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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

LAPDANCE

533 replies

reeniemartini · 24/04/2012 18:08

Hi,

I'll try to keep this as brief as possible but my head is a bit all over the place.

I'm getting married in October, we've been together 8 years and engaged for 18 months. I have always felt that i hit the jackpot with him, talented, funny kind and trustworthy. he came back from a stag weekend with mutual friends on Sunday night - and last night he told me they went to a lap dancing club and he paid for a dance. £20 - 3 mins.
I was floored. I always thought I was cool with that kind of stuff, thought it was even a bit of a giggle, one of my friends was even a lap dancer for a few years - so I am surprised how angry and upset I am.
He cried. He said he was sorry, he was stupid, he was too drunk and got caught up in the moment. He said he had to tell me because he never wanted to have any secrets from me, he said he was also upset because he didn't think it would feel like cheating but it did.
I asked for all the details even though I didn't want to hear, what did she look like? How/why did he choose her. Apparently it was as soon as they got through the door and she was the first that offered. It wasn't in a private area, she knickers on, a fishnet top and no bra. (God I feel sick just typing that)
I guess I'm so upset because I would have bet my life that he would NEVER do such a thing and now i feel stupid. I took my ring off - more to show how angry I was than anything and he looked like he was going to throw up - he just crumbled.
The groom didn't get a dance - and for some reason that makes it worse. His other friends did - they have all been married less than a year. I said it feels like the first chance you had you all disrespected your partners without any question or forethought. You all just conformed to the worst stereotype when I so much more faith in you than that.
Am I being unreasonable. i just don't know how to feel. I'm angry, upset but on the other hand am I just being a drama queen? He's promised me he'll never do anything like it again, that I don't deserve it and it was a stupid mistake. I just don't know how to feel.

OP posts:
Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 19:26

Reenie you are not being stupid for being upset about this.

Willowisp · 25/04/2012 19:27

Perhaps you are shocked by the unusualness & unexpectedness of it all ?

Hopefully all this has helped work its way out of your system & you can both move on together Smile.

Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 19:27

Right MrGin.

Sexual exploitation and the gender hierarchy are hilarious aren't they?

symfem · 25/04/2012 19:28

So you sound like you know a thing or two. So why not genuflect on what this man means to you. Is it a slight over reaction.

MrMiyagi · 25/04/2012 19:32

Yabvu.

MissCeliaFoote · 25/04/2012 19:38

Reenie - you are not stupid for being upset, I'd be very upset too! A private dance IS a sleazy thing to do. At the same time though, he is clearly trying really hard to make it up to you and is normally a great guy. So now is the time to forgive him, because I am sure you're both going to be fine. I think you should both draw a line under it and get back to planning your wedding. Good luck.

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 19:41

Belleflowers

They don't know. He was really reluctant to tell me who a participated and who hadn't but I was determined to blow that "brotherhood" shit out of the water. On the other hand, I won't say anything to the other wives as I don't feel it's my place. One of them in particular has major body issues after spending 15 years recovering from anorexia. She's told me she would have a fit if they even considered going to a lap dancing club. It would cause SERIOUS issues between them, they have a child and have been married less than a year. as for the groom not having a dance - believe me I didn't let that one go. It was the first thing I pointed out. In a perverse way it may have made it a little better.
I want the other blokes to know that I know however. I don't want them thinking the "bro's before ho's" motto has any place in mine and DP'S relationship. If that makes them anxious, worried or uncomfortable around me.....good. If it makes them nervous that I may let something slip.....good. Maybe shitting themselves about their other halves finding out will make them look closer at what they've done. Perhaps they'll realise that what they think is, just a laugh actually isn't that funny when it comes down to it. Maybe they'll come to conclusion all by themselves that they did something they knew would be hurtful to their new wives. Coming to that realisation on their own is, I think, far better than being told it.
And no I don't consider myself the moral police - just one mightily pissed off lady!

OP posts:
reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 19:42

Willowisp

I think you may be right.

