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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think that if you let the students in your class do any of these things you are doing them a disservice?

247 replies

pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 15:49

  • listen to music players whilst completing work (unless it's a music lesson/relevant)
  • eat and/or drink (not water obviously)
  • get up and walk around at will
  • swear/use foul language to you/each other under their breath (whilst you pretend not to hear)
  • dry-hump each other (to which you merely raise an eyebrow)
  • routinely turn up to lessons with no pens, pencils, books
  • treat the floor as a bin
  • deface books
  • break pens etc
  • use their mobiles for texting (against whilst you pretend not to notice)

All opinions most welcome!

Any teachers willing to admit to any/all of these? Would be particularly interested in hearing your justifications.

OP posts:
MuslinSuit · 16/02/2012 18:36

Your list looks like my lesson plan for Y11.

tethersend · 16/02/2012 18:47

LeQ; the behaviour policy is exclusively punitive, there is no flexibility, they do not adhere to legal requirements and they exclude children at the drop of a hat. Much of the teaching that goes on is inadequate (IMO). Gang activity is rife.

ATruthUniversallyAcknowledged · 16/02/2012 18:51

< joins applause for Tiger>

OP - I've been thinking about this. Apologies for my suspicious comments earlier. I actually thought you were a pgce student bitching about her mentor. I think the things you describe here will be commonplace in many schools and not at all surprising to the teachers on this thread. However, I can imagine that they would be shocking to people who didn't realise this went in in schools & worrying for prospective parents. All I can rally say to that is that most teachers are good. We are. We want the best educationally and socially for your children & will try our utmost to get it. I teach classes like the one you describe, but my attention goes to those pupils who deserve it (hopefully like your daughter) not the idiots doing the dry humping.

As for the lockers & places to eat, I think I said on your other thread, lack of lockers is completely normal & I really don't think it's an issue. Pupils have to carry their books to school. Is it really a problem for them to then carry them a few hundred metres between lessons over the course of a day? You'll probably find that there are places for pupils to eat but that some choose to sit in the floor as that's where their group hangs out. Teenagers are territorial beasts! Sitting in the floor probably breaks a rule do makes it cool!

BalloonSlayer · 16/02/2012 18:52

How can a teacher "let" their students come to class without pens, pencils or books?

Do you imagine that they trilled out to the class as they filed out of the lesson before: "And don't worry about bringing in your stuff next time, guys?"

ATruthUniversallyAcknowledged · 16/02/2012 18:53

Oh, and if this is the school your DD is most likely to go to please don't mention your concerns to her. She needs to think it's the best school ever. She doesn't know that schools used to have lockers. Talk it up to her to help her settle.

sassyTHEFIRST · 16/02/2012 19:00

Do you know what? The lack of pen is possibly the single thing that irritates me the most of your entire list, OP (though I can't recall ever witnessing dryhumping in one of my classes).

What is particularly annoying is that I know every one of the little darlings that hasn't got a pen has a phone in their pocket. Cos that's priorities, innit.

Even sixth formers sometimes don't have one.Grr. And I could make a huge fuss, phone parents, detain them...but it wastes learning time for the others. So I sigh, lend them a pen and give them a minus mark on central computing system.

Original poster
pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 19:09

ATruth luckily we have a choice. I will not be choosing this school but things may have been very different if I hadn't of had my recent insight. I am worried that other parents may choose this school without knowing what it is really like.

OP posts:
EndoplasmicReticulum · 16/02/2012 19:31

pickled you didn't answer me earlier - how do you know this happens? Did you sit in lessons?

Haggisfish · 16/02/2012 19:38

Oh FGS. This is reality in almost all secondary comprehensive schools in the UK. If you can afford to go private, do it. If not, do something useful like join the Governors as a parent Governor - most schools have a lot of trouble actually getting all these concerned parents to join the Board of Governors and contribute to helping the school to get better. most of these misdemeanours can be dealt with within 10 seconds - occasionally I will 'ignore' some behaviour so I can actually bloody well teach those kids who want to learn.

Haggisfish · 16/02/2012 19:41

Also, how do you know 'most of the parents are engaged'? MOST of them? Really? Because I would be very interested to know how you know that information.

Original poster
pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 19:41

Haggisfish, why should reasonable behaviour be the preserve of 'private' school classrooms?

OP posts:
Original poster
pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 19:43

Haggis, I am only going on what I have been told by a number of teachers who work there.

OP posts:
QuietTiger · 16/02/2012 19:45

MuslinSuit - I see your "dry humping" and raise you "licking windows"!! (yes, it DID happen!)

cricketballs · 16/02/2012 19:52

as a teacher; if I am having a 'bad day' then yes, I will report these low level/unusal events. It does not suffice to say that this is what it is like day to day.

