To feel confused and upset by being ignored

[CaffeineShadow]

Since I have become a mum I have found it hard to make friends with other mums who are on the same wavelength as me. I have lots of old friends who have no children.
Last summer I made a new mummy friend that I met at a playgroup and we got on amazingly well. She has a 3 year old DD as do I. So began a really good friendship where we met up a lot with the children and without. The two girls were calling each other "best friends". She also lives just down the road from me so very handy. She invited me to go to Circus of Horrors with her and we just got on amazingly well and had a lot in common. I started to confide in her about private stuff, naturally.
My DD is a very spirited child, her emotions are so strong whether good or bad.If she doesn't get her own way she screams so loudly, it's quite embarrassing, she can get very hitty and have lots of tantrums. When we met up with the children we had to watch them a lot as they were either totally in love or fighting. But we used to laugh about it as it's quite common at their age.
After a little while of these meetings she came over our house with her daughter and my DD started getting very upset and unruly as her friend was playing with DDs toys. She ended up hitting my friend's DD and having an embarrassing screaming tantrum and so they swiftly left and I obviously punished my DD as much as I could and warned her that her friend's mummy may not allow her DD round to ours anymore if she carried on like that every time.
A few weeks passed where I didn't hear from my friend so I texted her and she said she had just been busy. I asked her if she and her DD would like to meet me and my DD at the park as I thought they would both be out in the fresh air together and they don't have to share any toys.
As soon as they got there I had my back to the children as I said hi to my friend and she was facing them. She suddenly shouted out that my DD was kicking sand at her DD. I quickly picked her up to take her to a table to give her a warning. I told her if it carried on we would go home as it is dangerous and naughty to kick sand. She had a scream and cry then agreed she wouldn't do it again. A few seconds later she was doing it again and my friend looked really pissed off (I don't blame her, so was I!) So again I took her away and she said she needed the toilet so off we went to the toilet and I was going home afterwards. We got back to the park and my friend said she was going. I said I'd just get my stuff together and walk with her. She said she had to go immediately.
After that we were supposed to meet up one on one whilst the girl's where at nursery but when it came to the day she cancelled saying she had totally forgotten she was supposed to meet me so had arranged to meet her family. After that I texted her again about meeting up and she sent a vague msg saying that we should meet up sometime.
A couple of weeks ago I told her about a fete that was on which her and her DD came to but she hardly spoke to me at all and then left as soon as her daughter fell over in the playground. She said we should meet up in the easter holidays.
Over the easter holidays I texted her about three times asking if she wanted to meet up and apologising once again for DDs behaviour to her DD and she sent back vague msgs saying "next week sometime" and didn't mention the apology. When next week came I didn't hear anything.
I have stopped texting her now as I feel like I am chasing and chasing and making myself look like a stalker!
But AIBU to want her to just tell me if she doesn't want to be friends with me and stop skirting around the issue? I am quite upset as we had so much in common and I really thought I had found a really good friend.
If you get this far with the reading, you are amazing and thank you!

I agree with the others I'm afraid.

OP, I don't mean to be rude but are you firm with your DD or are you more of a soft touch with her? I ask this as I've distanced myself from a friend with a hitter before as she just used to say 'play nicely' when her son laid into my son, or she'd just ignore him hitting and biting. I didn't mind the violence, as it's totally normal for toddlers, so much as I minded her lazy attitude to discipline. If you come across that way maybe that could be why your friend has distanced herself as she will be feeling like you are not taking the matter seriously.

Thank you everyone. And I have been doing a lot of things she enjoys with her just me and her. I was dreading a day in town the other day but we actually had a lovely time together and it wore her out so much that she actually slept all night :). I have been taking her to soft play, swimming and baking cookies and cakes with her. She will be starting school in sept when she is 4+1 so maybe this will see an improvement to her behaviour.
And I will leave contacting my "friend" and let her come to me when/if she feels the time is right.

