To not want to be addressed as Mrs, and not Ms?

[MitziKinsky]

One of my DCs teachers always addresses me in writing as Ms. Kinsky.

I have the same surname as my DC, I wear a wedding ring, and often draghave DH with me, so I expect to be addressed as Mrs Kinsky, or even Mitzi (I am on first name terms with all the other staff at this school).

I find using Ms when you know someone is married a bit rude. I'm contemplating pointing out, nicely, that I'm a Mrs.

YABU. I think the default should be Ms for women and Mr for men. If a woman prefers Miss/Mrs or a man prefers Master (it's the equivalent of Miss after all!) then they can say so.

I do wonder why "Little Miss" is supposedly the equivalent of "Mr Man" but that's another thread!

But I'm not Ms.
I personally am happy to be addressed as Mrs, because that is the title I have chosen.
My 'personal' choice.
Which is where blanketing everyone as Ms takes away that choice.

Or it could be Mr(m) for a married man, and Mr(s) for a single man, perhaps?

It's the abbreviation for 'docent'. A qualification between doctor and professor.

No, using Mrs and Miss imposes a distinction and a categorizing on all women - therefore taking away their choice/preference not to be categorized.

Well, you learn something new every day.... we just had Drs and Profs and some Readers and Fellows of uncertain status!

Feminism IMO isn't primarily about choice. It's about equality for women.

I don't see an issue with someone who prefers 'Mrs' choosing to use it, but neither do I feel that as a feminist I must support that choice instead of supporting equality.

But using Doctor, Doc, etc. also categorizes. Not by gender, but by achievement.
Why should that be any different?
And if you automatically call me Ms you are taking away my choice and preference to be called 'Mrs'.

Ok, so you are saying in order to be 'equal' I have to be Ms because that doesn't 'categorise' me?
genuine question.

ElaineReese Mr(d) for divorced and Mr(w) for widowed, no doubt?

Mr(c) for in civil partnership?

As Monty Python would say This is getting silly. Miss and Mrs are becoming less common, let's see marital status designations off - as quickly as women choose.

I've always felt it a pity Mrs was assigned to married women.

Miss was for girls, Mistress for women back in the day; like Master and Mister men, no link to marriage at all.

Too late to reclaim it though, so Ms will do nicely.

well echt you've got to draw a line somewhere otherwise we'd all have to trace our female surnames back to the Ark!

Elaine they would all have DH's surname, which I agree would help for practical reasons, it's just that they'd have (one of) my surnames as well. Probably as a middle name. Yes I like the idea of DDs having the same surname as me, my mother and my grandmother...

At a guess, I'd say the difference is that categorising by acheivement doesn't carry the stigma of being owned.

I too prefer to be called Mrs.
I just like it that way. I am part of a group of four.
Not a big deal - just what I like.

The school have always called me Mrs.

But my husband doesn't own me!
What stigma!?
You talk about moving on, but why can't you accept that there is no stigma for most women any more. Being a Mrs and equality should not be mutually exclusive, surely?

I think 'Docent' is a European thing - never come across it in UK or US.

Categorizing by achievement is entirely different to categorizing by gender, I'd have thought.

Its up to you how you want to be addressed and that should be respected. I like being known as Mrs Pigletmania, what's wrong with that!

"And if you automatically call me Ms you are taking away my choice and preference to be called 'Mrs'."

Not true indignant. The point is that in the absence of someone having expressed a preference they should be called Ms. Once they've expressed a preference, then people should follow that preference, of course, as it's only polite.

The point is that nobody should be called Mrs until they have expressed that preference, because that would be to label her by her marital status, which is inappropriate until she has said she is happy to be so labelled.

Agreed, grimma.

andrew I agree with all your post, although sadly not with the 'as quickly as women choose' last line - women can't choose in a vacuum, while men AND other women are still calling them Mrs and Miss.

Isnt it funny how different people percieve what things mean. I'm a Mrs, I'm quite happy being a Mrs, my husband doesn't own me just because I am a Mrs and share his surname. Having said that, I wouldn't get all het up in a hot rage just because someone called me Ms, I really don't find it offensive. I'm not too fond of Miss though strangely

OP on the basis that its just not that significant YABU.

So call me by my name. Both names. If it is then relevant to ask for a title I will give it to you. Surely that is the most equal way to do things?

Indignantmoo - I agree with you, and have had this discussion before. I choose to be called Mrs (when a title is needed) and would actively dislike being called Ms. I've been told this makes me some sort of Stepford wife, who is incapable of making an intelligent decision for myself - because I must have just decided to be called Mrs without thinking about why I wanted that title.

I would be more than happy for Ms to become as readily used as Miss and Mrs, and I deplore forms/companies etc that don't offer Ms as a choice for women.

LRD - how 'equal' is it if some women are denied their free choice of what title to use? Why should my choice be sacrificed in order to ensure that women who want the title Ms, get it? Am I somehow less worthy because I have chosen Mrs? Because that's the impression I get.

Andrew I'm not sure why that was addressed to me rather than the other 30 or so posters on this thread. But yes, if someone has a preference for Miss or Mrs that should be respected. Did I suggest that it should not? However, I think it is unfortunate that these titles for women make a distinction based on marital status when that isn't the case for men, and I cannot quite fathom why a woman would want to make sure that her marital status is included in the way someone addresses her, but each to their own. I think the use of Miss/Mrs will die out in time and it already is to a considerable extent in professional circles.

ElaineRees All I meant was that if some women choose to slow it up by choosing Miss or Mrs that's up to them. It is also up to women individuallu how far to complain if addressed by the old forms when they prefer Ms.

I believe the entire public sector and most big private sector players follow the rule of Ms unless otherwise specified and that's all anyone can do.