... to think this couple are extracting the urine?

[PreviouslyonLost]

I work mainly part-time, DH works off-shore. Two DC, no family nearby to help out but we manage. Our eldest DC is due to start Primary School and will only be in until noon for several weeks. To accommodate this I have used the majority of my annual leave or ensured that DH is home. Another couple who live locally and whose eldest DC will be starting school at the same time are now dropping heavy hints that we should help them out by collecting and looking after their child (This would be from noon until @5pm/or 3.30pm until @5pm when going in for full-days).

There has been no direct request (yet) but lots of 'it'll all work itself out' and 'we're all in the same boat' type comments . The DW of the couple has also commented to me that they could 'drop off their DC in the mornings' at another neighbour's house - a neighbour that otherwise they do not associate with or even speak to but who is a friend of mine.

The other couple are both Primary School teachers and have been off for the Summer Holidays (47 days) ...... so .... AIBU to think that the week before school term resumes in NOT the time to start thinking about childcare, far less make assumptions that other people should take up the slack?

If they ask, just say, 'no, that's not possible'.

if they then dare to request why say, 'I don't really want to go into details, but it's not possible.'

If they dare to ask a third time, get very firm, 'I said no.'

Don't get into blaming like asking why they haven't sorted it out yet - it's not your concern. Just keep saying no. Don't make excuses.

fwiw, I taught at a secondary school where we were never allowed paid leave for family emergencies (even funerals), so almost a year before dd started school I put arrangements into place, as I couldn't sleep unless I knew my daughter was cared for. so they are def taking the piss to leave it this late.

YABU, how dare you not look after this saint of a mothers child!!!!.............................Can you tell I am being sarcastic?!! hehehehehe

What a total user!! I have to agree with just about every poster on this thread, its not a point of 'whats in it for me?', its a case of, 'its nice to be nice'. I would help anyone out, but as in this case, I would tell her to go shove a hedgehog up her hooha. You know from past experience with her, shes not gonna help you out in a crisis, so, really why does she think, she has a right to expect you to look after her children. I know its not the kiddies faults, but some parents do take the biscuit. Be strong, NO, is a powerful word, be brave, use it!!!!!! xxx

RosemaryandThyme and Forkful... We're in Scotland, and DC doesn't go in F/T until middle of October! The couple in question cannot ever be around to pick up their DC whether it's 12 noon or 3.30pm ... both in work 'til @5pm (tho' DW only works part-time, 3 full days a week).They will also have to find someone to leave DC with in the mornings because Primary 1 children MUST be accompanied by an adult until the child is physically in the school building and in the care of staff. The couple HAVE to be in their jobs for 9am and it's a good 10 minute drive away. When I think back to the 'I don't know what we're going to do next week' comment the DW made, it makes my blood boil .... it's NOT just 'next week' they need childcare for and she knows it!

Fenella1212 .... ....I would still be fuming too! It is so hard to stop this behaviour once people think they are getting away with it. Have they NO shame?

EdithWeston The DC's are not particularly good friends - this could have swayed the whole matter if they LOVED each other and were desperate to play together.

FakePlasticTrees ..... unfortunately the layout of house and garden means visitors are upon us with little or no notice. DH and I are in total agreement about not being used as childcare cover for other couple so hopefully he wouldn't crack under pressure!

StealthPolarBear .... Christmas EVE I know! WHO would??? DH not always able to here for high days and holidays so we love to make these days memorable, relishing the chance to relax and really enjoy our gorgeous DC's .... THEN the neighbour from HELL (one year was just him and the two DC, next year was all of them ) arrive on the doorstep! DH wasn't here the year they all came, lucky man.

BranchingOut ...'They won't be grateful.They will carry on doing it. They will take the mick in all sorts of ways' ..... EXACTLY .

So .... to sum up. This couple require someone to look after and take their DC to school 3 mornings a week from @8.40am. For the next 8 or so weeks they also require said child to be collected at noon and looked after until at least 5pm 3 days a week. In October the child will need picked up at 3.30pm and cared for until 5pm 3 days a week. Ad infinitum. The couple in question have not, least of all in their recent Summer Holidays (47 days need I remind you, added any good Karma investment into their (small) Community's 'Goodwill' fund, in fact they are so overdrawn it's insulting.

