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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To feel confused and upset by being ignored

235 replies

CaffeineShadow · 17/04/2012 14:18

Since I have become a mum I have found it hard to make friends with other mums who are on the same wavelength as me. I have lots of old friends who have no children.
Last summer I made a new mummy friend that I met at a playgroup and we got on amazingly well. She has a 3 year old DD as do I. So began a really good friendship where we met up a lot with the children and without. The two girls were calling each other "best friends". She also lives just down the road from me so very handy. She invited me to go to Circus of Horrors with her and we just got on amazingly well and had a lot in common. I started to confide in her about private stuff, naturally.
My DD is a very spirited child, her emotions are so strong whether good or bad.If she doesn't get her own way she screams so loudly, it's quite embarrassing, she can get very hitty and have lots of tantrums. When we met up with the children we had to watch them a lot as they were either totally in love or fighting. But we used to laugh about it as it's quite common at their age.
After a little while of these meetings she came over our house with her daughter and my DD started getting very upset and unruly as her friend was playing with DDs toys. She ended up hitting my friend's DD and having an embarrassing screaming tantrum and so they swiftly left and I obviously punished my DD as much as I could and warned her that her friend's mummy may not allow her DD round to ours anymore if she carried on like that every time.
A few weeks passed where I didn't hear from my friend so I texted her and she said she had just been busy. I asked her if she and her DD would like to meet me and my DD at the park as I thought they would both be out in the fresh air together and they don't have to share any toys.
As soon as they got there I had my back to the children as I said hi to my friend and she was facing them. She suddenly shouted out that my DD was kicking sand at her DD. I quickly picked her up to take her to a table to give her a warning. I told her if it carried on we would go home as it is dangerous and naughty to kick sand. She had a scream and cry then agreed she wouldn't do it again. A few seconds later she was doing it again and my friend looked really pissed off (I don't blame her, so was I!) So again I took her away and she said she needed the toilet so off we went to the toilet and I was going home afterwards. We got back to the park and my friend said she was going. I said I'd just get my stuff together and walk with her. She said she had to go immediately.
After that we were supposed to meet up one on one whilst the girl's where at nursery but when it came to the day she cancelled saying she had totally forgotten she was supposed to meet me so had arranged to meet her family. After that I texted her again about meeting up and she sent a vague msg saying that we should meet up sometime.
A couple of weeks ago I told her about a fete that was on which her and her DD came to but she hardly spoke to me at all and then left as soon as her daughter fell over in the playground. She said we should meet up in the easter holidays.
Over the easter holidays I texted her about three times asking if she wanted to meet up and apologising once again for DDs behaviour to her DD and she sent back vague msgs saying "next week sometime" and didn't mention the apology. When next week came I didn't hear anything.
I have stopped texting her now as I feel like I am chasing and chasing and making myself look like a stalker!
But AIBU to want her to just tell me if she doesn't want to be friends with me and stop skirting around the issue? I am quite upset as we had so much in common and I really thought I had found a really good friend.
If you get this far with the reading, you are amazing and thank you!

OP posts:
Fedupnagging · 17/04/2012 15:16

It's really hard in a situation like this so am sending a hugs.

Have 3 ds's-ds1 and ds3 both very 'spirited' when younger so quite often had to deal with their behaviour (which thankfully didn't last too long). Usually this involved removing the ds for time out then if the behaviour was repeated, packed our bags and went home straight away. This shows the child and other parents, that you are dealing with the negative behaviour.

Ds2 however was on the receiving end of a child who liked to bite and kick. IMO the mother didn't really do enough to deal with this behaviour so I didn't let them get together too often. They are now, as teenagers, really good friends and this little biter is a lovely young man. Also still meet up with his Mum from time to time.

porcamiseria · 17/04/2012 15:17

lovely post smethwick

Vickles · 17/04/2012 15:31

I think you've been given great advice here.
You started your post off with saying how hard it is to find friends... and this friend sounds really lovely. How do you actually say 'sorry, i don't want to be around your child?' - without it potentially turning into a major slagging match.
I think your friend has handled things diplomatically... and sounds like a good friend.
Now the easter hols are over - and daily routine is back to normality, do drop her a text again. And arrange a grown up night out - no kids.

I think what skybluepearl said is spot on...

Good luck with everything.. x

claudedebussy · 17/04/2012 15:36

i will always put my children first and if they don't like meeting up with a particular child then i don't arrange playdates with them. nothing personal - why force kids to spend time together when one or both don't enjoy it?

so if you miss your friend, ask her out for a coffee and make it clear it'll be without your dd.

manicbmc · 17/04/2012 16:05

I agree with Pictish. You told your dd off for kicking sand and told her you would take her home if she did it again and then she did it again and you didn't immediately take her home and follow through?

Sort out your dd's behaviour while she's still young. Being spirited doesn't have to mean being mean.

