to think this is very wrong?

[47to31in7days]

www.newsrt.co.uk/news/teachers-at-salford-school-help-girl-pupil-15-have-abortion-without-telling-her-parents-488772.html

They ask for CONSENT FORMS to take the kids to a museum in the town centre during school hours...
or to rub sun lotion on little ones...
and they can't use corporal punishment on misbehaving pupils (quite rightly so IMO) even WITH parental consent, while mild smacking is still legal at home...

But when it comes to getting rid of an unwanted baby, suddenly teachers know what's best for a child who isn't theirs and the consent form doesn't get sent because the person who is actually responsible for the girl is a nuisance to be EXCLUDED from all decisions.

AIBU to be annoyed that anyone in a respected position at a school would think this was acceptable?

Yes it is but it isn't usual to prosecute where both parties are under 16 and consent is accepted.

odd isn't it that parents now have so little say in their child's well being, yet have to foo t the bill if anything goes wrong. emotionally and financially.

Age of consent is a very grey area tbh.

Under 13 is rape but between 13 and 16 between 2 consenting teenagers is very very unlikely to result in a prosecution.

I remember several girls who I was at school with who chose to have terminations, all without the knowledge of their parents, and without the support of any familiar adult. It would have been much better if a trusted teacher had been able to support them

I think YABU OP. I have had to deal with a pg student this year- she was 16 though so perhaps it's different... She felt she couldn't tell her parents and so I and my brilliant pastoral support assistant (she is far more knowledgable than I am so she did most of it) helped her by finding out information and listening whenever she needed to talk. Of course the first thing we did was to encourage her to talk to her mum, but she didn't want to and there was no way we could do that against her wishes. It was all very sad in the end. Boyfriend was a druggie, parents divorced and on very poor terms, girl in question living with her brother in a hostel. She didn't want to deal with the fall out of telling her parents. In the end she decided to keep it, THEN told her parents. Sadly she lost the baby and has now dropped out of school.

Really really hate the term "druggie" ESP in relation to a young person .

I think it is very sad that this girl (for whatever reason but squeaky makes a good point as to possible ones) couldn't go to her parents for support.

But I think it's important to remember that this girl probably has to live with her parents for three more years. Yes, she might be removed in certain situations, but there is a very wide gap between the sort of behaviour that would get her removed from parental custody, and the sort of behaviour that would simply make her life extremely scary and unpleasant while she lived at home. If she felt unable to tell her parents, and felt 'ashamed and embarrassed', I don't think it necessarily means she was immature. It could well be that is a normal response to knowing her parents' attitudes.

Remember, at 15 it is hard to know what your options are. I know there are people who leave home at 16 and make a go of it, but it is really hard and at 15 you are not normally in a position to know what's financially viable, or (often) what your legal options are. So she might look back later and think it would have been possible to tell her parents and risk being kicked out, or risk being pressured into a different decision ... but IMO it is not immature of her to decide instead that she can't risk telling them.

I am glad she had the school to support her and it is right that they were concerned for her and not for her parents, since legally she is entitled to take charge of her own body at this age.

As a mother I would always want my child to come to me about any issues they are going through. However, not all parents are approachable, understanding or forgiving. If under the age of 16, the girl would still be a child. If the relationship with her parents is so poor that she can't speak to them about the issues going on in her life then speaking to someone is great. I just don't think a teacher is the right person. I would rather these girls speak to a therapist/psychologist who has the training/experience to help them.

So YABU but I don't think a teacher is the right person.

Yes but a teacher is a lot mre accessible to a young person?!

I was under the impression, possibly incorrect, that most schools had access to some kind of counsellor person for the students these days - is that not the case?

My bf at school got pregnant at 15. Her mother was totally adamant that she was not having an abortion although she wanted one. So she had the baby. She loves her daughter but does regret having her so young.

I totally understand some people being pro or anti abortion for themselves. But I think it is naive to think some girls will judge that it is better not to tell their parents if they want an abortion. And home doesn't have to be a scary and difficult place, just one where the parents are very vocally anti abortion for their own children, without considering that their child has a right to their own and maybe different views.

sensual By all means speak to a teacher but the teacher should be referring them to someone who is experienced in dealing with these matters. I would think that if the girl is not willing to talk to her parents then there are other issues going on. I think it is better to resolve them earlier than later. I expect teachers to teach, not to guide a child through the issues around teen pregnancy.

wish people wouldnt bleat on about the age of consent in threads like this as if they want teens to be in fear of the police, the age of consent is there to protect young children from adults no punish consenting teenagers a smidge under the age of consent

I speak as someone who was accused of having sex at 14 with a 16 year old both the police and social services were involved by the boys crazy mother who both deemed her request for charges ridiculous

If she had the sort of parents she could talk to, then it wouldn't have happened. As the article says, 50% of teenage pregnancies end in abortion in Salford, I would imagine a lot of those teenage girls have told their parents. I also would imagine a lot of those girls didn't feel they could even tell their teachers so went along for that with either no emotional support or just from other teenagers who aren't really going to be giving the best advice.