I've worried for MONTHS about how we were going to manage our own childcare when eldest DC went to school - youngest DC still in Nursery a few miles away. TBH, I feel like the other couple have stolen all my hard work by assuming we're here to provide permanent childcare for them. The difficulty is that we know they know we could do it .... (what film was it where they said 'NEVER assume', because then you make an ASS out of U and ME?) .... and from their perspective we're the ideal candidates to do their free childcare .

With your help and advice we have managed not to rush in and help them out, despite the crushing pressure , and we have a stock of great replies all ending in No for the denouement that is surely coming this weekend.

Kickassangel 'Don't get into blaming like asking why they haven't sorted it out yet' is a good point ... but it is very tempting to want to hear their explanation .... because the ONLY one IS 'We expected you to cover our childcare' . And do you know what? If they actually had the guts to be honest and say that, I probably would help them (with STRICT boundaries in place of course) It's their stealth approach that is so irritating. They are not bad people, just have an elevated sense of entitlement .... they didn't get where they are today by being sensitive types

nicciaa ... Hedgehog and Hooha sounds like a plan - we do get them in the garden (Hedgehogs that is!). On one of those rarest of rare days - our two DC were in Nursery, I had taken a day of annual leave, DH was home - the DW phoned in the morning to ask us to look after their 2 DC's (children or childminder were ill?) and was extremely miffed when I truthfully told her DH and I were busy. There was a LONG silence on the other end of the phone .... guilt tripping is NOT nice.

Thank you all for the support ... it is appreciated.

I had a similar situation except I said yes & not no. As soon as they went full time, that was it. I barely heard from them again. Don't do it.

Good luck this weekend.

Personally I would go for a pre-emptive strike. Arrive en-masse at theirs at 10, stay until they have to offer you lunch, ask for wine with it. Then send the time saying how hard it has been to arrange child are for tue hildren over the holiday and what a sacrifice it has been for you. Then talk about how glad you are that you will have some one on one time with your child after shook at this transitional time. Don't let them interrupt, just keep talking!

Actually, sod that, too much effort. Just say to them that you will gladly look after their child for an hour for each hour they have looked after yours, and to get back to you once they have calculated what that is.

I don't get why you let them turn up on Christmas Eve and other times when it is not convenient. Could you not just have said "sorry, now isn't a good time". Most people consider it to be good manners not to just turn up on someone's doorstep without prior arrangement, so if they got turned away, it would be their own fault.

It's one thing to be sociable, but you are inadvertently creating the impression that they can drop in whenever they like, mess up your house and then bugger off home.

I think I'd be really angry tbh.

I am a single parent with 2 dc and work full time in a school environment so have the holidays off, BUT if I need a favor picking up/dropping off I always make sure that I return said favor.

I always start my sentence with 'you can say no, but if you could do xyz that would be great' and 'no worries if you can't'

This couple need to give to receive, and someone needs to explain this to them

Thus far people have been very helpful to me and I am very appreciative of that fact.

karma will get them in the end

MumdiddyMum .... how do these people sleep at night?

As our and the neighbour's DC are roughly the same ages I'm already projecting into the future by thinking if I get guilted into looking after their first DC now, that when their 2nd DC goes to school in a few years ... I'll get BOTH of them plonked on my doorstep every day!

The smugness when the Christmas/Easter/Summer etc holidays are coming up is particularly galling .... yet still never once in 4 years had an offer of even a miserly hour playdate to help me out - particularly as I'm often on my own for weeks on end due to DH's job.

They made the assumption (wrongly) that other people would be falling over themselves to look after their child because 'we're all in the same boat aren't we?' ...errr, we're not actually!

I think you need to get (and rehearse in front of a mirror) the appropriate responses, so:

We just don't know what we'll do!

• Oh dear. What about your childminder?

They don't like the childminder / she's full!

• Oh dear. Well, there's childcare.co.uk or the local authority has a list I think

Can't you have them?

• Sorry, no that's not going to work. With DH away so much it's enough work as it is.