And thanks for letting me blaaaah! :o

OP, I think you sound like you're doing all the right things to tackle your DD's behaviour. I cannot understand why some posters think you're in denial.

Obviously, phrases like "spirited child" rub some people up the wrong way, but if it helps you to work out strategies for improving things then that's all that matters.

There is a middle ground between having an angelic child who never misbehaves, and one who cannot play with other kids without hitting and biting!
My child is far from angelic, likes to argue with everything I say, will try and get his own way at every opportunity, is highly emotional and questioning and give him an inch he will take a mile,
BUT he doesn't hit because I have never excused that kind of behaviour!.

I have come across children who hit and push and bite many times, and every time the parents are not dealing with it.
One child used to hit my son a lot, and was simply made to say sorry, which he did with a smirk, which made it obvious that he knew he could do whatever he liked as long as he said the sorry word afterwards.

I've been on both sides of the issue - we used to spend time with a mum and her DS who was regularly aggressive towards my DD so I did withdraw from the friendship.

A few months later DD went through the same phase, being aggressive towards other children, and although luckily I didn't lose any friends over it I did sense their displeasure. Very uncomfortable, so I can definitely see where your friend is coming from.

Its probably really upset her too but like a poster said, its incredibly hard to be totally honest about something like this. Ironically because she probably doesn't want to hurt your feelings.

Give friendship a wide birth and just see what happens. I know - easier said than done!

hth

I have come across children who hit and push and bite many times, and every time the parents are not dealing with it.

I have found the same.

I wouldn't say every parent of a hitter I have met condones the behaviour - not by a long shot - but their methods are lacklustre and have no impact, so the issue is not resolved.

You will either have to be firm with your DD, or see if you can have an adult friendship without the DCs around.

I have speed read the thread, so apologies if I missed any, but I would say you should contact your friend, say that you understand that your child is a handful, and it is best if you meet up without the kids, say that you would like to maintain an adult friendship, and suggest going out for a drink maybe one evening.

One child used to hit my son a lot, and was simply made to say sorry, which he did with a smirk, which made it obvious that he knew he could do whatever he liked as long as he said the sorry word afterwards

Yes, I too have across the "say sorry and that will be the end of it" school of discipline.

So he said sorry because he was told to. Big whoop.

Hmm I think this one is up to you, either accept your child is naughty and try and do something about it, or just make excuses and call it high spirits I guess it depend on whether you both want to have friends. I don't know any children of 3 who hit and kick sand in other kids faces and to be fair whether she was spirited or not wouldn't make any difference to me if I were the parent of the child being hurt.

I used to hate it when any of mine had been hit/bitten and the parent would encourage their child yo then give mine s hug and a kiss to say sorry - cue my child backing away in terror as her aggressor comes back towards her, mouth open, arms outstretched.

I think it's important for a child to understand that when they do something like this, it is not about them and s the attention should be on the child who has been hurt.

Spirited my left foot. An intelligent child can be naughty. Look she does not want a friendship with you anymore, which is a shame. Its sad that she will not meet up without the kids bit however hard it is, you have to accept that and move on.

OP, I'm sorry you've had a rough time on this thread.

I actually think your friend has not treated you very well here. Is it really so hard to say: Hey, it's a bit stressful getting the girls together these days, why don't we just go out for a drink sometime?

I don't understand why this would be so hard. I mean, it's pretty bleeding obvious what's going on and you have suggested yourself meeting up without DC.

I think at this point you need to just let her go. If she can't talk to you about this stuff then she was probably never going to be a very reliable friend anyway.

Do you still see your old friends?

I also don't have many mum friends but still have all my old friends, you're much better off sticking with the people who really care about you.