ElephantsAreMadeOfElements · 17/04/2012 16:33

OP did take her home, she just took her to the toilet first. I'm not sure some brilliant parenting point on "following through" would be achieved by making her DD wet herself.

Your DD just doesn't sound great to be around for other children right now. If you keep being firm with her it's something she's likely to grow out of, but I think you should call your friend and speak to her (rather than texting), say that you are sorry, you know your DD is being difficult right now and recent get-togethers haven't been much fun for your friend and her DD, so would she like to just have the two of you do adult stuff together for the next few months at least? If she still doesn't want to meet you then you'll have to let her go.

manicbmc · 17/04/2012 16:34

She took her to the toilet and then back to the park.

bejeezus · 17/04/2012 16:46

I have been in your friends position, and it was really upsetting to have to distance myself from a good friend. I/we perservered for ages and had honest and tearful talks about the situation. But in the end, I couldn't keep giving my dd the message that it was ok for her friend to keep attacking her and to keep going back for more. It was really awkward and sad

But, 3 years on, kids a bit bigger,we are now able to spend time together. Depends if you can look to the long term

LeQueen · 17/04/2012 16:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ElephantsAreMadeOfElements · 17/04/2012 16:54

She took her to the toilet and then back to the park to get her stuff

"off we went to the toilet and I was going home afterwards . We got back to the park and my friend said she was going. I said I'd just get my stuff together "

Proudnscary · 17/04/2012 17:00

I think she has made her position abundantly clear and I don't blame her.

I had a few awful years of trying to put up with a relative's child who did all manner of things to my dc including throwing objects at my ds's head and holding my dd under the water in a paddling pool.

I can tell you that after a while, I felt so on edge/pissed off/exhausted about the whole thing and I even felt resentful towards the child (sooo wrong but being honest) because the parent did not manage to discipline effectively and put my kids at risk.

This was a relative so we still see them, but if it had been a newly made friend, no way would I have carried on seeing them.

You have been given some kind words and advice on here, I hope you take it all on board.

puds11 · 17/04/2012 17:12

I'm sorry but when did the word 'spirited' replace badly behaved?
The way you have described your daughter behaving in my interpretaion (emphasis on my interpretation) is naughty behaviour, not just being spirited. My DD is what i would describe as spirited, but she does not scream if she doesnt get her own way, throw sand in peoples faces etc. that to me sounds like the behaviour of a spoilt child.
I do not intend to be rude of confrontational OP, but i can completely understand your friend distancing herself from you. I would not want my DD to spend time with a child who behaves in this way, and i frequently point out to her bad behaviour from anyone when i see it so that she has a clear understanding of correct way to behave.
I do think your friend is being quite pathetic though, she could easily say she doesnt want to see you and give you a reason why.

CaffeineShadow · 17/04/2012 17:25

Wow I am blown away! I really am! I think maybe I have made out like my child is a devil child, she's not. She has a good group of friends at nursery and this child is the only child she has hit and seems to have a love/hate relationship with.
She is mostly naughty and challenging at home with me and DH. I am not saying this is acceptable at all but I have been doing whatever I can about her behaviour. At nursery the teachers say she is extremely intelligent and polite and is never rude or naughty at all. I have seen a health visitor who described her as a spirited child who needs constant learning opportunities otherwise she will get bored and become naughty. I have had a very hard time trying out behaviour charts,naughty step, being firm, consequences etc and my family have seen me getting very upset with all of this.
She was a very wanted baby and I had to have fertility treatment to have her and it doesn't look like she will have a sibling any time soon as we have been having treatment for 2.5 years to no avail. The health visitor also said that because she is an only child she has had a lot of constant attention so this could be part of the reason behind it.
RE the park, I went back there to get our bags and coats as I had left them there with my friend. I got us ready to go and left! So please don't assume I don't follow through with consequences just because you can't be bothered to read the post properly.
I have asked her if we can meet up on our own as I said, but doesn't seem like she's particularly interested anymore. That bit is what I don't understand as we got on so well and she could see how embarrassed I was about DDs behaviour and how upset I had been when we have had one on ones and I've talked about it.
Anyway I just wanted to know if people thought I should give up on the friendship but seems she already has.
Will be quite embarrassing when I no doubt bump into her on the street.
I don't blame some of you for judging me and DD though as this is just an internet forum so you can't see everything that is happening and don't know our whole life story.

OP posts:
CaffeineShadow · 17/04/2012 17:30

Some signs that may alert parents to a spirited child include a tendency to be highly emotional or animated. Spirited children may also display aggressive behavior. Another sign indicative of a spirited child is tenacity. While not all children who possess these traits are labeled as spirited, those are a few common characteristics.

Raising a spirited child can be a demanding and frustrating for many parents, especially when they are new to parenting. Raising a spirited toddler may be a difficult part of child rearing, because at a very young young age the child may not quite grasp what is considered acceptable behavior. A sign of a spiritedness in children younger than three may be repeated temper outbursts. Some spirited children may also bully a smaller, more defenseless child.