I'm impressed the school has managed to create the sort of enviornment where she could discuss it with them. Several girls had abortions when I was at school (so they would be 15/16). I know at least one had told her mum, but the others just went and did it, didn't tell parents and certainly wouldn't discuss it with the school. I can't help but think this is an improvement on that situation.

Is it not about building a relationship with an adult you trust though?

Not all schools have a centre like the one we have (counselling and sexual health service which the kids can access during school).

Sensual How it works here in our town in New Jersey, USA is that the school district has two psychologists employed on a full time basis. They conduct assessments to screen for special needs as the children go through school. Both are known, in a positive way, to the children.

A couple of years ago a boy in the middle school passed away from a long term illness. The school psychologists were approached by the older siblings and counselled the two older children as the child went through treatments and after he passed away. It was incredibly sad but I think it was great that the older children had someone to speak to.

The only reason I know about this is that the older child wrote a public letter to thank them for helping his family. The reason for the letter is that some parents in the town want to be informed of all conversations their children have with the psychologists. He disclosed in his letter that his conversations with the psycholgists were in confidence and addressed issues that they didn't want their parents to know about.

My school has a counsellor. He comes in once per week. The pg student I referred to did not want to talk to him as she doesn't know him.

sensual apologies for referring to the boyfriend as a druggie. What would you prefer? Was trying not to type too long a post.

My dd is soon to be 15. Her friends range in age from 13-17. So far, I know of two friends who have needed the MAP, and one who has had an abortion (15).

Only one of these girls has told their parents (about MAP), and the girl who had an abortion lives in terror of her parents finding out.

The service is much needed, and I am very glad that it is there for them.

"In line with her wishes, they didn?t tell her parents but did notify the school."

fair enough imo.

I'm at the number of posters blaming the parents for this situation, sounds a lot like VICTIM BLAMING to me... there is no evidence the parents would not have supported her through an abortion, and if that was the case then they could have been pro-life, it was entirely understandable that they would not want their own daughter to kill an unborn child they see as having the moral right to live (parents are allowed to have moral views against something even if it is legally allowed.)
Or they were pro-choice but opposed to her having sex before she was in a loving stable relationship (or marriage, but most people who go this far are also against abortion.) and the girl wanted to hide the fact she was sexually active from her parents.

It's true that advice from a teacher is more likely to be sensible than from her teenage peers (as a few have said) and better than nothing at all. Do you not think that if the parents were notified, it is more likely that she would have had parental advice though- from the adults who in the vast majority of cases know her best?
It is the school's job to provide PSHE at secondary level which should usually include SRE and therefore pregnancy and how to deal with getting pg unintentionally. That doesn't translate into helping a particular girl go behind the backs of her mum and dad with some child perversion co-ordinator, TLR2, responsibility in fetal demise and moral corruption teacher arranging a trip to the local Marie Stopes. They did discuss it with her and make arrangements before the hospital visit, for the person who said "they did not arrange it so YABU".

The parents are victims? Really?

in what way are the parent's victims?

are you Pro-life OP?

One of the very good reasons for not automatically telling parents is that in some cases, the child may be the victim of abuse within the family. You have to have rules and guidance that does not harm the most vulnerable people in society - which in this case, would be the victims of rape and incest. Then there are families which would react with anger and even violence towards the girl - sadly not unknown.

I am with sensual on "druggie" as it is a grossly negative stereotype and many young people who are serious/dependent drug users are that way due to being sexually abused or major family upheaval and in either case not getting proper professional support when required, so they try to forget/block out the pain with drugs or alcohol. eviltwins, "boyfriend with substance misuse issues" better but it is longer and I can understand if you were trying to post concisely. Even "drug user" sounds less sneery than "druggie".

lattelov3r is right about age of consent not being the big issue here, it's more that under 16s can expect parents to be responsible for them after the medical procedure, not the fact that she had sex at 15.

A teenager has an abortion and the parents are 'victims'? Why?