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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

LAPDANCE

533 replies

reeniemartini · 24/04/2012 18:08

Hi,

I'll try to keep this as brief as possible but my head is a bit all over the place.

I'm getting married in October, we've been together 8 years and engaged for 18 months. I have always felt that i hit the jackpot with him, talented, funny kind and trustworthy. he came back from a stag weekend with mutual friends on Sunday night - and last night he told me they went to a lap dancing club and he paid for a dance. £20 - 3 mins.
I was floored. I always thought I was cool with that kind of stuff, thought it was even a bit of a giggle, one of my friends was even a lap dancer for a few years - so I am surprised how angry and upset I am.
He cried. He said he was sorry, he was stupid, he was too drunk and got caught up in the moment. He said he had to tell me because he never wanted to have any secrets from me, he said he was also upset because he didn't think it would feel like cheating but it did.
I asked for all the details even though I didn't want to hear, what did she look like? How/why did he choose her. Apparently it was as soon as they got through the door and she was the first that offered. It wasn't in a private area, she knickers on, a fishnet top and no bra. (God I feel sick just typing that)
I guess I'm so upset because I would have bet my life that he would NEVER do such a thing and now i feel stupid. I took my ring off - more to show how angry I was than anything and he looked like he was going to throw up - he just crumbled.
The groom didn't get a dance - and for some reason that makes it worse. His other friends did - they have all been married less than a year. I said it feels like the first chance you had you all disrespected your partners without any question or forethought. You all just conformed to the worst stereotype when I so much more faith in you than that.
Am I being unreasonable. i just don't know how to feel. I'm angry, upset but on the other hand am I just being a drama queen? He's promised me he'll never do anything like it again, that I don't deserve it and it was a stupid mistake. I just don't know how to feel.

OP posts:
Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 12:34

Larry you have already linked to that report on a thread on MN and I have already commented on it. Here is what I said;

Larry are you having a laugh?

From your report;

Disadvantages included: never knowing how much money they would make; keeping the job secret; customers being rude/abusive; competing with other dancers.

Most women felt safe at work, although nearly half reported frequent verbal harassment and unwanted touching from customers.

Dancers? status as ?self employed? workers resulted in exploitation as they had no rights or recognition in the workplace.

Overheads were high: house fees, commission on dances, and fines (often arbitrary) for breaking ?house rules? reduced capacity to earn and most dancers had left a shift not making any money.

The current focus on licensing does not consider the welfare or working conditions of the dancers.

Dancers had to pay ?house fees? ranging from £0-£200, though it usually was around £20-30 in the North and around £80 in the South. On dancer explains: In the clubs the house fees are so enormous it puts you in such a stressful position to start up with; it?s not a good attitude to go and start working from.

70% reported losing money at work.

61% of dancers had been fined at some point in their dancing career. The highest reported fine was £100 for a missed shift. The most common fines were for chewing gum, using mobile phone on the floor and lateness.

50% reported working in clubs where there was an internal tipping systems to DJs, waitresses, bar staff and house mums, which in effect acted as an additional fee.

Dancers were also asked an open question about what they liked least about the job. Inappropriate customer behaviour, including abusive language, touching or soliciting sex, was consistently cited by dancers as one of the more negative elements of the job.

Insurance: Very few dancers had work related insurance. Some vaguely knew that they needed it, but others had never thought about it and no-one had ever spoken to them about it.

Security: In order to improve security, panic alarms, more CCTV and doormen were cited as important. Similarly, many felt that the way in which private booths were set up also endangered them and also allowed standards to be lowered by dancers offering more than is allowed in the dances.

Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 12:38

Sigmunde we all have agendas to one degree or another.

Bindel's is researching and publishing reports on violence against women and children in order to take action to reduce that violence.

Mine is speaking out about male violence and supporting women who have suffered male violence.

Yours appears to be attacking women who speak out against male violence.

Hey ho.

SigmundFraude · 25/04/2012 12:40

'Yours appears to be attacking women who speak out against male violence.'

Nice attempt at a shaming tactic there, and also untrue.

Hey ho.

Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 12:45

Shaming tactic? Confused.

I just posted a respected report from a well known researcher on violence against women and children. You slagged off the author and said you would ignore the report. I pointed out that you are attacking a woman who speaks out against male violence. I have no interest in 'tactics' or 'shaming' - I'm just pointing out a plain fact. Do with it what you will.

SigmundFraude · 25/04/2012 12:52

That 'well known researcher' wrote an article titled 'Why I hate men'. Any credibility she may have had evaporated right there. Mind you, at least she had the guts to state the bleedin' obvious, so a grudging admiration there.
Most radfems maintain their anonymity and say the same thing, albeit with different words.

Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 13:02

Um Sigmunde perhaps you should read things in their entirety rather than use just the titles to dismiss them?

Bindel's article is making a point. The point she is making is that women who speak out against violence are often accused of being man-haters. Which is pretty much what you are doing to her on this thread so it is no wonder you don't understand her point.

She cites a whole bunch of depressing cases of male violence and then says the following; The irony is I and other feminists who fight against male violence towards women and children are labelled "man haters". Am I missing something? It is men who hate women, going on the evidence of the above cases, and the millions of incidents of battery, child sexual abuse, rape, sexual harassment, torture and murder of women and girls by boys and men.

Anyway, nice way to ignore her report and derail this thread.

SigmundFraude · 25/04/2012 13:18

Listen, that article is PERFECT for the other thread..if you feel that the sentiment is justified then use it. You're missing a golden opportunity here, I don't quite understand why you haven't.

'Bindel's article is making a point. The point she is making is that women who speak out against violence are often accused of being man-haters.'

