK - she didn't go on school runs with the cm or do a big Tesco shop, but small outings - yes.

Sirzy of course but most cms would do that in 3 days..

But nurseries do go out and to say they don't is simply looking for reasons to criticise them.

Nurseries offer plenty of opportunities, Childminders offer plenty of opportunities. Both may offer different things but that doesn't make one better than the other overall and it seems a shame people are so quick to make sweeping generalisations about either.

Complexo I take it it's me you're calling ridiculous ?

With a CM it's their home, their routine, their style IMO. And if that doesn't suit you then you really only have two choices - suck it up or change provider. Whereas in a nursery there is a management structure, more people around, etc etc. And I didn't actually say I didn't think a CM would be professional, more that I would find it awkward. It is difficult for me to give negative feedback to the person involved, it's easier to do it via a third party, IMO.

No I an bit looking for reasons to critisise nurseries as I have already said there is good and bad practise in child care settings both cm and nursery.

But you must see that the setting of a nursery and a cm are very different, except the paperwork and EYFS guidelines, mindees go out and about more generally and nursery children don't.

Bit criticising simply fact.

My current CM is lovely, very well qualified and I couldn't be happier with her.
My first CM was also lovely (we moved so had to leave).

However I had a CM inbetween who I thought put her child before mine and there were lots of other minor things I was unhappy about so I left. It is a decision I don't regret even though it was very uncomfortable to tell her I was unhappy with the service. I just didn't feel right about leaving my DD with her even though there was nothing really wrong with her care. If you don't feel comfortable, look for another.

OP. your CM isn't allowed to take herself or her children to the GP. Isn't allowed to do the school run. Hqve you considered what happens when it is your child who is sick? Or your child who needs to be collected from school, or deposited at an after school club, and then collected, an hour later?
It's attitudes like this, combined with the crippling regulations, constant training and rubbish pay that made me reconsider a career as a CM. And it is rubbish pay. I get £12ph picking up horse shit. That's much, much easier than looking after someone else's children!
I did, for 2 years however, work as a nanny for the Dcs of a good friend who died. She had 3 under 9. I did it for love, and for a lot less than £15ph, but I promise you it was incredibly hard work. There were times when I put them first to the extent that I wouldn't see my own Dcs until bedtime, and my Dcs spent hours in cars whilst they were ferried about. I loved my 3 mindees like my own children, and had much more freedom in how I handled them than a CM would. They were VERY challenging, and quite frankly, bound by offered regs, I'd be in jail by now! Anybody who is a childminder, and is governed by CM rules and regulations deserves a medal IMO! And anyone who uses a CM should thank their lucky stars every day.

I have a lovely cm who I have had for 4 years. We have a contract that is renewed yearly and there have been some minor changes to the contract over this time as her circumstances have changed and part of that has been because of her child's needs changing - e.g asking if we would bring a packed tea (for a fee reduction) as she was struggling to cook tea and help her child with his homework at that time of day. Whilst having to make a packed tea at night is a minor inconvenience, it's one I am happy to accept to keep a good cm and also understand her need for requesting it. My cm has also taken my dds to the doctors on rare occasions but she always asks for my permission first. I have no problem at all with it and am actually grateful that she is prepared to go to the doctors with mindees in tow rather than me have to take time off and it's rare.

However, I would have a problem with my dd's spending too much time in the car and have in the past have had no qualms saying that I am not happy with a request for her to take her son to an after school activity which meant my dd's being in the car for 30 mins during late afternoon when my dd would have fallen asleep in the car meaning they wouldn't go to bed at night as well as having to pick them up later than the agreed time which I wasn't happy with. In this scenario the cm chose not to go ahead with the activity but I was aware that the outcome could have been her choosing to terminate the contract which is her prerogative.

What I am saying is that a cm is offering a service that should come with a contract you are both happy to accept. I expect a cm to put the welfare of the children and wishes of the parents primarily first and accept that they are being paid to provide quality and educational childcare not for mindees to fit around their lives regardless of the impact. On the other hand, as a parent, I understand that a cm needs to see to the needs of their children too and also deserves to be able to make reasonable adjustments to the contract as their circumstances change as well as to run occasional errands just as I need to sometimes during working hours. However, I do expect to be informed up front of anything that will have an impact on my dd's and have the right to say no.

In your situation OP, I would be requesting a chat and discuss your areas of concern to see if you can agree a solution moving forward.

If not, I would be looking for a new cm who would meet my needs and have the same outlook on how the relationship and contract would work or look for a nursery that meets your needs. As someone else said, both have pros and cons For me a good childminder is preferable to a nursery but if I couldn't find a cm I was happy with, I would move to a nursery. Good luck!

Ever thought about having a contract with job description and expectations for her to meet? It astounds me the amount of people who put their most prized blessing into the hands of another without so much of a 'here is what is expected of you and if you do xyz then it is over.'
People lend friends their cars and worry over the insurance. I just don't get it. A CM or Nanny is a business service and therefore should be treated as such. Please, whoever feels like it, do not get all sanctimonious on me and tell me that a child is a commodity - I am well aware of this. There life is more precious than yours, so just cover yourself and your childs and ensure you have all avenues covered before agreeing to take somebody on.

If CM isn't allowed to do the school run, how is she meant to take her kids to school? presumably she had teenage Dcs when you signed her up?

I worked occasionally for a family and it sometimes involved me picking up or dropping off the kids at a CMs. The CM in question used to take her mindees to ASDA with her for two hours every Friday. She'd also plonk them in front of a TV for hours at a time and when I went to pick them up once her house was absolutely spotless - I asked one of the kids about it and he said they were shut off in a spare bedroom with some toys until she'd cleaned and 'had her mug drink' i.e. tea/coffee or whatever. Basically the kids were an inconvenience to her so she went about her daily life as normal most of the time.

The parents ended up switching to a nursery for the youngest and after school care for the oldest and the youngest in particular has changed so much - he's a lot more confident and happy than he was before.

Not hating on CMs at all, I know there are some excellent ones out there but I think if you've got a bad feeling there's no point in keeping your child in a situation where they're unhappy if you can afford not to.

IVant, that works when you employ a nanny. If you engage the services of a CM, you accept/negociate her/his terms, s/he does not dance to your tune.

I like it that my childminder continues her daily life with my children. She does all the sorts of things I would do. It makes her house more like a home from home. She does activities with them too,lots of playing and making things, but she may also pop to the bank or the shop and that is fine too. I like the idea of my children being in a natural and homely environment. I would Not like the idea of an hour long car journey though.

This thread is coming off very classist.