to have put FIL in his place about nursery

[pointbreak]

Out of the blue he announced he thought it was a shame that DD had gone to nursery at 13 months. She goes 3 days a week, 8.30 - 4.30. She is at home with me the other two days and me, DD and DH spend the weekend as a family. She is happy as larry. He now admits it has benefited her but he didn't think that before she went. Please bear in mind MIL worked in a nursery for 12 years.

He went on to tell me that they were lucky as his wife didn't need to work when their DC were young. I pointed out that we didn't NEED me to work, but my career was important to me and just as valid's as his DS's career, so why should I give it all up. I did have PND for the first 6 months of DD's life and we all know that returning to work can help with that.

So, was IBU? What else should I have said? Or not?

you have to meet your own needs too and feel fulfilled
And no you don't need to be a mummy martyr motherhood isnt a giving things up competition

working is good for you
good role model for dd to have a working mum

and yes the structure of work and approbation you get doing it will mak you happier

I haven't met any obviously bad childminders in the many toddler groups I attend but what I have noticed is that you can pick the childminders out from the mums a mile away. The childminders just don't have the same connection to the children that the mums do, they don't respond to crying or fights as quickly, they're less likely to carry the children around and play with them.

What i worry about with child minders is that you don't know what goes on behind closed doors. You are completely trusting this one other person to care for your child rather than in a nursery where if one person is a bit lacking hopefully there will be others who are not.

Well I've been to plenty of baby and toddler groups in my time, and I think the majority of childminders are very good, some are probably okay ish and a small number might be poor. Just like with parents really! Although having said that, I wouldn't presume to know just from casting my eyes round the room exactly who was a childminder and who was a mum.

Ultimately I think people are going to have their views coloured by their own situation. I will be the first to put my hand up and say I probably has a fairly deep seated reservation about childcare when I had dd. I found it very hard to let go, I didn't feel anyone else could do as well as I could and one of the main factors in resigning my job was that I didn't want to have to use childcare. After starting to use a nursery later on, I realised my feelings were more about ME rather than a logical thing. I realised I could have left dd after maternity leave and things would have been fine. Luckily for me I managed to get back into part time work in my line of em

Sorry posted by mistake! I got back into employment and then just took maternity leave with my ds, and felt much more secure and less PFB about the whole childcare thing.

So I do think people generally tend to be wary of people who simply make different choices, and the danger is when it gets judgemental. I really hope I wasn't judgemental of anyone when I had dd and wasn't using childcare. I don't think i was tbh, in fact if anything I probably felt a little envious of my friends who seemed comfortable with leaving their children and working; it was just something I couldn't bring myself to do then.

SM it is no better to be a working mother than a sahm, in terms of providing a good role model for one's children.

Children need to be loved and well cared for. How individual parents divvy up the responsibilities for providing those things is of no consequence to children, so long as they are in place.

To say you are a good role model purely because you have paid employment is as daft as me saying I am a good role model purely because I looked after my babies myself during the 'working' day. Being a good role model is about what sort of person you are, not whether you generate income.

IMO a child seeing mum working and contributing is good role model
demonstrating the worth of work
both pArents working demonstrates that work isn't just what dad does,that mum works too and is not only housewife

I think there is more to being a good role model than whether a parent works or is at home, so to an extent I agree karma. However, I do think it's a positive thing to normalise working for both parents, if for no other reason than that work is a necessity for nearly everyone. I was fortunate that we could (just) survive on dh's salary after I had dd1 but realistically we could not have suvived long term like that (well not enjoyably anyway). I count myself lucky that I managed to get back into work after two years off, and in retrospect knowing how well it all worked out after ds, I could have gone back after dd too. It all worked out ok for me but I would hate to think people might feel pressured to stay at home because of scaremongering about childcare. Working is really a very normal thing so although it doesn't in itself make you a 'good' or 'bad' mum or dad, I hope my children grow up feeling its perfectly ok (as well as necessary!) to go to work

the act of working demonstrates the merits of working to children
working mums mean our dc see women in a variety of roles and employment
working mum challenges the stereotypical gender roles of mum as housewife, dad as earner.

the act of employment doesn't make on more or less virtuous as such
but employment is good for ones self worth,mental health, and the money is nice too. naturally one is more likely to enjoy work if one likes chosen job

Good for your self worth, mental health etc. Great. Doesn't apply to everyone how arrogant .

what's the humphy face for?
that's research based assertion
people who work consistently score higher on self worth, etc than those who don't

now if that causes you consternation,or you find it arrogant to discuss acknowledged reams of research, well that's a curious reaction to have

Research based assertion hey must be true then. Certainly not my experience no matter how much "research" there is. In fact for me the reverse was true always very suspicious of "experts" telling me how I should be feeling/living my life.

