to not want strange men in the ante natal ward

[moogster1a]

Lots of discussion today about allowing men to stay overnight in the ward after you've had a baby.
This would be lovely if you were in a private room, but I wouldn't want to have men sleeping overnight in a shared ward.
i have fond memories of shuffling to the loo in the night looking like someone had slaughtered a pig in my pyjamas and literally leaving a bit of a trail ( no one tells you just how much blood is involved!). i would feel very uncomfortable doing this in front of a stranger's husband.

Don't give up Peachy! I agree the best plan is bigger hospitals, esp if they have private rooms. Plus more midwives of course.

Thanks- just so embarassing

But got now, phew. No need to worry now.

chipping: How can you be so naive as to think there aren't knobheads out there who would love nothing more than to deliberately catch sight of some knockers/tits out? YES it may come as a surprise but not all men are respectful, mature, considerate, sensitive types. There are just some total idiots out there.

I do have a considerate, educated, lovely, helpful, mature DH who would treat myself and any other women on the ward with the utmost respect, he is totally fantastic. He would pose 0% threat in ANY way to ANY female so would be the ideal candidate to stay and help me over night on the ward.

Do I want him to stay? NO! Why? Because I KNOW that although he is my fab DH, he's nothing to other women. I respect other women's rights more than my wish to have DH stay and help. Upthread is accounts of women who have had crimes committed against them by men who would feel most uncomfortable having ANY man stay on the ward. Why would any woman want to inflict distress on another?!?

I can't believe some people are so selfish as to doggedly think THEIR dh/dp being there is more important as the other ward patient's wishes.

So sick of the selfishness.

And that sleepyspaniel is it all summed up perfectly in a nutshell.

Selfishness. I'm alrightjackness and a sense of entitlement that doesn't give a damn about other women's feelings.
When I said I despair, I meant that.

I couldn't think of anything worse than a someone else husband witness , bloody nightygate everytime I needed to go to the loo.

I think aswell no man can even say the word period without throwing up a buit in their mouth, never mind witnessing on trailing [ick] they'd probably leave hastily tbh.
I wouldnt worry about ogling though tbh If milk dripping from a nipple, floppy braless people walking around or nighty gate won't scar them for life nothing will.
I think the idea that becasue someone has had an attack by a man earlier in life means any man is automatically a threat, I thats an unfair reason to stop an innocent bloke fromk staying to see his baby, I think privacy is the bigger issue and sonme peoples partners arent too nice.

So another woman, wholly unconnected with me, chooses to sunbathe topless and than means that I have my choice to not sleep in mixed sex accommodation removed? Is that the argument?

What? WTF? is that aimed at me?

I think she was responding to catgirl's argument that some women happily sunbathe topless.

Rollon: I was using the example of someone who has deeper seated reason for not wishing to sleep in the same ward as men, only a curtain away, alongside more common reasons such as privacy and idiot immature partners creating an uncomfortable ambiance.

"An innocent bloke from staying to see his baby".

I haven't actually asked my husband, but I can't imagine he would particularly want to spend a night in an uncomfortable chair while I slept, the baby slept, and he was surrounded by post partum women. And I reckon about 95% of fathers would say the same.

Incidentally, we have four children. He was at two births. However, one was three weeks old when he met her, and one was four months old when he met her for the first time - do you think they didn't 'bond'? What a load of rubbish saying that they must spend every second with them from the moment they're born. As someone upthread said - grow up and grow a pair.

Oh and Rollon: How can you (or anyone) guarantee that all the men ever to stay on a postnatal ward are "innocent" and would not commit ANY crime against women?

Can you guarantee it? Can anyone? Is it ok that say, 5%, of the men staying overnight might commit a crime on the postnatal ward ranging from theft to abuse to more serious crimes? 3%? 1% even?

Because I don't need to be clairvoyant to predict that there will definitely not be 0% crime/unsocial activity that disturbs other female patients if men ever get to sleep on postnatal wards as a matter of course.

So who wants to be the new mother who cops for some crap from some man sleeping on a ward? Any takers? Or is it "NIMBY", it'll never happen to me, sod it if some woman cops for some shite somewhere.

SELFISH.

anyfucker I absolutely believe her - she had a very easy,quick birth and her skin was tingly and uber sensitive and the slightest touch made her very randy (her words) and the experience of birth made her feel like she needed to be physical with her dh - I suppose it's a bit like when some women experience orgasm during birth? She has had 3 kids and only felt like that with one of her children. She is very assertive, earns a fortune and so is not tied financially to her dh at all - she could leave him at the drop of a hat and be secure financially, I doubt very much she was forced to do anything against her will or she wouldn't have re told the story with such hilarity.