TheSkiingGardener ..... 'Actually, sod that, too much effort. Just say to them that you will gladly look after their child for an hour for each hour they have looked after yours, and to get back to you once they have calculated what that is' .... Genius .

karmabeliever ...' I don't get why you let them turn up on Christmas Eve and other times when it is not convenient' ... this family do not take NO for an answer, unless they arrive just as you are leaving the house there is zero chance of escape from them! I recall the DH arriving late at night to borrow something or other, sitting talking garbage for ages despite me stating that I was going to my bed over and over again, then him being seen by a nosy, gossipy neighbour leaving our house ((my DH was away) - was a nightmare to stop the rumour of people thinking I was having an affair with HIM ... thankfully my DH thought it was funny!

They've even been in our the garden when I've come home! Their excuse being 'our DCs won't pass your door and want to play with your DCs'. I have had to purposefully not unlock the house door on my return when they do this, instead I opened up the garage and started pottering around in there until they eventually went away - still doesn't stop them coming back . or, or, or, The time the DW was away for the weekend and the DH spent most of the time here moaning that he couldn't watch the football in peace because of his DC and were we going to watch it (No, my DH is not a footie man), we then offered to take eldest DC for a few hours ... and he NODDED towards DC 2 (in nappies, not walking) and said 'what about him as well?' AAAaarrrggghhh! We did manage to utter a strangled 'nooooo' that day!

They do not normally come together anymore, is usually one of the adults and the 2 DC ....that way one gets Brownie points for letting the other partner 'get a long break'. I better go do parenting stuff with the our DC .... and keep a watchful eye out for the neighbours approaching ... but don't hold your breathe for an update today..... Sunday evenings are their favouritest time to appear .... and they could be really desperate by then as SCHOOL starts on Monday.

Just start telling them how wonderful it is that you've managed to organise this leave and how you're so looking forward to spending those last afternoons together before full time school starts just you and your DC's.

I'm dreading this. I'm very lucky to be able to be a SAHM at the moment and DS starts Primary school in a couple of weeks. How long before I get clocked as having "free time" and asked for childcare do you think?

Actually, suggesting the childminder is a bad idea. It puts you in the position of the one who has to help think of a solution, and one of the solutions is for you to have them. This is not your problem - don't get sucked into it.

Stand firm this weekend, you have the quite justifiable excuse of your DH being home and him not seeing your DC when they start school next week so just want family this weekend - don't let them over the doorstep! This limits the brass-neck time. (repeat after me "This isn't a good time, we're just doing family only this weekend while DH is home.")

If she asks there and then, I agree with Kickassangel (cool name BTW) - just say that it's not possible, and refuse to discuss why.

Don't start making up excuses, you don't owe these people so you don't need to start justifying yourself.

Most importantly, don't agree to give an inch, they will take a country mile. And even more importantly, try to relax this weekend and enjoy your family time, if you're stressed, your DC will pick up on it and might wrongly attribute it to you being nervous about them starting school, you don't want them to think school is something to be scared of.

Wow they are incredibly pushy. You need to learn to be very, very strong. Just a repeated "no now is not convenient" should do it. If you try to think up excuses then it will take too long and they would be settled on your sofa before you've thought of anything.

You sound very nice and giving/welcoming etc but these people need to back off!

actually, I've had a bit of a naughty idea, could you call her now in a flap, say you've just heard your leave for next week has been cancelled and you're stuck for childcare - could she let you know who she'll be using for hers as you might see if they can help you out too.

(come Monday morning you can say you called your boss on Sunday night and discovered it was all a big mix up and your leave was in place, and gosh isn't his PA useless getting you all in a flap over nothing! )

Yoi need to be much more direct im afraid. Whe tney turn up at the the door DONT invite them in. Just smile and say hello. Then they will presumably say

Are you busy? The kids wanted to play with yours/i thought id just opo round for a coffee

Say " oh dear im afirad this isnt a good time for us as ......

Im doing the kids homework
Im up to my eyes in washimg /iroming
I have an urgent report to do for work tomorrow
The kids have a tummy bug/headlice/the plague

You must NOT let thme in and assume tney will pick up on your subtle hints.

You must start being more asertive with them if hey are annoying you so much

I have been following this thread but not yet made a comment.

I was this this situation a few years ago and was waiting with baited breath for a friend to ask me outright the same thing.

This is what I did.

During a conversation with her I casually said that a friend of mine who works full time has asked me to look after her child before school and after school.

