to complain to a restaurant about their handling of a flasher??????

[CocktailQueen]

Out for dinner with my sister Saturday eve. Nice restaurant. Group of fairly pissed men at bar (bar separate from restaurant but visible). One of the men takes down his trousers, flashes his bum then turns round and flashes his willy at everyone in restaurant .

There were a couple of older children in restaurant -it was about 8.30. I called our waitress over, said 'that bloke has just flashed at everyone' and she went off to speak to bar 'manager' who proceeded to hover around the man, but not actually talking to him/remonstrating with him, ineffectually trying to get him out of the door for about the next 20 minutes.

He came over to me and sis after our main course to apologise - another table was very cross and he had been over to them to placate them - I said we were shocked and blah blah, he said 'oh, it wasn't very nice for me either' - wtf??? 'It's your job to deal with him!' I told him. And 'oh, there was no point ringing the police, they wouldn't come' (???)

Couple at other table going to ring police and complain officially.

WWYD? AIBU to expect flashers to be dealt with immediately and severely, not placated and choose to leave public place in their own time????

Insomnia,
No getting drunk in public is not acceptable, that is what is so unusual about Britain in that older people think it is acceptable and plan to do it. In most countries teenagers do it, get told off and grow out of it , but here older people in their twenties to fifties think that is is normal and acceptable to get hammered in public.

Whatmeworry,
So now women who like to go to restuarants without being indecently exposed to are sexually repressed. If this guy had tried this in any other country, including countries like Scandanavia where women go to the lcoal pools and swim topless, he would have been arrested.

Pan,
I can assure you in Denmark, any man or woman who exposed themselves in a restuarant like this would have found themselves in the cells, and in court. The idea that because a country is sexually open they are ok with crimes like indecent exposure is just wrong. Drunken loutish behaviour like this would not be tolerated at all especially in grown adults as opposed to teenagers.

I really disagree re, public drunkeness kelly

I saw plenty of very pissed people when I was out and about in the evening in Norway (and most were locals). OH has just returned from Berlin where he also saw many drunk Germans out on the town.

And I stand by my comment re. treatment of such 'criminals' in Scandinavia. Not because they're groovy about nudity but because they're quite liberal in dealing with crime.

Anyone who behaves like that, male or female, deserves to be arrested, put in the cells for the night , then be publicly named and shamed, hopefully losing their job in the process, it's not funny, it is highly offensive and threatening.
I would have called the police.

Olifin,
We will have to agree to disgaree. I know from years of living in Britain and Scandanavia that drunkenness is about a thousand times worse in the UK, and it considered far more acceptable here, and that people behave much worse here when drunk. Also as I said before in other countries there tends to be a drunkeness in public is a stupid teenager thing in general, whereas in Britain people of all ages who should know better think getting drunk in public every other weekend is fine.
The fact that a grown man exposing himself in a restuarant where children were present is considered just a drunken bit of idiocy and not a crime by some people on here indicate shows how acceptable drunken loutishness is accepted here.

Whatmeworry, So now women who like to go to restuarants without being indecently exposed to are sexually repressed. If this guy had tried this in any other country, including countries like Scandanavia where women go to the lcoal pools and swim topless, he would have been arrested

Women who go on for ages about sexual crime and sex threats and harassment and wanting to lock people up because someone else saw a drunk bloke flash his willy in a restaurant probably do have ishoos IMO.

And I suspect that any restaurant anywhere on the planet would have tried to deal with this themselves first before getting the cops in. Pubs and clubs have bouncers so typically deal with this more forthrightly, restaurants usually don't have bouncers, don't see this as often, and the last thing they want is a bunch of drunk guys kicking off.

Olifin,
You are wrrong about how this would be treated in Scandanavia. In fact although sentances are light, crimes like this is treated very seriously. This guy would have been arrested quick smart. The normal punishment with foreigners getting drunk and behaving badly would be arrest a day or two in the cells, and sent out. If they were there for a football match they probbaly would just keep them in long enough to miss the match. As this was indecent exposure in front of children he probably would have been in court on charges.
If you remember the G8 riots in Copenhagen last december, those that acted illegally were arrested and left in handcuffs on the cold (winter in Denmark!) ground for hours. When they complained the police said next time they would get more mats.

I do think we're missing the point somewhat; not that it isn't worth discussing but the OP appears to be angrier with the restaurant staff than with flasherman.

The OP asks "AIBU to complain to a restaurant?", not "AIBU to wave my cock in a restaurant?".

I started off saying "YABU" because the staff, from what I could see, did all they could. I changed tack because the manager seemed reluctant to call the police, whilst being happy for a customer to do so - in the OP's shoes I'd consider writing to the proprietor (NOT the manager) as a kindness to the staff.