I would also say that staff at my current school think we are over run with bad behaviour (they have been there too long and wouldn't know bad behaviour if it hit them between the eyes)

lecce · 16/02/2012 19:56

listen to music players whilst completing work (unless it's a music lesson/relevant) I used to allow this when pupils were working independently on something but it is no longer allowed by SLT. A shame as allows pupils to shut themselves off from distractions.
eat and/or drink (not water obviously) Generally no but I may choose not to disrupt the lesson because I have noticed someone slyly shove a sweet in their mouth during whole-class teaching. I would follow it up though.
get up and walk around at will No but can get up for a reason at an appropriate time.
swear/use foul language to you/each other under their breath (whilst you pretend not to hear) Depends. If it is aggressive in tone and directed at a particular pupil I would deal with it but I think it is counter-productive to act on every instance of muttered stroppiness to come from a teenager's mouth.
dry-hump each other (to which you merely raise an eyebrow) Never encountered this!
routinely turn up to lessons with no pens, pencils, books I believe it more important to give them a pen and get on with the lesson.
treat the floor as a bin No
deface books No
break pens etc If it is their own pen then it's their problem.
use their mobiles for texting (against whilst you pretend not to notice) No

How do you know that these things go on repeatedly and why do you seem to be so sure that teachers are ignoring them because they are lazy? Why not admit that they may have sound resaons for doing so based upon their experience, expertise and knowledge of their pupils?

IloveJudgeJudy · 16/02/2012 20:00

I think it definitely depends on the type of child that is being taught. DS1 was in some lower sets earlier in his school career. Some of the things mentioned in the OP were allowed on occasion. Just spoke to DD who has always been in the top sets. Nothing allowed.

I think that, as other posters have mentioned, the teachers teach to the children, luckily. For some children it's an effort to even get into school each day, so to pull them up on every little detail is a bit obstructive.

DS1 is a football ref and on the swearing thing he should, according to the laws, always pull up everyone, but sometimes discretion is the better part of valour and turning a blind eye is the right thing to do to prevent a some much bigger infringement happening. I know that sometimes some very bad teachers like to taunt their pupils to sort of encourage them to bigger infringements of the rules in order that they can then punish them, but sometimes the better teachers just turn a blind eye which is fine by me. It's a school, not army bootcamp.

scrablet · 16/02/2012 20:07

oh, i wasn't going to engage...but, welcome to teaching in Britain. Generally known as pick your battles. What about your list bugs you more? Maybe I don't really care about that one but am furious about no3.
Who is right? Generally, we have to accept the teacher knows the class, not the one pupil causing trouble and is working towards the general good.
If we don't accept that, home schooling is only way to go...

Original poster
pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 20:09

Bonsoir, I would be interested in hearing your comments on the turning a blind eye thing. Do you think it does our DC a disservice?

OP posts:
Original poster
pickledsiblings · 16/02/2012 20:12

I am beginning to think that teaching in Britain = mob rule
(no offence intended to any teachers btw).

OP posts:
EndoplasmicReticulum · 16/02/2012 20:15

pickled sorry to go on, but I'm still not clear on how you know all this was going on in lessons in the school. Did you go and watch?

scrablet · 16/02/2012 20:16

No, mob rule it isn't, but perhaps not the happy skippy passage to learningsville we hope it would be.

ATruthUniversallyAcknowledged · 16/02/2012 20:20

Right, I was nice back there OP. I thought maybe you were just a concerned parent. Now with your "'no offence intended' but it seems that the 'mob' are in charge" attitude you are just making me cross and I'm back to thinking you're picking a fight. It is not teachers doing your DC a disservice; it's the kids doing the dry humping!

tethersend · 16/02/2012 20:22

Have you ever thought of teaching, pickled?

Someone who feels as passionately about it as you clearly do would be invaluable to the profession.

BoneyBackJefferson · 16/02/2012 20:25

Pickled

IMHO

which ever school you choose, you are going to be a pain in the arse.

mathanxiety · 16/02/2012 20:27

I personally don't see how allowing dry humping contributes to a positive learning atmosphere. There's a happy medium between the happy skippy and allowing perhaps unwanted sexual contact between students, i.e. allowing some students to do things that wouldn't be tolerated in a lot of workplaces.

'It is not teachers doing your DC a disservice; it's the kids doing the dry humping!'

Yes, it's the kids doing it, but imo that statement is like saying the inmates should run the asylum.

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