To not want to be addressed as Mrs, and not Ms?

[MitziKinsky]

One of my DCs teachers always addresses me in writing as Ms. Kinsky.

I have the same surname as my DC, I wear a wedding ring, and often draghave DH with me, so I expect to be addressed as Mrs Kinsky, or even Mitzi (I am on first name terms with all the other staff at this school).

I find using Ms when you know someone is married a bit rude. I'm contemplating pointing out, nicely, that I'm a Mrs.

If you have a preferred title or name than YANBU to say "I prefer to be called XX please"

But YABU if you think that the default title for a woman should be anything other than Ms.

I must say, as well as spurring me on always to use Ms to everybody over 16, this thread has made me feel better about considering Mrses to be frumpy old WI types, if they're going to even up the score by considering Mses to be lesbian divorcees who never really loved their husbands and weren't 'committed'.

Fair's fair

In one of my first jobs we had to address all correspondence 'First name last name'. Got rid of all 'Ms/Mrs' issues, although I seem to remember the odd kerfuffle if someone was a Dr or a Prof or whatever.

I'm unmarried, and I'm Ms [My own surname], but I get called Mrs [DS's surname] at school. I have corrected them (as politely as possible) but they still do it. I let it go mostly, because DS's teacher and TA are lovely and it seems churlish to go on about it - but I do wish Ms was the norm.

Besides the fact that it's universal, equal and doesn't describe your relationship to men, I hate the thought of being a Mrs (sounds frumpy, old and bustling) or a Miss (makes me think of a 16-year-old in a floaty dress). Whereas Ms to me sounds modern, grown-up and a bit kick-ass.

If anyone thinks I'm a scary, bra-burning, hairy-legged ballbreaker because I'm a Ms, well, a) I wouldn't want to impress that kind of person anyway, and b) they may have a point, to an extent. I am a Ms, a feminist, and I will stand up for equality even if it does make certain people not like me. Being scared of not being liked is one of the biggest thing holding women back from claiming the equality that's rightly theirs, IMO.

Having said all that, if you want to be called Mrs and you have said so, then people should respect that.

DS's school writes letters to Mrs Morloth.

Which is funny because DS has DH's last name.

So I wonder what sort of arrangement they think we have?

Or (and this is far more likely), they don't think about it at all because they simply don't give a fuck, along with the vast majority of the planet.

YABU to think it should be the default.

YABU I get called Mrs ...... who is definatly my MIL.
Try having a spanish surname (paternal and maternal) in the UK then have DCs having spanish naming surnames (2) but obviously you only use one.
Then be Ms paternal Name. Or people call you Ms Maternal name (making me my mum)

YABU Ms should be the default unless told differently

I like your teacher: she has chosen something neutral so as to not assume that you identify yourself by the fact that you're married. Good on her. Maybe it isn't what you'd like to call yourself, but she hasn't assumed that she can second guess you, and that shows respect.
We get "Parent or Guardian" at our school and while it is less personal, I'm happier with that than Mrs.

I don't know why women still take their husbands surnames. Fine if the children have their fathers surname but why does a woman need to?

I am acutely aware that the roots of this was due to the fact that the woman used to become a man's property when she married. Think about it.

Keeping my own name if I marry!!! Most professionals i.e. doctors and lawters do anyway. I'm a solicitor and I want my surname to continue to match my degrees and admission certificates

Maybe it isn't what you'd like to call yourself, but she hasn't assumed that she can second guess you, and that shows respect.

That's exactly what I think , but just written better

I can only answer for myself, A1980. I took my husband's name, because, to me, it signified that we were starting a new family. We did consider hyphenating our two surnames, but the result sounded ridiculous so we settled for his surname, because, of the two surnames, it's the one I prefer.

In fact, my maiden name has horrible connotations for me, as it was used as the basis of a vile nickname that was used by my bullies all through senior school, the memory of which can still make me feel sick.

But if it pleases some people to think that I am Mrs Hissurname because I am some frumpy WI type with catastrophically low self esteem, who has just gone along with society's mores rather than making her own intelligent decision - well, that judgementalism says more about you than about me.

FWIW - yes, I do have catastrophically low self esteem, due to years of bullying and the consequent history of depression - but that did not render me incapable of making a decision for myself, for my own good reasons, about what title and surname I wished to use.

And the last time I was involved in discussing this topic here, I asked dh if he would use a title that showed that he was married, if one existed - and he said yes, without any hesitation. He wears both an engagement ring (a signet ring) and a wedding ring - his choice - so I am not the only one happy to show my married status publically. I don't use the title Mrs most of the time - when I introduce myself to someone it is with either my first name alone or my first name and (dh's) surname. And I wouldn't get offended if someone who didn't know my preference, called me Ms. But I want to retain the right to choose to use the title Mrs, and to have that choice respected by the people who know that that's my preference.

People have posted really passionately on this thread about why they choose to be called Ms - and I absolutely respect that. But why is it not possible that I should be as passionate about wanting to be called Mrs, and why is it so important that my choice of title should vanish from use? My use of Mrs does not take away anyone's right to use the title Ms, and I wouldn't dream of suggesting that, because I prefer Mrs, I would like to see any other titles disappear from use. Why can't Ms and Mrs co-exist?

It feels to me as if some people who prefer Ms feel that they have to triumph over Mrs, vanquish it and eradicate it, in order to prove that Ms is the best title, and I simply cannot see why that is neccessary. It honestly feels to me as if, because I have made a decision that is not feminist, I deserve no respect.

This thread reminded me of Magnus Magnusson in Mastermind. In round one, he introduced a woman as Miss Jane Smith. In the second round, he reintroduced her as Mrs Jane Smith and apologised for previously "lowering her status"!!!

