to get really, really irritated by people who seem to think that being able to drive is the be all and end all?

[BellaCB]

It just winds me up!

Neither DP or I drive, never learnt. We lived in London in our 20s so it was no biggie. Now we're in a smaller town and have DD and pretty much everyone we know is WTF? about us not being able to drive. They just keep on and on and on about how we have to start learning (and NOW!) otherwise we'll never be able to cope.

But, you know, there are things such as buses, and trains, and even - gasp! - your feet for walking. We get on fine, we both love the exercise this means we get and, if we do need to go somewhere in a car, we get a taxi. We've got a travel system pram so we've always got a car seat if we need it. I mean, have you seen the cost of learning to drive and buying a car at the moment?! We'd bankrupt ourselves doing it! We could probably get taxis everywhere we possibly wanted to go at the moment and it would still work out cheaper!

Now I know if you lived in a small village that was miles from anywhere with shops and had no public transport then not driving would be a real issue. But for most people who live in towns then not driving isn't exactly that much of a pain. Maybe about twice a year we think - ooh, if we did have a car this would be a little easier, but that's not worth £000's...

Actually, maybe this is more of a rant about people assuming you have to be able to drive in order to have any kind of decent life. And people sticking their nose in and saying, Drive, now! . What made me go Grr... right now was a reply on another thread telling the OP to learn to drive to sort out a short-term problem. Like the friend who told me I was ruining her wedding because I couldn't drive from the church to the party venue - even though I was maid-of-honour and wouldn't have driven myself to the wedding ceremony anyway!

OK... deep breath... prepares for a bunfight... but AIBU?

My OH used to get really annoyed that I couldnt drive.
He would use it as an excuse for being bloody miserable when we went away because 'i have to do all the driving'
Never mind I did everything else.

I eventually learnt to drive when I was 36. We had moved out of central london to an outer borough and it felt like being in the countryside to me

Thank God I did because DD then got very ill and I need to be able to drive.

But I managed for years and years without any trouble. Took the kids everywhere by bus and train and walking.
My little ones are much lazier than their older sibs

Oh yeah and I was able to do this to OH when I started driving down to Devon etc and found out it really wasnt on the same par as some sort of extreme endurance test ...

A car is essential to me as my work is not nearby. My children all learned as soon as they could as I view it as a basic life skill. It can provide levels of independence you wouldn't have otherwise. Also, public transport is terrible in the city we live on the outskirts of.

I think it is a very useful life skill, and when interviewing two equally competent candidates for a job, I have given the job to the driver as there are times when it would be useful to carry out their role.

Everyone has a choice though - and I can certainly understand someone living in London not driving - there's little point.

I spent years saying I didn't need to drive and I could manage on public transport. And the truth is I could but it is much more convenient to be able to drive.

So YANBU but you'd prob learn to love it if you could and wonder how you coped before!

Driving is quite a useful skill.

Cars, on the other hand, are incredibly boring. I speak as someone welded to a partner who is interested in the wretched things. He reads car mags and looks at car websites. Deeply as I disapprove of pornography, at least if he were perving over naked women I'd see why...

I'm honestly not trying to be provocative, but is there a chance that you sometimes rely on friends for lifts, and that they are a little peeved that you cannot return the favour?

"He would use it as an excuse for being bloody miserable when we went away because 'i have to do all the driving'"

Quite frankly I wouldn't have blamed him. We live in Yorkshire and it is a hefty drive down to Dorset/Devon/Cornwall. I is very tiring doing a lengthy drive, even with a break in the middle, especially if you have no-one to share the driving with. OH and I always share the driving.

If it doesn't affect you, fine. Wouldn't be my choice and seems like a works of hassle to rely on other transport instead of being in charge of it yourself but that's up to you. If it affects other people in your life then yes, that's unreasonable. And to some extent it must do in order for them to realise/comment.

My SIL doesn't drive. When she visits we have to faff about picking her up from the station (miles away) and listen to her moan about heavy bags. Then fit in her visit around the last train (early) and hear her rant about ticket prices. Most of the time my DH ends up going to get her and drop her off. She only lives 30 miles away but because of the crap transport connections she may as well be in another country and seems to think it's our responsibility to fit around her, when if she drove she could be here unflustered in 20 mins. DH even gave her a car, but she made her boyfriend drive it, and then finished with him.