Kerala - of course it doesn't apply to everyone. That's the nature of research and statistics isn't it? But Scottish is correct that the evidence shows overall working is better for mental health. Obviously if you are bored out of your skull in a menial job, or hugely stressed in a in an underfunded role or something then you're probably going to feel better off not working. But you can't deny the evidence that generally working is good for wellbeing.

I have no personal axe to grind- as I say I was a SAHM for 2 years, and my instinct was that I could do a better job being home full time than using childcare. I think looking back now with a bit of distance my dd would have been just as fine if I had returned earlier.

Anyway it is only on mumsnet that people get very defensive about working and staying at home. In real life people just get on with it

one can make what one wants of research
just as it's a fact that smoking is detrimental,someone will pop up and comment they know someone who smoked 60 day and did them no harm

Exactly - I have never and would never comment on what anyone else is doing with regard to working/childcare. Stand by my opinion that making statements that my way is "right" and supported by "research" is not something I would do either but each to their own...Read Deborah Orr in this weeks guardian on valuing only work that generates profit - very interesting.

I would agree that the act of working demonstrates the merits of working to children. However, I don't think it is necessary for children to specifically see their mum working in paid employment, in order for them to develop a work ethic. I think the important thing is that they see their parents doing whatever is necessary to provide all the care that they need. If you (generic you, not you specifically) do your job as a parent properly, they will grow up knowing that financial provision may come from either or both of their parents and that families divvy up provision of care in the way that suits their particular family.

Doing one thing isn't more important than the other.

I also disagree with the notion that a sahm reinforces stereotypes - my mum has been both, I have been both. My mil has always worked, as did my gran. The stereotype doesn't exist in a lot of households. Most people do what suits them at the time.

I don't view myself as 'only' a housewife. I view myself as someone who made a choice and may in the future change that choice. Arguably I'm showing my dc that people have options - that there isn't one path in life.

I think my mental health is okay too

SM, I'm not saying that you aren't a good role model btw, only that your way isn't the only example of how to be one. I think I'm a pretty good one for my children, too.

I had a bit of a dilemma with my own child regarding nursery. I work in a private one in town, returned to work 4 days a week after mat leave. DS would be there 2 days a week. Not my initial choice if I'm honest but no spaces in another nursery and the other one in my town has a seriously bad rep.

He hated it. I could hear him screaming down the corridor and upstairs. I felt awful knowing my child was unhappy but because I was working, his care was out of my hands. Even if I did go see him for a moment or 2, it made things worse. I started considering a childminder, thinking he wasn't cut out for the busy hustle and bustle of nursery.

But, I'm currently off work due to possible prolapsed spinal disc and he is still going nursery as I can't look after him by myself. And he loves it. Before he wouldn't eat, sleep, drink his milk (his favourite thing) or rarely play. Now he has seconds of lunch, enjoys all the activities, still doesn't sleep much but he has come home happy and bubbly.

So when I finally return to work I will probably have to change his child care. It's him knowing I'm there that makes him unhappy. Although I know he gets great care, it does neither of us any good. So, I'm still considering a childminder but will see how he is once I return to work.

What works for one person doesn't for another. People have differing views, its to be accepted. Just ignore comments made by your FIL, you didn't say anything bad but don't feel the need to justify your decisions :)

naturally we all do what we think is right

Agree with all karma said. Don't think smoking is a good analogy at all this is much more complex than something which has a proven negative impact on health.

That said DD (aged 3) said today that her ambition is to "push a really big pram"

give you're suspicious of research and experts I'm surprised you care what the smoking research is

My dd (4) wants to be a doctor . Smugness cancelled out by ds's ambition, which is to be rich

Not suspicious of scientifically proven stuff am not a moron . Just the social sciences this is how you bring up your child oops no this is how you do it (Bowlby disproved now believed at the time), childcare bad for children, oops no good for children etc etc

so you'll be onside that working is good for ones mental health!
that's robust,rigorous reserch
glad we now concur that work is good for mental health

I think if you have a career you love and/or earn pots of money, then working may well be beneficial to your mental health. If, otoh, you have a dead end, poorly paid job or desperately want to be at home with your children, but have no choice, then I don't suppose that paid employment does much to improve happiness levels.

I don't think it's as black and white as just saying that work is good for mental health.