Just gone postal at this woman for making out I was an abusive parent.

[thatgirlsevil]

As the title suggests...I've just gone postal at a woman who decided to follow me down the street and comment on my parenting techniques.

It started off when myself and 3YO DS left a shop after I refused to buy him a treat on the basis of his naughty behaviour (not listening, running off)...he was doing the whole I'm-not-walking collapsed jelly legs thing and I was pretty much hoisting him along and chastising him through gritted teeth (holding him by the wrist but not applying any pressure)...but yes at some points dragging him (no skin touching the floor, just heels) as he protested and tried to resist, although not hurting him to be absolutely clear.

When I let him go he was throwing himself on the concrete and I tried getting down to his level and talking to him but he was too 'in the zone' to see reason...as I shouted at him... exasperated by this point and getting quite upset, he ran off and almost ran into the side road so I grabbed him around the waist, scooped him up as he kicked out and protested and I shouted at him, quite loud...no swearing or horrible words, just general chastising.

The final straw came when I let him down and he bit my middle finger...HARD and broke the skin and it started bleeding quite heavily. I grabbed his hand and at this point started walking very fast across the road to the other side and shouting at him. He was half running beside me and now sobbing...finally moving his legs though because he knew he had totally crossed a line and done something completely unnacceptable.

At this point a woman (mid twenties) sprinted after me and tells me she has been watching out the shop window and it was really terrible to watch...she tells me I should be calm and get down to his level and keeps repeatedly saying how she had been watching and she was sure others were watching and feeling very concerned for the little boys welfare. She said I was making a scene and again, people were watching....and then she actually asked me something along the likes of WHY WAS I TRYING TO GET HIM HOME SO FAST...WHAT WOULD HAPPEN THEN?

It was at this point that I ABSOLUTELY FLIPPED at the suggestion DS might be in danger...and started shouting who the hell was she judging me on the basis of seeing 5 minutes of my parenting at it's worst...I asked her what she was suggesting I might do to DS and how she thinks I could be handling the situation better without spouting Supernanny #101 rhetoric.

I said that I doubted she would have the brass neck to approach a parent who actually was doing something like hitting or swearing at their child in the street.

I basically told her she was an idiot who didn't have a clue what was actually occurring and I clearly needed support rather than condemnation right now. I also said how her tackling me and undermining me in front of DS was idiotic in the extreme when he was clearly having a tantrum, a natural common thing.

I showed her my hand and was shouting about how he'd bit me extremely hard...hence my whipping him across the road and him being in tears. I was ranting now...out of anger, embarrassment and just general exasperation...and I was getting noticeably teary.

I asked her if she had children herself and she hesitated before saying "umm...yes"...it seemed like a lie but maybe she was just floored by my outburst.

She wasn't trying to help me at all...it was as though she wanted me to feel ashamed of how I'd handled the situation and of course I could have handled it better, but at no point did I apply force or hit or swear at DS. I never do.

I burst into tears when I got back home, I was sobbing for myself, DS and I started thinking that the people who witnessed the events must think I'm a fucking monster. I would probably be ashamed to walk down that street again because the fact that this woman thinks I would hurt DS makes me so bloody furious.

I actually asked DS if Mummy had hurt him and he said "No...I was being naughty and I'm sorry for biting you"...I said, please tell me if I hurt you, I'm sorry if I made you feel frightened...he said "I wasn't, I just wanted a treat...but I know I'd been naughty."

I am still so fucking upset. I feel like a shitty shitty Mum.
(sorry it's long)

You are not a shitty parent. We have all had days where we feel at the end of our tether with our child and lose our patience! A child who decides not to walk out and run off repeatedly is exhausting. It's very easy for other people to watch through a window and judge.

YANBU at all. I can't believe the cheek of some people, honestly.

She was unreasonable interfering, I would have told her to bog off too.

But for shouting YWBU. It never works, as you found out.

With my DS I usually threaten to withdraw days out or his favourite toys.

Hope your day today better.

an abusive parent would have battered him more after someone intervened i wager

it wasn;t brave at all, it was sticking her oar in - nothing productive can come of it. make a good mum feel shit, makes a shit mum batter their kid.