I cannot imagine anything worse myself having had a terrible birth but that doesn't mean that someone else would be the same as me, although I accept it is very unusual.

And as I said I can just imagine said friend trying to close the curtains for a 'quick one' with no regard for anyone else on the ward.

Anyway - discussed this subject with friends last night and everyone thought it was a terrible idea and the thought of it made us very glad we weren't planning to have any more kids!

Well I said AN innocent bloke not all ,

Sleepy - could you please tell me where I said that I didn't think there were any men who wouldn't like to 'catch sight of some knockers/tits out'?

I said I am staggered that there are so many revolting specimens out there & that it seems to be quite a general thing and not only in 'rough' areas. Really staggered

Nothing to do with what you have said I said, at all

Fatlazymummy - there are posters on this thread who have simpered about 'men seeing their boobs'. I didn't say it was everyone's reason not to want them there and I didn't say you were simpering.

Viva - I totally agree that just 'wanting' your partner there is no reason other women should have to have them there, what I am saying is that the care on most post natal wards is so totally inadequate that many women need someone there to either help them or look after the baby - or help them to look after the baby. IF the wards were adequately staffed and women could be confident of getting the care they need from the ward staff, then 95% of of women who currently fell they want/need their partner to be there would be happy for them not to be.

Harry/Sleepy - it has nothing to do with selfishness or a sense of entitlement for 95% of women who want/need their partner there. For 95% of women it's about knowing that there is someone there to help them to the loo/pick up the crying baby and pass it to them when it's crying/get them something to drink or even get a nurse when they are in excruitiating pain. Our post natal wards are hidiously understaffed, often (sorry Viva - not you :() staffed with people who don't care enough/are nasty to the mothers (read the thread). There isn't another ward where you are the patient (often unable to get out of bed/move) and are expected to also care for a newborn baby. FFS - that is why it's different to any other ward. Why can't you see that?

RollOnChristmas - I suggest you meet some decent men then tbh. I know plenty of men who do not 'throw up a little in their mouths' & are quite able to say the word 'period'.

I am not saying that women shouldn't care about someone/anyone seeing them learning to bf or bleeding as they walk along or whatever - what I am saying is that in the majority of cases (excluding women who have been raped or otherwise abused) I do not see what all of the fuss is about whether that is a man or a woman and whether it's during the day or at night. It's not like those things only happen at night.

As for the other issues noise/space etc I totally understand why it's less than desirable to have anyone else stay overnight - irrespective of their gender, but until the post natal wards are adequately staffed then I think it's the only way the women who are unable to move to care for themselves and their babies will get the help they need. Is that shit? Of course it is! Is it the womans fault she needs someone to help? No it isn't!

If people are going to put effort into writing letters, contacting their MP's or whatever else - then make funding/staffing the issue - not Dad's staying on wards or not.

I think most people who have spent more than a couple of nights in hospital will know how utterly exhausting even visiting time can be - there seems to be a bit of a collective sigh of a relief when it's over and quiet (ish) again. There just is no need to have non patients sleeping on the wards.

Why on earth should women not 'simper' if men see their boobs? So what? If you're happy for strange men to see your breasts then good for you. I'm not, and I'm sure plenty of other women aren't either. Thankfully when I was on a postnatal ward our privacy was respected.

Chipping has inspired me to link to this campaign thread again

I see your point Chipping and others' about needing someone rather than just wanting someone.
But I think with the extra cleaning, security and extra work for midwives it's a bit of a false economy for the NHS.
Probably cheaper to have a nurses' assistant/carer type person whose job is solely passing babies to mothers/ fetching formula. Wouldn't cost as much as a qualified nurse and a hell of a lot less than extra cleaners/security/stressed overworked midwives off sick/lawsuits from the few who do suffer at the hands of Bad fathers or pick up infections from bad sanitation.
I wonder have they bothered costing it out or are they just scaremongering.

I'd simper!!

The visiting men on the antenatal ward I was on constantly used the toilet as it was quite far to the nearest visitors toilets and outside the unit, they couldn't be bothered to get back into the unit as they had to wait to be let in by a member of staff. I had to clean them afterwards before using them. Also when I went into labour even though I was doubled up in pain there were male visitors standing only about a foot away from me. It is degrading to be in this position during the day, the midwives only came sporadically into the bay. At night I would have felt very vulnerable and degraded.

Has any thread ever got so near the Magic Millenary with such near-unanimity?

Incidentally who did the original suggestion come from?

This it was suggested in "a joint publication produced by the Royal College of Midwives, the Department of Health, the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists and the Fatherhood Institute"

Link here

Can I be post # 1,000?