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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to complain to a restaurant about their handling of a flasher??????

250 replies

CocktailQueen · 19/09/2011 11:04

Out for dinner with my sister Saturday eve. Nice restaurant. Group of fairly pissed men at bar (bar separate from restaurant but visible). One of the men takes down his trousers, flashes his bum then turns round and flashes his willy at everyone in restaurant Shock.

There were a couple of older children in restaurant -it was about 8.30. I called our waitress over, said 'that bloke has just flashed at everyone' and she went off to speak to bar 'manager' who proceeded to hover around the man, but not actually talking to him/remonstrating with him, ineffectually trying to get him out of the door for about the next 20 minutes.

He came over to me and sis after our main course to apologise - another table was very cross and he had been over to them to placate them - I said we were shocked and blah blah, he said 'oh, it wasn't very nice for me either' - wtf??? 'It's your job to deal with him!' I told him. And 'oh, there was no point ringing the police, they wouldn't come' (???)

Couple at other table going to ring police and complain officially.

WWYD? AIBU to expect flashers to be dealt with immediately and severely, not placated and choose to leave public place in their own time????

OP posts:
SybilBeddows · 19/09/2011 11:42

and the Victim Support man in the BBC article agrees with you BeMyBebe:

'Andrew Buckingham from Victim Support also believes the crime should be taken seriously, but says: "I think some victims themselves take a light-hearted approach to it - they might just pity the person.
"Others have the presence of mind to shoot a withering comment back to humiliate them.
"That seems like a good tactic given the aim of the flasher is almost certainly to cause shock, distress or even anger, but certainly not amusement."'

I think the thing is, there is no contradiction between having a zero-tolerance approach to it and not being upset by it; it's easier for some people to handle than others, but some things are better dealt with by stopping people doing them, rather than by effectively telling the people who are upset by witnessing it to get a grip.

bemybebe · 19/09/2011 11:45

Agree Sibil

I would also reassess the status of the restaurant as "nice" where (in the words of Caymans) 'the bar/restaurant serve people alcohol to the point where they are so drunk they start removing their clothes and put me off my food'

Totally agree...

squeakytoy · 19/09/2011 11:47

Sybil, the article you are quoting from is about people who expose themselves purposely, in public places, with the intent to cause distress and for sexual gratification, which is a completely different context to a pissed bloke in a pub dropping his trousers!

bemybebe · 19/09/2011 11:48

sybil

but, hey, I never said "get a grip", i said "i sympathize" with OP

altinkum · 19/09/2011 11:48

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SybilBeddows · 19/09/2011 11:49

It doesn't stop it being flashing just because it is in a restaurant, and it doesn't stop it being flashing because he is drunk, any more than it stops it being a crime if someone drunk in a restaurant gropes someone.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2011 11:50

squeakytoy my best friend once got her boob out in a packed pub. Blush (for her) She was paralytic and had this one shouldered top on and we'd been discussing how easy it would be for an ungentlemanly gentleman to, ahem, ruin her modesty. So she then treated us to a demonstration.

I'm not just saying this, but my friend is the most ladylike and decent in our group (yeah, yeah sounds like it, doesn't it?) and we don't know what came over her. She doesn't remember it and she's grateful that she doesn't. She's never done anything like this before or since and I don't think any less of her for it because I know her as a person.

Not sure what point I'm trying to make really. Blush Just that high jinx can be the reason for this type of thing, rather than an underhand motive. Not that I agree with it. Nothing gives me the heebies more than thinking about the public catching a glimpse of any part of my regions.

kelly2000 · 19/09/2011 11:50

It is weird that in the UK there is a large percentage of people (I think one survey had it as at least 25%) that think if a woman gets drunk and is wearing a mini-skirt it is her fault if a man rapes her, yet when a drunk man removes his clothes to expose his penis to people including children, people say he should not be punished even though he has committed a sexual offence because it amused him and he was drunk.
So if you are a woman getting drunk is an unofficial crime punishable with a sexual assault, if you are a man getting drunk is a defence to committing a crime and anyone who has a problem with this needs to get a grip.

Squekytoy, he exposed his penis for his own gratification. The fact he did it in a restuarant, and not on the street makes no difference.

SybilBeddows · 19/09/2011 11:51

I know you didn't BeMyBebe, sorry if it came across that way

Clumsymum · 19/09/2011 11:53

I doubt the police would have come out for such an incident.