I think most of us realise shouting at our kids doesn't work - can you honestly say you've never shouted at anyone though?

Also, all children are different. I have one who I never felt pushed by and one who just is harder work. It's not her fault and does not justify me to shout at her and I try not to. But there are some kids who push buttons more than others.

OP - so sorry for your shitty day. Been there, done that, but fortunately no one has ever approached me.

Now mumsnet, tell me about these holds. 'Rolled up carpet' is the one I use (child lies across your arms, facing outwards, yes?'). But rugby ball? how does that one work?

Rugby hold is under one arm, kind of lying on your hip. Head sticking out front, legs thrashing out the back. They can't really do much damage that way and it leaves your other arm free for doing stuff. As I said, I used to carry dd in the sling because that was the best way to manage both dcs when ds was tantrumming. If I had a pram I was stuck.

My 3yo DS had a screaming tantrum in Boots yesterday shouting "I wanna go to go to Sainsburys " over and over and flinging himself about DH was mortified but I just took a deep breath explained to DS that we would go there next and let him scream , please note I wouldn't have been so calm if I'd been on my own
We then had a meltdown in Sainsburys because it wasn't Tesco somedays you can't win

Fireman's lift works for me DS is too heavy & strong for much else and I can pin down kicking legs

This is the age old parenting problem isn't it? My friends mum always used to say that in public no one ever sees your childs hour long naughtiness, just the hissy fit you throw when you finally snap. I would just dust myself down and start again. Nobody is perfect and most of us lose our temper at some point.

I also think that sometimes however you respond you will be judged. I'm sure she would have judged me the time my then 3 year old had a melt down in clarks. After 20 minutes of trying to calm him down, I gave him the option of walking or being dragged. I put his wrist strap on and proceeded to walk to the bus stop like I hadn't a care in the world dragging him behind me. The floor in shopping centre was skiddy so he came to no harm but I did get odd looks. By the end though ds had enough and get up and walked! I'm sure I was judged plenty that day!

I really think the number of people who say this is normal and everyone does it really need to re-read the op and how sustained the shouting was. I have never seen anyone behave like that.
I don't think it's particularly helpful to the op in going forward to downplay it tbh.

Even supernanny probably has days when she loses her temper and reacts badly...
You probably didn't handle the siutation in the best way- but you admit that, but every parent would handle some tantrums differently - nobody is perfect... So, put it behind you - it happened, YANBU to be angry at this lady who probably has not experienced the mother of all tantrums, so relax and move on....

I think the only thing you did wrong was to explain yourself to a complete stranger. Why did she deserve an explanation? I know the feeling to justify yourself can take over but seriously, the "mind your own business" approach is much more satisfying.

We have all be in that situation, don't beat yourself up about it.
When DC tantrum in shops and do the jelly legs 'I am not going to move' thing you have no choice but to take them by the arm and drag them home.

That woman clearly has no children, or she would have understood, and sympathised.

Just to clarify a few more things...

I don't have a drink problem. DS was in bed when I decided to have a few drinks and come and here and vent/gauge opinion. I don't think 4 beers on a Saturday night counts as excessive.

I don't agree with the assumption that DS was "terrified"...he was so caught up in his own meltdown that he barely even registered my reaction. I never said I was IN HIS FACE shouting because that's not what happened. I shouted at him once at his level as talking calmly was having absolutely no impact and he had thrown himself backwards on a concrete pavement (he refused to even look at me.) I shouted something along the lines of "you are being terribly naughty right now, please calm down...this has got to stop."

RE: the road incident.
DS turned round and darted towards the shop where he'd been refused a treat. He didn't reach the side road but he was running in that direction...this is what caused me to grab him around the waist and shout loudly...something like, "DS you cannot run off into the road, you know how dangerous that is. I'm getting very angry now..."

It's being suggested his running in the direction of the road was down to me putting him in danger...that suggestion upsets me a bit. He was running towards the shop, not thinking at all, and he never got as far as the road.

The REAL shouting occurred after the bite. I shouted something along the lines of "Right DS, I can't believe you just did that...that is just terrible. We are going home right now and you better start moving."