If you end up relying or even taking up other people on their offers to drive, it impacts on their lives and that can be v irritating.

I think if you have a car it is very difficult to imagine how you would cope without one, and some people project that anxiety onto non drivers when they discuss them not owning a car.

I had a work colleague burst into tears at me when I was pg as she didn't know how I would cope with a child when I don't have a car. I now have have three children and still no household car!

OP it may be worth saying to your friends that only 50% of people own a car, and if the other half of the population drove too it would become too congested for anyone to travel easily. Then ask if they still want you to drive

My goodness, driving is not a basic skill , reading and writing, and numeracy is. I am shocked that many of you think of it as such. Driving and owning a car has its disadvantages too, it's not a bed of roses or some eutopia

It's a useful skill but not a basic one, you can function in life without one.

I think it's a basic life skill. I got my first licence at 17 - a very long time ago. DH waited until he was 30 and learnt under duress and still hates driving.

We live in London, zone 2, with excellent transport links. But we have one child at school in Surrey and there is no way she could get home on public transport if she misses the school bus (if we couldn't drive she couldn't have gone there so that would have cut out a choice). Our son is sporty and there are endless matches across London and Surrey which often start at 9am on a Sunday morning and it would be almost impossible to get to many of them without a car.

In a minute I shall be going to Sainsburys which is a five minute walk from the house. I shall take the car because there is no way I can carry a weeks shopping back with me.

So far today I have nipped to the vet and back again, nipped to the petrol station (and have been able to fill up!!!!! ) and dropped ds a couple of miles away. Really looking forward to our summer holiday too which will involve driving to the South of France - I will do it all though, because DH hates it and only drives because he has a GWiz which he takes into central London every day because he hates being on the tube even more.

My sis lives in central London, visits often. Has a lovely journey in First, far far quicker than driving here. I always collect her from the station because I love her lots and want to see her. She doesn't need to drive (but has a fantastic job incase anyone thinks she's a div )

Basic skill my arse!

No it's not! A lot of people function perfectly withou it including myself. Implying that it's a basic life skill is negative, as the person is seen as I.e thick or stupid if they can't or don't want to drive

...I suppose that non-drivers will never really know just how useful a skill it is, and how new opportunities are available to people who can drive.

People with a driving licence can still chose to go by train, use buses, cycle and walk places. We do! But people who have never learnt to drive, dont have that choice.

Getting from South West London to Dulwich, to visit the Horniman museum, for example, would be quite exhausting on public transport, for a day out with the kids. I know how to get there by train, that is not the point, getting any where from SW london requires a combination of buses, trains, tube, walking, I have not unlearnt this particular navigating and planning skill just because I also know how to get there by car!

I can chose whether to drive into Oxford street, do my shopping, in the knowledge I can drop anything I want into the car, without going around central London laden with bags. I can take a bus to a different end of London, have lunch with a friend, or to a park for a picnic, and then go back to my car. I can decide not to go home, but visit a friend in North London for a meal, before driving back in the evening, kids falling asleep in the car, after nipping into Ikea. I can cram a whole lot into a day in Central London, if I have a car, and it is easy, because I can drive, I can navigate. I also know how to do all this by public transport.

It makes my life easier, it means I have options. On friday evening, we might decide to go to New Forest the following day. We pack our car, put the bikes on the bike rack, and can be off by 7 am, and be on our bikes by 11 for a fantastic cycle ride. No need to check our luggage into a b&b first, it stays in the car, and we just get our stuff when we are done cycling, after driving to a nice country pub for dinner, we can settle at our B&B for the night, ready for another day of outdoors adventure before heading back.

I would not be without a car. There is much more I can do WITH a car, than without one.

I dont think anybody can really say "Now that I know how to drive, and I have a car, I have much fewer options available to me in life".

The difference lay in the CHOICE. And I prefer to have choices than not.

I also think that claiming to drive is a basic skill like reading and writing is pretty insulting.