Radfems aren't called man-haters purely because they speak out against violence and you know it. They also speak out against clothes labels (sexist), lego figures (sexist), makeup, clothing, marriage, jobs, schools just about anything you care to name...and men, or 'the patriarchy' get the blame. Men get the blame for absolutely everything a radfem considers 'unnaceptable' in today's society, including global warming!!

Radfems also assert that women cannot take responsibility for anything because their beliefs are not their own, they are 'conditioned' by the patriarchy. Therefore the escalating violence committed by women goes unchallenged or explained away.

As far as radfems are concerned, men can take a long walk off a short pier..and THAT is why they are called man haters - not purely because they speak out against violence committed by men.

thebody · 25/04/2012 13:32

Jesus, anyway op are you calling off your wedding and potentially ruining both of your lives and futures together over a stupid incident that your bf told u about and said sorry for.

Beachcomber · 25/04/2012 13:35

Whatever Sigmund. You have expressed your views on radical feminists to me before. I'm not really very interested. Nearly every thread I have been on with you, no matter what the subject, ends up with you expressing your dislike for what you understand to be the man hating ways of radical feminists.

Saying as I am a radical feminist, forgive me if I don't indulge you again. Anyway we are now seriously taking this thread of topic so I'll leave you to it.

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 13:50

BettySwollocksandaCrustyRack
He didn't start of in full blown "WAH" crying mode. He was extremley hungover, I think we all feel a bit tearful when we're like that.
Firstly I voiced my diappointment (which if I remember being told off by my parents is worse than getting shouted out), then I got angry, then as I began to think about the details I got upset. By then I was shocked at how strongly I did feel about it. I certainly never expected to cry myelf over a thing like that.
It was when he saw how upset I was that he started to cry. I took my engagment ring off for a minute or so, more to just look at it and consider what it meant, what it should mean and what I expected from it - THAT'S when he really cried. He said he felt everything slipping away and that he had really, royally f*ed things up for the sake of 3 stupid minutes.

larrygrylls
We do actually talk about most stuff. We've never really been tested before, never had any major issues and always treated eachother with respect. Yes I have told him when I've gone out and been flirted with. For example," how was last night? Great I was talking to this about xyz, I think he thought he was in there" We don't sit down with a long list "a la confessional", we just.....talk about shit and usually laugh. Also, I have my own money that I buy my shoes with.

OP posts:
melika · 25/04/2012 13:52

bettyswallocks I stand with you on this.

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 14:06

Oh and he was drunk but I don't buy the "he didn't know what he was doing", he knew what he was doing but according to him he got swept / carried away. The dance was 3 mins but the whole process was over in 4 and by then it was too late. He said it all felt wrong, I was angry because he had a chance to stop it at any point - before saying yes to the dance, before paying her, when she sat him down, in the middle of it. Any of those points you have a "yes" path and a "no" path. He chose the wrong one at every turn. 5 minutes don't define a relationship but they can sure as hell shake and unsettle it.

OP posts:
BettySwollocksandaCrustyRack · 25/04/2012 14:12

But it wasnt as if he KNEW how you felt was it..you say yourself you didnt even know and even thought it was a giggle! Maybe you have always seemed relaxed about it and so he was genuinly shocked by your reaction.

Still, he knows now doesnt he. Seriously not worth chucking a good relationship for though surely??

AutumnSummers · 25/04/2012 14:18

What Bettyswallock said.

reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 14:25

BettySwollocksandaCrustyRack
I agree. I never said to him - Oh I'd just laugh if you paid for a lapdance, I've always just had a rather withering attitude. I think we are both very clear where we stand now. Both of us have learnt something. It was just a slightly more painful education than I would have liked. I guess that's when your relationship gets tested though isn't it? Not when it's all rainbows and kittens but when shitty stuff happens.

OP posts:
reeniemartini · 25/04/2012 14:26

I think it's a good rule that if you are nervous about telling your partner about something you've done you probably know deep down that you've crossed a line that you shouldn't have.

OP posts:
LeBOF · 25/04/2012 14:28

Well, I'd say that
All opinions are
Normally worth reading- people who
Know their stuff are
Erudite and interesting.
Really not so true of MrBojangles1.

larrygrylls · 25/04/2012 14:28

Beachcomber

"Larry are you having a laugh?"

Nope, not really. You have quoted the negatives from that report. Do you accept that most LDs make good money and do it of their own volition (which was the report's main conclusion)?

Whatmeworry · 25/04/2012 14:29

I guess that's when your relationship gets tested though isn't it? Not when it's all rainbows and kittens but when shitty stuff happens.

Bingo. And if you think this is a biggie, you ain't seen nuffin yet....

TheOtherSideOfTheCoin · 25/04/2012 14:31

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

BettySwollocksandaCrustyRack · 25/04/2012 14:53

She probably wasnt a tart though otherside - just someone trying to make a living, same as all of us!

thebody · 25/04/2012 15:13

Most guys and women wouldn't have told their partners this anyway.

How can anyone say a lap dance is cheating.??? I mean how ridiculous.

Op move on, he fucked up and I expect so will you in some way over a long marriage.

runningforthebusinheels · 25/04/2012 15:55

Larry: are you comparing a man being chatted up in a bar with a man paying a lapdancer for a dance? Strange, but I can see what you're trying to do. Wink

Everyone is indeed entitled to their opinions, but I do fail to see how minimising an OP's obvious distress is helpful in the slightest.

doormat · 25/04/2012 15:58

i think your dh's actions spk louder than words..he seems so remorseful and sorry for what he has done and at least he gave you the respect to tell you more or less straight away.....

i would still be angry with him though as it is a disrespectful thing to do..but i honestly believe he wont do it again

runningforthebusinheels · 25/04/2012 16:06

'Like' LeBOF's poem. Grin

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