My answer in horror was I could'nt as I can hardly get myself organized in the mornings etc without having to worry about someone elses child.

I told the friend that the other [imaginary] friend was a bit huffy about it but I was hoping we would not fall out over it but I was glad I stood my ground.

Friend number one never asked me and all was well.

Surely the correct response to "Are you busy? The kids wanted to play with yours" is "really busy, but you can take mine back to your house now".

I think long term it will be impossible to remain on good terms with these people, because they are the sort who will only respond to a very blunt fuck off 'no'. At which point they will get all offended, but on the bright side, will at least stop arriving at your house.

It's hard for you because it is not easy to tackle people who, on the face of it, are friendly. You just have to keep in mind that they are shamelessly and ruthlessly using you, under the guise of friendship. Even if they were just incredibly thick skinned, you can't go on having to hide and feeling besieged in your own home.

I think that next time they appear on the doorstep, keep them there. Don't let them in, even for a minute, because once they are over the threshold it's near impossible to get them out. Try not to get too involved in conversation - make an excuse (you've left the bath running/pot boiling on the hob/on the phone to the bank etc) and close the door. This can all be done politely, with a smile.

They may take the hint, but probably not, in which case you have to take it up a notch and say that you are not getting any family time so will only be having other people over very occasionally and will phone when it's a good time.
You could say your dc have been playing up recently so you are putting a stop to friends over until their behaviour improves.

I like Lydia's idea. I'm a great believer in lying if it gets you out of a sticky situation. it would be a shame to fall out completely, because they are your neighbours, but I do see it going that way unless you can gradually wean them off relying on you to be their DCs entertainment and baby sitter.

Don't cave over the child care - it will just set you back. If she asks outright, I wouldn't make excuses at that point, but would say that you have plans and want to spend the time just with your own family. It's honestly okay to say that you don't want to do something. It leaves her nowhere to go with that. If they have no child care, then they are in a situation entirely of their own making. It's not your problem and don't let them make it yours.

Be strong x

Any chance of you going on a surprise trip to Granny's this weekend? Or would it mean that they would just ambush you on return?

As someone said at the beginning of this thread "No" is a complete sentence.
Don't feel the need to explain (If there's one thing I've learned it's don't explain or excuse - you end up waffling and then get drawn into a discussion where you get persuaded to do the very thing you were trying to avoid!), just say "Sorry, no, it just isn't convienient." and change the subject.

I think, unfortunately, you have already 'given the inch' by your past hospitality in terms of letting them in at odd hours, offering to take the DC while the dad watched football etc.

You must now politely and firmly begin to push back the boundaries.

Would props help? I am thinking a dressing gown and a towel by the front door for starters.

If they knock on the door, wrap the dressing gown around yourself and tell them it is not a good time.

Odd hours calling? 'Would love to but we are having family time at the moment - why don't we all come over to you tomorrow morning?'

Don't offer any childcare/playdates whatsoever.

Love this thread - Have they turned up yet OP? I make it time for elevenses.....

"Fenella1212 Woah! How did you let it go on so long!" Whosegotmyeyebrows I know, how could I have been such a mug? I think it was the fact that I felt lucky to have been allowed to do the 9-3 term time only thing and I felt I should help out someone not so lucky, and she really did a good sob story. To make it worse she got a childminder from miles away who had to drive across town to pick the child up and who was always late and I would wait in the playground with both children until she turned up - so not only was the mother taking the piss, the childminder was as well!

Oh and to put the cherry on the cake, the mother said to my husband "Fenella has done so much for me I must get her a present" and my husband suggested flowers, Lush or a book token. But oh no, my 'present' was to be taken to the cinema to see a film I didn't want to see and was a sequel of something I hadn't seen because she didn't want to go on her own and her boyfriend didn't want to see the film either. So boyfriend would babysit, she would get to see the film with someone and would feel she had paid me back for all the help I'd given her. She got quite sulky when I said thanks but no thanks. I won't mention that she tried to get me to sew all the name tapes onto her child's uniform, and when I didn't she sent the child to school in unmarked uniform and whinged every time something got lost....... oh, I just did!

OP, yes this will get worse and yes you will find yourself responsible for all the children of this couple right the way through primary school. As someone else said, practice your refusal in a mirror so you are word and body language perfect. And let us know what happens!