It is not a basic skill. It is an additional skill. Like knitting and sewing. It is not essential to anybody's life. But it makes things a lot easier.

complex, I don't particularly rely on friends for lifts because I don't live near my close friends, and so far in the town we've moved too we've never needed a lift. But yes, you're right, there have undoubtedly been moments when they have wished I could drive. I always offer petrol money, however, if they are travelling to see me or giving me a lift in a situation where, if I did have a car, they wouldn't need to do so. However, I'm sure there have been moments when I have been peeved that they couldn't do something I can't do - for example, I know I get a little irritated when dining out with my picky and also vegetarian friend as it seems to take an hour to chose which restaurant to go into.

And like piglet, I REALLY don't think that being able to drive counts as a 'basic' life skill! Its a common skill, but its hardly up there with tying your shoelaces or being able to boil a kettle - neither of which, for example, cost £00's to learn to do. I can see that once you have a car it becomes hard to imagine life without it but it really, really isn't an essential in life.

Re learning to drive and not buying a car - that one doesn't really work. You pay £00's to learn to drive, but then don't practice at all? As far as I have heard that means you generally forget most of what you've learnt, and then you need refresher lessons... Seems a little bit of a waste of money to me, if you learn then you should have regular access to a car.

Re ferrying kids around when they are older - if we still don't drive, then they will either get taxis or the bus. Unless the cost of driving comes down to about a quarter of what it currently is there is no way taxis aren't going to be cheaper.

And re kids being ill and not being able to get to hospital - I'm sorry, I actually find that idea slightly offensive (though sorry, I suspect that might just be me). It smacks a little of saying that if you don't have a car then you are deliberately putting your child at risk. If they are ill and need taking to hospital I will get a taxi - this worked perfectly well during labour, when I was back and forth several times (and I also think its a bit of a generalisation to say that most taxis are unsafe) - or if its a real emergency, I will call an ambulance. As most people would.

I'm not saying driving isn't convenient. It is. It's just that it is still possible to cope easily without driving.

Whaleoil - how does not driving make me less self-sufficient? DP doesn't drive either. If we split up I'd be in exactly the same boat

When I started driving I gained half a stone in a year.

We're in the exact same situation. Live in CENTRAL manchester. Literally central, we're both early 20's with DS and there is no way we could afford to learn to drive a car or run one, and to be honest there is no need to! Maybe when we're a bit older and have more money and live somewhere where there isn't 24 hours bussees!

Only thing is DS has grown out of the car seat that comes as part of a travel system, so we really have to plan ahead if we wwant to get taxi's!

Yes in the same way in which those who are not able to do basic life skills ie reading or writing or numeracy ate viewed. You can function in life without driving as its not a basic skill but not really if you ate not able to read or write, that's why they teach it at schools from a early age!

I haven't read all the responses. I think you abvvvu because I just got my UK driving license yesterday

I let my old US one expire eons ago because I never needed to drive and now I am so happy to taste freedom again

So, just to rub it in, it is sooo important to be able to drive...you must get your license

It depends on if you need to. I know that many jobs (even if they don't mention driving) often have a presumed need - e.g. minibus driving if you're a teacher. If you really don't need to it's fine. I have a RL friend who drives but her dh doesn't (refuses to learn point blank) She had a large group of friends who had to drive her to hospitals during both pg's and serious illnesses in her children over many years......several of them made pointed remarks to him as they really could not have afforded a taxi on all these occasions (they live in the middle of the countryside and hence have to drive)

I took six times to pass my test but I knew I would in the end. I wanted to drive so much. I travel all over the UK for work and couldn't do it without a car. I can't imagine being without it.

That said, what's with all the "I can't understand it" posts? So somebody doesn't drive, for whatever reason... what's to understand? How does that affect your life in any way what somebody else chooses to do?

Now THAT, I don't understand...

Bunbaker. I believe MrsDeVere lives in London so not quite the same trek down to devon as you have from Yorkshire.

Bella - although I understand your point about taxis when children are ill I do think that when you have children it is a useful skill to have. Ds has been rushed into hopsital many times and the last thing I would want is to have to wait for and pay for a taxi. So much easier to be able to bundle him in the car and be at a and e in 10 minutes.