Of course management have a responsibility to get him out of the restaurant, but a good restaurant manager will do that WITHOUT causing a rumpus, which would just attract more attention to the guy who did it, and would probably cause more disturbance to the rest of the clientel. It sounds like thats what they did (my guess is that the 'offenders' group had also amassed quite a big bill, and the restaurant manager wants to get that paid - which he might not get if he has them all chucked out )

I think you are being a bit prissy TBH.

If you would recognise that customer again (or you know his name) you could ring the police and report him for indecent behaviour. But no-one was actually hurt, and I would far rather have my tax money spent on investigating actual physical assaults/murders/burglerys than with giving a complete pratt a telling-off.

edam · 19/09/2011 11:55

Bar manager should have called the police. He's at fault for not doing that.

All this 'the prat didn't mean to do it' is cobblers. He's responsible for his behaviour. He's responsible for getting so drunk he committed a crime. IMO exposing his genitals in front of children is appalling and he should be made to face the consequences.

I wouldn't make a big fuss in front of the children but that doesn't mean you ignore it.

Now the idiot has learned it's OK to flash in front of children because no-one called the police immediately. He'll think it's big and clever to get that drunk. And possibly do even worse next time.

bemybebe · 19/09/2011 11:55

This group should have been asked to leave way before this bloke started flashing. I am sure they were already nuisance with loud drunken laughter and indecent language before taking it another step further...

IrmaMuthafucker · 19/09/2011 11:56

YANBU. At best it's anti-social at worst it's a sex offence.

The manager should have asked the man to leave immediately and if he refused called the police to have him removed from the premises. Not least because they could lose business if they have a reputation for allowing this sort of thing. Who wants to take their family to the flashed restaurant?!

I cannot believe there are people on this thread who think it's just a harmless prank to flash children and others at 8.30pm in a restaurant! If it was a lairy pub that does stag dos then you might expect such behaviour but as Bupcajes says it's all about context.

Disgusting behaviour.

bemybebe · 19/09/2011 11:57

kelly are those the same 25% people though?

altinkum · 19/09/2011 11:58

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

IrmaMuthafucker · 19/09/2011 11:58

The police will come just to remove someone from a premise who has refused to go never mind one who is committing a sexual offence.

SybilBeddows · 19/09/2011 11:59

Clumsymum probably has it right re unpaid bill.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2011 11:59

I don't think that anyone thinks that it's a "harmless prank", Irma. We're just distinguishing the difference between some twat who's had too much to drink and needs to learn to handle his booze better and an actual offence worthy of police notification. We're doing this to work out whether the bar manager was right in not calling the police.

Hopefully, the bloke in question was mortified the next day.

squeakytoy · 19/09/2011 11:59

when a drunk man removes his clothes to expose his penis to people including children, people say he should not be punished even though he has committed a sexual offence because it amused him

how is it a sexual offence?

Is it a sexual offence when people streak across football pitches?

Is it a sexual offence when people on the gay pride marches are strutting their stuff naked?

Nobody is going to be damaged by the sight of a drunk bloke showing off his tackle...

I doubt very much he was on display for more than a few seconds, or that he was walking around from table to table giving everyone a close look.

edam · 19/09/2011 12:00

It's been said very clearly that flashing is a criminal offence.

lolaflores · 19/09/2011 12:00

I think the OP has a reasonable right to eat her meal, which she has paid for within a place where she is not going to have to put up with that sort of carry on. the lack of courtesy and common manners is at the bottom (excuse that) of this. The manager sounds ill equipped to deal with the problem properly, but I do think the police should have been called. Sounds like more than the OP were offended by it.

SybilBeddows · 19/09/2011 12:02

re the proper spending of public money, I am sure that, as with most things, early intervention is more cost-effective than ignoring the small crimes and only dealing with the big ones that cost ££££ to investigate and prosecute.

IrmaMuthafucker · 19/09/2011 12:02

Bupcakes I was agreeing with you. There are other people on this thread taking the attitude that it's harmless enough. Which it isn't.

BupcakesandCunting · 19/09/2011 12:03

But, and this IS a but, I'm not saying that this IS the case, I have no idea... do the police distinguish between flashing in the sense of flashing for sexual gratification and flashing such as streaking/drunken tomfoolery? I don't know if they do. I don't know if they would quantify this as flashing? If the police did take him in, would he be charged for indecent exposure and put on the S.O register, or charged for drunk and disorderly?

Whatmeworry · 19/09/2011 12:04

He came over to me and sis after our main course to apologise

You have joined the League Of The Professionally Offended.