OP posts:
symfem · 25/04/2012 19:48

Now you have entered the crazy stakes. What does it concern you, who did what and with whom. You sound like you are on a crusade to condemn all who go to those clubs, yet had no issue flaunting your body when it suited you. Would you go round each guy who ogled you and tell them you knew they looked at you. Grow up, you arent ready for an adult relationship

larrygrylls · 25/04/2012 19:50

Reenie,

You sound remarkably sane. I just think that no one is perfectly "nice" all the time and that most men and women will behave in ways that their partners may be particularly happy about. It is a question of degree and what constitutes a small annoyance and what a major relationship hurdle. To me, this is at worst a small annoyance. I guess, to others, it is more.

Beachcomber,

The £48k comes from the Daily Mail but is based on that survey. I assume they have extrapolated the per session income into a yearly number. Again, I am assuming that they can make reasonable assumptions and perform basic multiplication.

"Nowhere have I said that women who work in lap dancing are not conscious beings. Why are you making things up about me Larry?"

You have not said it explicitly but implied it by repeatedly insisting that they are victims of a misogynistic culture, and not people making logical and optimal decisions as to what to do with their time.

"I don't like lap dancing because I think it is a seedy, sexist, racist, ageist, abelist, exploitative gender hierarchy."

With the exception of "seedy" you have only missed out sexual orientationalist and then you would have the full house of "isms".

"Yes, women do use sexuality to get by in a sex obsessed male dominated society, no shit sherlock."

Again, the above assumes that these women are "getting by" and not doing pretty well for themselves. When some woman with zero education instantly becomes a millionairess by marrying a premiereship footballer, she seems actually be enjoying an advantage over a man with a similar background. You very rarely hear of men advancing so quickly both socially and monetarily based on their looks alone.

"What has hairdressing got to do with sexual encounters?"

You have decided to restrict this discussion to "sexual" encounters, not me. I am discussing objectification in totality and saying that it occurs in many walks of life where one person is paying another person for a service and is not inherently a bad thing.

Belleflowers · 25/04/2012 19:50

you're right, yes, you will have the upper hand over his mates on this, as he will probably possibly have told them already that he has told you and you are upset by it

so yes, in a way, you are in a strong position with them

but no i wouldnt directly tell the other partners how upset you are with him as it will make a massive drama within all your circle of friends, putting people against each other

plus, it is simply your business, between the 2 of you (and we your online mumsnetters) and if any of the other partners ask you, it will be because they found out via their own partners, not you iyswim

it will take a bit of time to get over it, but yanbu to feel gutted

(was kind of joking about the materialistic therapy too, as completely see how buying you things wont heal it, but just thought he needs to be really stepping up to make it up to you now)

but do think he sounds like one of the more decent guys from his pack of 'bros'

male pack mentality probably had a lot to play in it too

Belleflowers · 25/04/2012 19:58

plus yes, if you are familiar with 'cage dancing' as you say you have been, then surely, if you agreed to 'be' a cage dancer, then you cant really logically and morally for any length of time 'diss' your fiancee about one regretful 3 min dance on a stag do...double standards are coming out here a bit

BUT then, you werent engaged to someone at that time and you didnt pay to see someone one to one for a dance

dunno

i'd just avoid him for a while until i felt better, do my own thing for a while, get my head cleared - go to a movie, read a book, go out for a walk or somewhere in your evenings - you'll soon forget about it hopefully - IF he keeps up being extra specially on best behaviour

maybe draw up a list together on your hopes for your marriage -

ask him really nicely and gently - still showing him youre still upset- to please give you a list of why he wants to marry you - that should really make him FOCUS

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 20:07

symfem
yup maybe your right. I think that's what happens when you get angry. Also I'd like to add that I'm in my mid 30's now. My dancing days are long gone, I never took my clothes off or touched a man when i danced. I have no right to judge those that do. My only concern is the choices my OH made.

Belleflowers I have no intention of ever mentioning this to any of the other guys. I don't want to ever get into a discussion with them about it. I wouldn't dream of saying anything to their OH's. I'm just cross.

OP posts:
Malificence · 25/04/2012 20:16

I'd make sure that all the men who visited with him knew exactly how pathetic I thought they were and if any of their partners ever asked directly if their bloke was one of the herd, I would have no hesitation about telling them.