FWIW, I'm married, changed my surname to my DH's (I did ask him if he would change his name to mine, knowing there was as much chance of that as him becoming a Domestic God) and continue to refer to myself as Ms, as I did when I was single. And yes, I do love my husband and am very committed to him, Ms Garcons .

YABU if you haven't corrected them. If you haven't just change the written records and tell them that you prefer Mrs.

YANBU if you have told and reminded them.

I use Ms and always will (unless there is no Ms option, then I use Mr. If I can write it myself I prefer to use Madam ) and I correct paperwork and people when speaking to them. i just say ''It's Ms.'' No need to say it rudely but I expect to be addressed by the title I choose.

SDTG - I would be quite happy to see 'Mrs' disappear. That doesn't mean I judge you for using 'Mrs', but I use 'Ms' because I like the thinking behind it. And obviously, the fact that 'mrs' is still used by some people complicates my decision to use 'ms'. So yes, to be honest, I would be happy if the word disappeared.

That doesn't make me a bad feminist either, and it doesn't mean I'm oppressing you or looking down on your choice. I'd say if you prefer the title, you should use it and it's rude of someone not to use it for you if they know your preferences. But if in 50 years time it'd become unusual for 'mrs' to be used, I wouldn't be unhappy about it.

I don't see why this is a bad thing?

Btw, if unmarried women had started using 'Mrs' instead of 'Ms' being invented, do you think that would have been better?

Obviously, if someboy wants to be called Dr. instead of Ms or any other title, that should be used. Same for Rev.

OP, I also think YABU to think that becuase you wear a ring, the teachers should use Mrs. if you haven't told them to use it.

"My use of Mrs does not take away anyone's right to use the title Ms"

It takes away the option of not being asked about our marital status though. As long as there are women who insist that they should not be insulted by inferior titles be addressed depending on their marital status, there will be people asking me if I'm married Mrs or not Miss. In situations where it does not matter the least. And I don't want to be asked that.

Therefore the reasonable solution would be addressing all women as Ms. by default. Of course, if you prefer another title, you can then specify and request that you re addressed by the title of your choice.

HazleNutt - I do not consider Ms an inferior title - though it does seem that some on this thread consider Mrs an inferior title, and me an inferior woman for having chosen it. And to be honest, I have only come across having to choose a title when I have been filling in a form, which I almost always do on my own, so choosing a title, from a list, has never felt like being intrusively asked my marital status.

Perhaps all that is needed is for the question to change. Rather than people asking if you are married or single, they should simply ask 'What title would you prefer me to use?' - no judgement whatsoever, as far as I can see.

LRD - If what you want is not to have your decision on your title complicated, then it would be equally good if the titles Miss and Ms died out, and everyone used the term Mrs, as your question suggests. But I wouldn't be happy with that, as it would ride roughshod over those women who do not want to use the term Mrs.

And I am afraid that I boggle somewhat at the 'Something that is important to you must be sacrificed/must vanish, in order to make my life easier/less complicated' that I am seeing here.

You're being a bit unfair here, SCTG. All this talk about 'riding roughshod' and 'must' .... where have I suggested any of that? I wouldn't be unhappy if Mrs died out. But if it happens, it'll happen gradually and naturally, the way languages and societies always do.

I just don't see why anyone thinks because I'm a feminist, the onus is on me to support any choice another woman makes. There are going to be times when I disagree, or don't give a toss: that does not mean I'm missing the point of feminism, it just means feminism isn't primarily about 'choice', or blindly supporting other women's choices.

SDTG, the point is that anybody has the right to determine what they are called. You like Mrs Husband'sname and that is nobody else's business! How is that going to vanish?

''Yes, why is it rude to call someone Ms if they are married? It doesn't suggest they are unmarried, it doesn't suggest they are 'on the shelf', it doesn't suggest they are divorced. It doesn't suggest ANYTHING except that they are female.

To a certain genre is suggests 'lesbian'.

Personally I dont like 'Ms' anymore than I like the term 'partner'

Exactly what does Ms mean? Mrs is Missus...so what is Mizzz? it stands for nothing other than a stroppy mare who thinks shes making a stand''

Amusing, as always. I think you're on the wind up, but I'll bite

I couldn't care if someone assumed I'm a lesbian because I use Ms. Says more about them than it does me and there's nothing out of place with lesbians anyway. Obviously.

I use Ms and partner so you'd dislike my choice and, it seems, the very idea that I have a choice.

Ms is neutral, no connotations of marriage and having read this thread then surely you should know that.

That you think a woman who choses to be free from marital overtones in how she is addressed makes me think that you dislike the idea of women being independent from their marriage or their single status. That you use the term 'stroppy mare' about such a woman says to me that you dislike women having an opinion and that a woman with one is nothing more than a petulant child.

I've heard Ms means:
lesbian
divorcée and on the lookout for a man (wtf?)
strident feminist ("unattractive trait" from MIL)
man-hater

Nice. I'd like no title whatsoever, but since I have to have one, apparently, then why not a relatively neutral one? (As Mr is.)

what leprune said. So good and right on I'm going to quote it in full:

I like your teacher: she has chosen something neutral so as to not assume that you identify yourself by the fact that you're married. Good on her. Maybe it isn't what you'd like to call yourself, but she hasn't assumed that she can second guess you, and that shows respect.
We get "Parent or Guardian" at our school and while it is less personal, I'm happier with that than Mrs.

true though...

Just asking out of interest I've used Miss Scatter in the past. If you were going to do this, would you be Miss, Ms. or Mrs Firstname?

I know quite a few people who call themselves Miss Firstname (even if they're married and call themselves Ms.), one Mrs Firstname (two if you count Mrs Anna in The King and I) but I've never met a Ms. Firstname.

Would you call yourself Ms. Firstname?