Like I've said...I could have dealt with the whole situation in a calmer, more rational manner. I would have welcomed supportive intervention...but the woman seemed to want to humiliate and accuse me at a moment where it was evident that both DS and I were upset and exhausted by the incident.

It was the straw that broke the camels back...and I have never went mental at somebody like that...never. I was a bit shaken up by my own reaction, but then nobody has ever insinuated that I might hurt my child.

I know shouting doesn't work...I know that.

Anyway, I will catch up with replies later. Today is a new day and aside from DS asking me if my finger was ok and apologising again - and me accepting apology, reassuring him but letting him know it's wrong - I've decided not to discuss it any further with him.

Thanks for all the replies...I'm trying not to be too defensive because I know I went about things the wrong way.

I think you did very well in the circumstances ...... I wonder how many of the saints on here would have reacted in the same way ?

well, i think strangers have every right to point out crappy stuff tbh - i am so thrilled when a stranger tuts at one of the ds' when they are playing up (and, yes, i do know about sen; one of them is in the middles of asd assessment and has had terrible meltdowns before now, in public)
because it reinforces my assertion that they are misbehaving.
what would be better - the woman coming on here and posting about this shouty woman ; everyone would be screaming CP and berating her for not intervening.
Calm parent plus tantrumming child; no issue
Out of control parent and child ; issue

Nothing more than a reminder to check your parenting has happened. Better that than she called the police, surely?

From your OP it sounds like you had lost control.

It sounds like the other woman was trying to help, and was worried about your DS. I agree with the other poster who said that it is a good thing for children to know that they live in a community where people are concerned about their well-being.

Do you have much support or help with your DS? It can be relentless sometimes with a 3 yo.

I can see why you were upset but also why she intervened. It can be terrifying to watch when "the red mist" descends as you say yourself it had and although I can totally understand where you were coming from having been there myself we don't know what motivated her, perhaps she had experiences of being abused as a child and felt she had to speak out. It does sound like it was horrible to watch and I can completely understand your reaction but I can also understand yours. You know your situation better than anyone and if this was just a horrible shitty day that got out of hand, there's no point thinking more about it or directing anger to her.

I have plenty of support from my family and friends...and the only thing I usually need a break from is his cute but relentless yapping about anything and everything.

He hardly ever has tantrums...but yesterday he wasn't listening to me in the shops, repeatedly running ahead, pleading for EVERY little thing that caught his eye...generally being a naughty little shit to be quite frank.

Anyway, off to the park and shops now...hopefully things will be different this time.

...and I imagine calling him a naughty little shit will only cement opinion that I'm a bit crap at this Mothering lark.

grumpy why on earth should she call the police what was the op doing that was illegal . Parents are human fgs, we have feelings, we have emotions and are not robots! I expect more or less every parent has been in the op position, there are some on here with their judgy pants hoicked up to their tits! OP I would leave the thread, calm down and just put it behind you, its a phase that he will probably grow out of, we have all been there. Those who have said that they have not, must be lying

The op was not hitting/beating her ds, she was not using bad or horrible language, my goodness some people get some perspective!

I am so glad that dd is under a very sympathetic and lovely Paed when I poured my heart out to him. DD has dx of developmental delay and Autistic traits. I thought my bad parenting was the result of her SN, we was so nice and did not judge me. Things got better once the professionals were involved with dd and we went on a course run by SALT regarding effective communication with children who have social communication difficulties like dd.

I haven't read all the posts (I know I know) but "losing it" with your 3 year old is always going to look bad.

How bad it actually was only you can know but the shouting and dragging could be fairly shocking to witness.

Who knows what the womans motives for getting involved were but she did, it sounds from the details like she was trying to help by warning you that other people were watching etc.

Screaming at her in the way that you did clearly wouldn't have helped her assessment of you and was unecessary - why couldn't you just have walked away? Getting into a confrontation was silly so on that basis of course YABU.

And lets be honest MNers are always banging on about better to be safe than sorry, any concerns about a child report, always err on the side of caution etc. Is that only the case if it is a druggy, teenage mum not "one of us"?

Anything involving a screaming tantruming child looks bad! Don't keep giving op a hard time now, there is not much she can do, its very easy to judge when you are sitting with a laptop in your home, not so easy when you are in that situation.