to be offended by wedding lists?

[chandellina]

It's one thing if you are truly setting up home for the first time as a young couple. Quite different IMO if you have owned a home and lived together for the past 10 years and now want a bunch of new things courtesy of a John Lewis gift list.

AIBU to resent my friends asking me to buy them new saucepans, duvet covers and towels? And why do we tolerate these lists, yet balk at the idea of baby showers, which actually serve a useful purpose?

I don't find the existence of a list insulting. Yes, I would rather buy something they want than something they don't. And if I were a loaded great-aunty who wanted to throw serious amounts of money at the happy couple, I would be even more intent on making sure that the money was being thrown in the right direction.

And I do know that most people do seem to just chuck the list in with the invitation. I am aware that it is not generally regarded as an obscene hardly-to-be-contemplated faux pas.

BUT - no matter how common a practice this is - it is still loathesome. And lots of what Wamster has just said strikes chords with me. And it speaks of a certain arrogant complacency that seems to surround weddings (certain sorts of weddings anyway). And it does still rankle that there were no thankyous to those two wedding gifts, and that I contributed money I can't afford to a "holiday of a lifetime" and am STILL getting brochures from Trailfinders about places I will NEVER be able to afford to go to.

SiamoFottuti, I think you need to grow up a bit, I -completely accurately- said that a lot of people don't like weddings and you have used this as an excuse as a personal attack.

As for spineless, er, not really, being in a family involves give and take and means attending functions you would rather not attend out of a sense of duty.

Oh dear, I seem to have cross-posted with some of the Don't Diss My Wedding brigade. Sometimes talking about weddings with a slightly raised eyebrow makes people react as if you are talking about roasting bunnies on a bonfire made of puppies.

But it doesn't mean you have to bitch about them or judge them for a perfectly conventional part of modern weddings.

Im not a huge fan of gift lists but the worst are the money poems!!!! We are getting married this year and we are just simply not saying anything, most people have asked us what we would like and we have just said money to go towards a bathroom (we are living with a 70's monstrosity that leaks). Lots of people have said we should do a list as we will end up getting lots of things we dont like but the way I see it is that most people will give us money and the gifts we do get bought I will enjoy as they will always remind me of my wedding day.

At the risk of repeating the rest of the thread - someone has been living with their DP for 10 years then gets married, how the hell to you get them a gift without a) risking getting them something they already have/don't have houseroom for or b) asking them what they want? Surely it's easier to do no list if the couple are only just first moving in together as you know they need everything...

Also, the suggestion that this is a 'new' tradition is bollocks, it's just been made easier and more open by technology, my parents had a 'list of things they needed' - but it was a paper list that was handed round the aunties (didn't specify shops or brands, but did say things like 'saucepans', 'cutlery set', bedding etc) and they crossed off the thing they were getting and passed in on to the next family, that was the way of the 60's and 70's weddings up north (and had probably been done that way for generations). The down side of this plan is obviously a) you don't get a say in what you're getting, b) you have to do your list several months in advance to give it time to get round to everyone c) it only works if all your family still live in a small community d) people have to buy whole sets of crockery/cutlery or agree amongst themselves to club together, you cant just get the side plates and hope everyone else gets from the same range.

So people stopped doing it this way when families started dispersing, you had a couple of decades of people getting random gifts (and spending the first few weeks of married life returning things for the gift they actually wanted/needed) or the poor mother of the bride would hold a list and spend weeks before the wedding answering 'what shall I get them' phone calls, before the technology found an easier way to do the old fashioned list idea.

Why anyone would think it's better for the bride and groom to get something they don't really want or field 50+ phone calls about it, reciting a list, trying to remember what they've told the other guests etc is beyond me.

And asking for cash is cheap. It just is.

blueskydrinking. No it does not. I have judged them and I will bitch about them because I think their actions have been vulgar and rude.
I find them offensive because there is no excuse for it and, believe me, I am a bit of a bleeding heart liberal!
I don't care if it is conventional or not- 'convention' does not come into it; if it were conventional to kill another person (extreme example, I admit) at a wedding would I find it OK? Course I would not.

The thing is... planning a wedding is a bit of a minefield.

Who will be offended if you miss them out. Who will be offended if they're invited and they HAVE to go even if neither of you really want to see each other. Who will be offended because the venue is more than what they consider to be a reasonable distance from their house. Or because their mate isn't invited. Or because kids are. Or aren't. Or because there is a list. Or isn't. And so on ad infinitum.

When you're the sort of person who usually just minds their own business and just wants a great day to look back on without pissing off everybody you know, you think it would be so bloody difficult.

The only reason it is is because people get so het up about this sort of thing.