For a man to participate when he knows that his partner would be devastated, as in the case of the woman who told you as much, that is beyond dispicable, utterly inexcusable. His lack of respect, lack of even basic human decency towards her is just awful.

thebody · 25/04/2012 20:24

I think u r now completely going over the top, if my dh had been to a lap dance club, (he has)and i have been to c strippers, )and some youngster wet behind the ears, (you btw) decided to Report to me what dh had done because your bf had Told u I would actually laugh.

Grow up, you are In danger of treating him and acting like his mother ffs.

I had some sympathy for u at the beginning but you are now do wrapped up in moral indignation it's ridiculous.

runningforthebusinheels · 25/04/2012 20:31

How on earth are hairdressers objectified?? The lapdancing industry is full of seedy exploitation of women, trafficked women whose bodies are literally 'for sale' as in a cattle market. I can't think of a hairdressers like that.

Reenie, yanbu to be upset. Whenever there are threads on this topic women are basically told to put up and shut up - I don't agree with this outlook at all. It doesn't have to be the end of a relationship, particularly as in your case he understood that it felt like cheating on you, he owned up and he was full of remorse. But if I were you I would need to have a long conversation with him about it - along the lines of why he thinks women's bodies are for sale.

Willowisp · 25/04/2012 20:37

I think beyond despicable & utterly inexcusable are completely ridiculous statements. It was a drunken night out, he's sorry etc etc.

Op - please don't let your brain become full of everyone else's anger. He made a mistake, he 'fessed up, shut this post down.

Althought I do agree with telling the other men's Oh's...Grin

symfem · 25/04/2012 20:38

Maliceinence. Grow up and enter the real world. Other people live their lives, its not for you to go around spilling all and sundry.

And the poster talking about womens bodies on sale. Ban all advertising, ban fashion models, actresses, etc.

ReactionaryFish · 25/04/2012 20:39

I think you need to take a step back from this. i totally agree on the idiocy of male solidarity on these issues and would advise strongly against marrying a man who engaged in it; such men are not ready for marriage, they are too immature. But so far as the other men and their partners are concerned that is their problem. you're focus is whether you're partner is fit marriage material. You need to concentrate on that, let others take care of themselves.
i think you are probably focussing on them to deflect you from your own problems.

Charbon · 25/04/2012 20:39

I think perhaps you can make this experience count for something OP.

If you're right that your partner is one of the good guys, why don't you both start challenging this culture of lads nights out that always have to feature women selling sexual services? Share your views with women friends who think they have to suck it up. Expect your partner to make his voice heard amongst his mates.

Does he have the moral courage to do that though? Do you?

ReactionaryFish · 25/04/2012 20:41

and btw, thebody, tolerating lapdancing is not a sign of maturity. it is a sign of gullibility, or giving up, or being so desperate for male endorsement you will tolerate rotten behaviour.
none of these are admirable qualities.

Charbon · 25/04/2012 20:42

As is textspeak Wink

PurpleRomanesco · 25/04/2012 20:43

What a lovely dismissive post there thebody, Beautifully patronizing.

Look, Just because you are OK with your husband paying a complete stranger to arouse him doesn't mean she should be. Her feelings and opinions are just as valid as yours.

MissCeliaFoote · 25/04/2012 20:51

thebody, you may enjoy seeing male strippers, that's fine, I certainly don't, I also don't think the objectification of the men somehow 'evens out' the sexual exploitation of women. I find all of it cringe-inducing, disgusting, and sleazy. Just because you've seen strippers and so has your husband doesn't mean OP needs to 'get a grip'. She was completely right to be angry with him, but will also be completely right to forgive him.
Anyway this thread is descending into madness. The OP had a problem with it, now her fiancé is sorry and going to make it up to her, and hopefully never do this again. Problem solved!

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 20:57

It's alright everyone. I have my sane head on now, there was a bit of mental venting going on there. I got a bit crazy there for a moment but I'm back in the room.
It's done, over with and we will deal with it. There are far bigger issues going on in the world. Onwards and upwards.

OP posts: