To be upset with dd1 teacher.

[lisad123]

I know this is likely to kick off because it's about religion, but hopefully it won't.

We a family we don't celebrate Xmas or birthdays ect. Both dds have been brought up this way and it's never been an issue to anyone (beside PIL but that's another thread)!

Dd1 is 9 and at Xmas her teacher kept making comments about Xmas being the most wonderful time ever, if you don't celebrate your missing out on something special and wonderful and no child should miss xmas. I let it wash as we were taking girls away over Xmas so dd1 wasn't fussed.

Yesterday, someone in her class was giving out birthday sweets. Dd1 refused as she knows we don't join in celebrating bdays. It's never been an issue, we have plently of sweets. Her teacher made a comment and told her it was ok, she should have one and I would never know! dd1 still refused and told me what teacher had said.
When she came out today she told me her teacher had put sweets in her tray, and told her they weren't bday sweets so she could eat them.
Now Friday is the only day we have sweets because she is a sugar addict and gets ratty and obsessive if we allow too many sweets.

So I spoke to the teacher and he said he felt sorry for her and didn't think it was fair. I explained that I understand that but this is our choice and he told me in future he would try not to say anything but he did feel sorry for her
She wants for nothing and I'm very proud of her for standing up so well to her beliefs.

I'm wondering if she was a religion that didn't eat meat if he would have such a problem.

So am I unreasonable to be upset with him?

birdsofshoreandsea - yes, I would still feel bad regardless of the child's religion. It still would not feel right to exclude a child int his way. But I would still accept that that was the way it was and not go against the parent or child's wishes. The fact that this is JW, muslim or any other religion is irrelevnt to the way I would feel.

Maryz - all our children join in with Christmas craft in the same way that all our children join in with Diwali craft or anything else like that.

I have already stated that if it's learning about other beliefs I have no problems. They have been to church's and places. As for cards they tend to make spring cards instead of Easter, winter cards instead Xmas ect.

Birds I don't see anyone backing the teacher up really

If the OP had simply started a thread saying AIBU to be annoyed at DD's teacher for allowing her sweets against my wishes, and encouraging her to lie to me...I'm sure it would be a unanimous YANBU.

And in a nutshell, that's what happened.

I have missed posts where other posters are saying what the teacher has done is right - I'll go back and reread again.

I would have thought everyone would say the teacher was wrong to force something on the child or ask the child to lie.

But many people may well not understand why a child needs to be excluded like this, which is fair enough imo. It isn't their religion and they are free to feel negatively about that, again regardless of the religion in question.

If the OP professes a particular faith and she chooses to bring her children up in that faith then the school has no business contradicting the parent's wishes as to its observance.

Doesn't matter who does and doesn't agree with it, it's a recognised faith and the teacher should be keeping very quiet.

And I have to say, OP, you are far more open about your children learning about other faiths than parents I have dealt with before, who I assume have the same faith as you.
Their children were withdrawn from practically everything.

Birds, I think the teacher here felt sorry for the OP's dd in a different way, as a Muslim kid who isn't getting a Christmas present is likely to be getting an Eid one soon after! It's the sense of nothing being celebrated that seems "strange" to most people.
Still unprofessional though.

Totally unprofessional of the teacher whatever the reasons. I would complain to the school. I speak as an R.E. teacher.

I think it goes against the grain for me because as parents we all seem to bend over backwards for our kids to be included in things rather than excluded...perhaps that's why the level of feeling runs quite high on these things?

Look how many MNetters tie themselves up in knots because their child doesn't get invited to parties or included in other fun things.

So it's understandably alien to some when they come across a child being deliberately excluded from fun/social events by their own parents.

It doesn't necessarily make them intolerant towards religion, it just kind of goes against every grain in the body...well for me it does anyway.

OP You mentioned the pagan aspects of Christmas and other "Christian" festivals: is that part of the reason they're not celebrated by JW? Do you celebrate the birth of Christ another way /time?

If the treatment of you as the MN JW expert is annoying please just link me to a JW info site. It's just that this is something that really interests me. I was brought up CofE but never really believed, but go along to church occassionally to keep the peace. Having studied various ancient cultures for many years I'm probably more able to spot the "paganicity" than most, and playing "pagan bingo" whilst at church on Christmas morning was how I got through the service. If this is why such things are avoided by JW it gives me a new respect for your reigion.

(Sorry if I've managed to offend any Christians with that btw. It's not my intention!)

I so agree with whoneeds !

I agree teachers have to respect parents wishes for there children, but fail to understand why anyone would follow such a religion that dosnt celebrate bdays, etc I can not fathom that out & why choose something that makes the children so different from the others??

I think "spring" and "winter" cards sound a bit pagan myself!

I think, OP, that unfortunately when you practise and have your children practise a religion that purposely alienates them from their peers, and leaves them out of what most would consider to be normal, run of the mill activities, you are going to encounter people who try to undo the perceived unfairness of it.

Don't be too hard on the teacher. Yes, he was out of line. But not intentionally disrespectful I don't think?

There's a girl in my ds's class whose parents are JW. I wasn't allowed to give her an invitation to ds's party (the only child). How they expected a 4 year old to understand why she was being left out I don't know but I guess that's their decision to live with.

I will say this though: JW is the ONLY religion I'm aware of that seeks to exclude others and isolate themselves.

Anyway, I suppose you're not BU but I think the way it has been handled is the best course of action :)

Interesting debate. It's made me question some of the things I have done in the past with children who have specific religions. For example, I had a JW child in my class a few years ago and at Christmas instead of a Christmas card he was given an "enjoy the break" card. When children had cake or sweets for birthdays I have them to parents and suggested they gave them to the child at an appropriate time. In my mind that way he was not 'celebrating' as such.

He told me the reason for not cel rating birthdays or mothers/fathers day is that it was about celebrating the individual and the only person who should be celebrated was God.

I'd be interested on how this thread would read if a teacher had fed a Jewish child mon-kosher food and suggested they just lie about it.

Goldenbrown that point has been made. Who is defending the teacher? People have moved on to discuss how they feel about the particular religious exclusions applying to that child - no sweets for a birthday seeming to affect us much more than no pig or shellfish!

I think there's an element of 'wrong' on each side of this.

Due to personal experience, I have little respect for the JW organisation. That's neither here nor there wrt whether or not YABU, but it does make me understand the teacher's pov. I would never have said so if I was him, but I too would've felt quite sad for your DD at being 'excluded' over something so harmless.

The actual issue of the sweets....yes, I do think YABU. I don't think there's any harm in your DD having a few little sweets that were brought in by another child. I think whoneedssleepanyway has got it right stating that your interpretation of 'the rules' is very literal. I don't think it has to be that black and white. And as someone who intensely dislikes 'religious beliefs' being pushed onto children, that's what I'm seeing it as.

That said, I think the teacher dealt with the situation in a clumsy way, so YANBU to be annoyed about that.

Twofairiesandapixie - not sure, think OP's latest post suggest that her children are allowed to if it is learning about different religions, but not 100% sure.

I also have found out over recent years that many children who do not celebrate Christmas, such as Muslims, do infact sometimes send cards to their friends that do celebrate. Some of our Muslim children sent me a card and gift, even though they themselves do not celebrate Christmas. I also received cards of adults who do not themselves celebrate.

Ooops, Maryz, not Twofairiesandapixie

MrsHeffley, I quite agree. It's not the reason I'm so opposed to JW, but it certainly earns them a (IMO) well deserved face.