Whatmeworry,
Wow, you think people complaining about indecent exposure are doing so because they have issues. So when the government drew up the sexual offences 2003 Act and classed ithis as a sexual offence they did so because they are sexually repressed and have issues. Wow.

whatmeworry - clearly the flasher was in the wrong. That's what the law says, quite rightly. Attacking people who object to his behaviour is daft. You've got the situation the wrong way round.

Jenai - I KNOW it's BU to wave one's cock in a restaurant - I don't have to ask that!!

I was thinking that the restaurant didn't do enough to prevent/stop/get rid of said lout, and was wondering if I was BU in thinking that they should have done more!!

I have written to the proprieter btw!

the whole 'nudity is funny' argument isn't true.

if that werethe case then changingrooms would be full of hystericallylaughing people pointing at each other.

no the reason flashing/streaking is'funny' is because it catces the 'audience' unawares, embarasses them, puts them in an awkward situation.

the man ddn'tflash because hethinks his willy looks funny,he flashed because he wanted the reaction from the people present . he exposed his genitals to manipulate an emotion/feeling in someone else. this is not on!

whatmeworry - clearly the flasher was in the wrong. That's what the law says, quite rightly

Absolutely. and it was clearly indecent exposure.

But just scroll back over the last 7 pages and see what the further accusations are, and the proposed penalties, and consider whether you think those are measured responses fitting with the crime.

So if you admit it was wrong, why are you attacking people who object to it and accusing them of having 'ishoos'? The law says the sentence for indecent exposure is up to two years. Exposing yourself in front of children would definitely be treated as an aggravating factor which would attract a severe punishment.

whatmeworry,
The law clearly states thta this is indecent exposure and a crime under the sexual offences 2003 act, the penalties can include going to prison and being put on the sex offenders registar. He should certainly have been arrested, and charged with indecent exposure. As should a woman who commits the same crime.

So if you admit it was wrong, why are you attacking people who object to it and accusing them of having 'ishoos'? The law says the sentence for indecent exposure is up to two years

Because i think anyone who thinks this is being sexually threatening, merits 2 years in jail and being put on the sex offenders register for the rest of their life does have ishoos frankly.

He should certainly have been arrested

Well yes, but by whom? It is extraordinarily unlikely that the police would have arrived within the 20 minutes it took for the restaurant staff to get him out of the door.

Should they have attempted to restrain him somehow?

Lets make this real - imagine it was your kid in that bar, drunk and showing off. What penalty do you think is appropriate for them?

Agree I think were to quick to want to put people on the sex offenders register.

A would have thought prat and expected him to be kicked out, I wouldn't instantly think sexual deviant lock him up, put him on the sor

Why do you think we have issues? The idiots who expose themselves are the ones with issues.

I was a military wife for a very long time and stupid, drunken behaviour like this was rife, the difference was that (a tiny minority of) the blokes only behaved this way behind closed doors and never in the company of wives and families because it is hugely disrespectful, even the biggest idiots knew this.

The one thing I do have an issue with is some peoples' total lack of respect for other people.

whatmeworry It's up to 2 years so it would be up to the sentencing judge to decide what the appropriate sentence was. It might be possible to have a community order or a suspended sentence so worrying about the severity of the sentence being disproportionate is not necessary because the court would have to take into account that this incident was not committed against a lone woman/child in a dark alley. However, still doesn't make it legal or acceptable.

I'm really surprised at all the people on this thread who have seen women flashing their vaginas around the place! People have mentioned boobs being flashed but that's not the same crime - sexual offences act clearly states genitals so while agree with Pan it's not reversible for the reasons s/he gives it's also not the same because as far as I'm aware boobs are not genitals...are they?!

if it was my child, i would think being arrested, a night in cells and caution would be the very least i would expect. i am veering towards a court appearnce with a suspended sentence, and named and shamedin the local paper. yes i wouldbe absoloutely mortified but i think the policetaking this seriouslyis the only way to reduce the amountof incidents. and i think we are all agreed that flshing infront of children in a restaurant is the type of incident that should be reduced in numbers.

In practice even if the police had come, I think it is unlikely he would even have ended up charged with anything - the most likely scenario is he would crumble when confronted by the police, apologise and not do it again.

If a child of mine grew up and started to develop a predilection for exposing their genitals in restaurants I would want them snapped out of it before it led to further trouble (even more inappropriate sexual behaviour, doing it in front of work colleagues after a works night out, getting arrested abroad or beaten up by people who are less turn-the-other-cheek about it than this particular group of diners) even if it did mean a court appearance or the sexual offenders' register.

I don't think he should have been jailed, or put on the sex offenders register, assuming this was a first offence. I do think he should have been arrested, spent a night in a cell and then cautioned the next day. It might make him, and others, think twice before doing it again.

Sex offenders register may be appropriate for someone who thinks it's funny to show their penis to children, IMO. Obviously that would be up to the judge, but I don't think it's unreasonable.