I don't post very often on mn as am quite new to all this, but I just feel so sorry for you about this and really want to give you some support.
IMHO you're dd is not doing anything that many other 3yo do and it sounds to me that you have always handled it really well, always disciplining and not being too precious.
My 3 yo can also be a nightmare with others and it can really make you feel crap when you're in a social situation with other mums who have more docile children.
Unfortunately although in my opinion you have done nothing wrong you may just have to put this down to experience and please don't let it put you off trying to meet others. Keep going to playgroups and activities and hopefully you will meet a kindred spirit, who will support you, not look down on you.
What area do you live in? Message me if you want, it would be great if you are near to me.

I don't think the OP has had anything like a rough time. I think people have been honest with her without being rude. People have told her that it sounds like her daughter's hitting and temper has soured things between her and her friend.

The OP responded with "she's not being naughty...she's just spirited"

We've ALL heard that one before, so we are exchanging virtual wry grins.

This might sound slightly odd, but could you cultivate a friendship with another mum with a 'spirited' (pushy / hitty / whatever) child? My DS1 went through a pushy / biting phase from about 2 - almost 3. We ended up spending loads of time with a mum and daughter we met at a toddler group - her DD was very similar (we bonded over always being the ones to leave our tea half drunk and have to scoop up screaming child and leave the group early due to some incident or other). We had to watch the children like hawks when they were together - there was always some minor act of violence. We both had very similar strategies to deal with the behaviour - immediate time out, then discussion and apology, and going straight home if it happened again. A mum in a similar position is more likely to understand you cutting a play date short for these sorts of reasons. Fastforward a year and my DS and her DD adore each other and play together beautifully. I hugely appreciate the opportunity I had to be able to teach my child to share and be gentle in a "safe" environment, i.e. one where I knew we weren't being judged and where he would see this child being subject to the same rules as he was.

From my experience I don't think your DD is doing anything particularly unusual, but I do think that, especially at aged 3, this behaviour is naughty and needs to be dealt with as such. She'll get it in the end.

And for what it's worth, I think the OP comes across as a great mum...but the hitting has to stop. It has been going on for some time, as the OP and her friend used to laugh about it...but as the behaviour has continued her friend has ceased to find it funny.

It is common, but for it to go on for a protracted period of time means that it becomes less about it being common at that age, and goes on to become a problem.

Hmm, I think it's been a bit rough. She's been told she's in denial about her child and not doing anything about it even though clearly she is seeking support and trying all manner of coping techniques. She's had the obligatory mention of ASD. Most people are saying her friend was right to dump her with no explanation.

FWIW I don't think my own DC is spirited and I've never actually heard anyone use the term in real life, so I have no bias here!

I think people are maybe projecting a lot from people they know who do nothing about their rowdy children.

Gosh some of you have such perfect children and such Amazing parenting skills don't you?

Nothing the OP has said suggests she is not dealing with the behaviour of her daughter. In fact quite the opposite. I really feel for you OP it is very difficult when they go through this phase and some take longer to come out of it than others. With firm guidance from you she will be fine.

As for your friend. I would send one message to explain hoe you feel but keep it short and deer and suggest you meet for adult only time. Perhaps her next child willgo through this phase and she will be more understanding.

Thanks Trollop - I did deal with my own daughter's hitting swiftly, yes.

You forgot to add 'smug' to that list there LeQueen.

Weak, shallow, a fairweather friend, and smug.
That's what we all are. Us with our non hitting 'angels'.

Totally with pictish on this one. It is hard - but the strong love and protectiveness you feel for your DD which shines through on this thread - your friend also feels the same for her daughter. I have been in your friends postion - new in town clicked with another mum spent a lot of time together but her DD was vile to mine really horrid. I kept wanting to meet up with them but realised the message I was giving to DD - my wanting to see my friend means I am ignoring you when you tell me you don't want to spend time with a child who is consistently unpleasant to you. DD was bewildered that a child that taunted her and pushed her over kept being invited to our house .

The mother was a great parent and put a lot of work in with her DD, was very firm etc and 2 years down the line the child is fine and socialised thanks to parents efforts (our DDs now 5 and at school are not friends though). Still I switched to meeting up with the friend in the evenings rather than with the girls as ultimately my DD had to come first.