Please don't kill anybody at their wedding, wamster

*wouldn't think it would be so difficult

And threads like this is exactly why we went abroad. I couldn't be bothered with people judging and bitching because I didn't do exactly what their version of wedding etiquette stated. And as this thread shows, we all seem to have a different concept of what we all 'should' do.

Out of interest Wamster - what would you suggest? That when people get married don't invite your family in case they don't want to spend money and get offended. Go for the simplest cheapest route possible and don't, FOR GOODNESS SAKES celebrate in any way shape or form. Wear whatever you happen to have that's clean, just go to the registry office. Don't smile. Don't ask for presents, don't accept presents.

Man, I am sooooo glad I don't know you in RL. I think

I agree with you on one hand - people who put wedding lists in the invitations from say, Harrods, with the minimum spend being £200 and who don't thank people for gifts, and get married in obscure, difficult and expensive locations. Yes - they are spoilt, selfish and insensitive. But they are by FAR in the minority.

Now that is a good idea, AbsDuWolef. I am absolutely certain that many a person breathe a massive sigh of relief upon hearing that a family member or friend has eloped.

I said earlier that I didn't want a wedding list for my wedding (which is next bloody weekend). But I adore going to the wedding of others, and will happily buy something off their lists, unless I know that there is a present that they will appreciate for different reasons. Just because I believed a list for my wedding was unnecessary doesn't mean I disagree with their existence nor that I dislike weddings of friends/family,

I don't even mind if the list comes with the invites, it's what is on the list that matters. If the list is truly not being grabby then it will have various items that can be purchased, for those who are financially not as well off as others. Grabby lists are the ones that some have mentioned here - glasses that cost £50 and the couple need six . That is grabby and if the couple themselves couldn't afford that particular item themselves then they shouldn't put it on the bloody list for friends and family to stump up.

However, whilst I haven't got a list, my family have contributed different items of my wedding for me, chipping together and getting a photographer, band etc. My family have agreed that they are really looking forward to the day as they have helped it come together.

We have paid for the majority of costs, but the extras are really helpful and a list is therefore pointless in our case.

Now I am SUPER relieved I don't know you in RL. But, in the event that maybe I do, if you receive an invite for a wedding next June, feel free to not accept and don't feel obliged to send a gift. HTH

I agree, Reindeer.

And 'requests' for money. There's never a good way to put that. It's crass and tacky. If you don't need anything, then that means you need nothing, including money.

It all follows this general trend of weddings as events more than celebrations - weekend/week-long stag and hen do's (abroad, of course), blowout weddings (it's all about the 'day', natch), followed by requisite honeymoon abroad.

The whole idea that guests should compensate in gift their cost to the host is indicative of how the host sees the whole thing.

So, if I get an invite for a wedding next June, regardless of who it is from- could be from my sister who would-be-mightily-peed-off-never- speak-to-me-again if I didn't go, or my aunt -who has helped me massively over the years and have a sense of duty to- I should not go on the very, very, very, very, slim chance that either one of them is you?

No, it does not help.

personal attack? Saying you don't sound like the life and soul of a wedding party (when you have already said you don't like weddings) is a personal attack?
Perhaps on Planet Delicate Flower.

But as you seem to hate weddings SO very very much, why do you go? Why can't you just be honest with your family and go "I'm very sorry. I love you, but I hate weddings with a deep abiding passion and they make me thoroughly miserable, would it be alright if I don't come?"

It was a JOKE by the way. As far as I'm aware I am not related to anyone as miserable in RL

And also, have you ever thought that maybe weddings were not invented to annoy family members, but might be, amongst many people, considered to be a joyous event? A chance for communities and families to come together and celebrate the start of a relationship and new family, and not just an opportunity to piss off tight arses?

What high standards you have Wamster. So high that you have no idea how obnoxious you sound. You must truly despise living in this vulgar world that forces you to go to weddings of crass money-grabbing oiks.

May I suggest you save yourself all this pain and join an enclosed order of Carmelites?

AbsDuWolef, how do you know you're not related to somebody as miserable to me in real life? Maybe you are. Maybe I hide it well.
I go out of a sense of duty to the couple, as do most people. I think you need a reality check if you think otherwise.

As for start of new relationship, in modern times that really is a joke.

Katiepoes, my standards aren't high at all. You won't find me scouring DeBrett's guide on manners or fretting about fish knives, you will, however, find me thinking 'How effing rude' when somebody is rude and unpleasant and unthinking enough to actually put wedding list in with invite. I still cannot believe that people think that this is acceptable.

I mean does it never occur to these people that they are like children sending a list to Santa? In children, this is lovable and cute, not in adults, though. Adults have a discreet list tucked away somewhere for others to look at *if the person asks of their own accord if there is a list^.

It really is an incredibly small thing to get offended over.