Conversely, spirited children may be overly sensitive and cry with little provocation. While other children may not react to certain situations as noticeably, spirited children may become clearly upset by casual comments or remarks. Feelings may become hurt easily. Parents may see this as sensitivity.

A high-spirited nature in children under the age of two may be difficult to recognize. The high-spirited 18-month-old may often be thought of as a fussy baby. He may want his own way all the time and become fussy at bedtime or mealtime. He may resist toilet training, and may also appear very needy and cling to his mother excessively.

As the spirited child enters school age, the parents may notice mood swings on a daily basis. Often parents think of the child as being temperamental. Spirited children may display an extremely happy and upbeat disposition, which easily changes to indifference or even sadness with no apparent reason.

In other cases, the spirited child may not take well to sudden changes in his routine. He may resist change and become quite upset with even a slight variation in his daily activities. Teachers may notice the child adapts better with constant structure and order.

Some spirited children have difficulty sleeping. Bed wetting is another common issue with many of these children. Some high-spirited children will experience bad dreams or nightmares regularly. When the child has upsetting dreams, he may want to sleep in the parent's bed, or may insist on sleeping with a light on.

Many spirited children are highly domineering and bossy, especially with other children. The high-spirited child may constantly need to be the center of attention. Some of these children tend to be self centered and not focus on others.

Parenting advice for those who are raising a spirited child includes learning to be patient and accepting. At the same time, setting boundaries is a crucial step. Experts also believe accepting the child for the unique individual he is and offering unconditional love can go a long way.

OP posts:
Nancy66 · 17/04/2012 17:37

Op - you seem a bit in denial about your daughter's behaviour

pictish · 17/04/2012 17:38

Totally in denial.

Op where did you unearth that load of guff? Your daughter is not above keeping her hands to herself you know!

manicbmc · 17/04/2012 17:40

Being spirited is no excuse for hitting and not learning to share. Even my severely autistic ds had managed to learn to share.

LeQueen · 17/04/2012 17:41

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bitofastate · 17/04/2012 17:42

OP - I do feel for you but I have been in your friend's position and although we still see each other a lot (just the adults) we don't do any 'play dates' at all with our children.

The frustration for me was that my friend just seemed to accept her dd's behaviour and not do anything about it. Drove me mad

Also my dd has never hit anyone (she's now 7) so I thought this child's behaviour was horrendous.

3LittleMonkeys · 17/04/2012 17:43

My friend and I both have daughters who have behaved like this to each other - each time we have talked about it and kept the girls apart for a few weeks and then tried again. They are now best of friends! As others have said leave it a while and try again or just meet with the mum for a meal/drink. If this doesn't work then you have tried your best.

LeQueen · 17/04/2012 17:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MagsAloof · 17/04/2012 17:47

I really feel for you, OP. I have lost friends because of my DS's behaviour.

Give it up. If she cannot be honest and open with you and have an adult conversation about how difficult she finds your DD's behaviour - or , hey, perhaps support you with your child - she isn't a fried and you can right her off as 'fairweather'.

One of my closest friends has been amazing, despite the fact that her children are angels and my DS is a nightmare sometimes (Asperger's and behavioural issues). She is always clam, always manages to make me laugh afterwards. You need more friends like that,a dn I am sure they will come...

alwaysrunninginheels · 17/04/2012 17:58

OP I really feel for you. But can completely understand your friends point of view. I think perhaps the friendship didn't have enough time to grow before this became an issue. I had a friend who we met just after having our first children. Her DD was, like yours a hugely hugely wanted IVF baby and to be honest from very early on it was obvious why wore the shoes in that house and it wasn't the parents. She was vile to my children and eventually I made excuses every time she asked to meet with the children- I was not alone in this!!!! However because we had had longer to know each other we were able to maintain a lovely friendship not involving the children- I suspect this cannot happen in your case because your friend has just had enough! Chalk it up to experience and enjoy the other child free friends you have. There will be lots of opportunities to make other "mummy" friends over the years. Don't dwell on this but I do agree perhaps you are making a few excuses- put yourself in the other mothers shoes and I am sure you will see she is only acting in the interests of her child and we all have the right to do that.

mummytime · 17/04/2012 18:00

OP I have read similar things, and those books are actually using spirited as code for not yet diagnosed as Autistic.

There are spirited children, but they don't tend to hurt others, but do over react to stimulus; so can't cope with loud noises, labels etc. however these can also be signs of ASD. So it is a very tricky area.

PosieParker · 17/04/2012 18:02

OP I have a spirited child. He's really bright knew the alphabet and numbers up to twenty at 2. BUT he is naughty! I know that his siblings at his age obeyed me much much more and they had more rules. I am under no illusion that his personality needs really tight boundaries.