to not like the term step-mum/dad when the person has not brought up the child/ren

[springydaffs]

I don't like ex's wife being called my children's step-mother. She isn't their 'mother', step or otherwise, she is their dad's wife. If she had brought them up, either because their father got custody or I was dead, then she should be called their step-mother, but not if all she did was marry their dad. Similarly, I don't expect my future husband to be called their step-father - 'mum's husband' is sufficient, hardly a mouthful.

But OP, no adult earns a place in a child's life, unless they are worthy of that child.
A biological mother/father who is otherwise a crap parent, does not earn a role in the child's life, they have it by default. Same as many step-parents.
It's what you do with that role that's important.

Anyway, you are talking at cross purposes OP. What you say in you last post really doesn't reflect what you said in your first post.

What I will say is this, you say that an SP doesn't have the right to have their role recognised, but yet it's expected that they have to recognise their role as an SP (otherwise they aren't embracing their partners family).

I am utterly confused by your attitudes to new partners/spouses and I think you correctly say that you've been chewed up and actually your opinion is very biased.

That said, I really hope you find some peace with your situation.

thank you chic. It's not been an easy ride - but I'm not on my own with that, as is evidenced by the posts on this thread and also it being a generally explosive subject!

I recognise that the title (step mother/father) is a legal term. I'd rather it wasn't but then, as some have pointed out, the terms eg BIL, MIL etc come with a familial title when a true brotherly/motherly relationship is not necessarily a given. I am touchy about it, the step mother thing, because of the nightmare we have experienced BUT it has given me quite a view on the thing (me and a million others) and I balk at step parents eg saying 'look here, I've slogged, I've sacrificed, I deserve some recognition' and I genuinely think that we don't, it is not a given.

I also think that step-parents don't have to love their step children. As long as they are decent and kind to said SC then that is the basic remit; anything more would be a bonus but not necessary. I am suspicious (probably because of our experience) of anyone who wants to 'love' someone else's children. imo that isn't necessary - it may grow but then again it may not. imo it doesn't have to, it's not essential.

I have been parenting these two kids for three years. More than _any- other person, I have been the one who does the day-today care of them and their home AND the one who does the long-term worrying and planning about their future.

If they don't want to use the word 'stepmom' to describe me to other people, that's one thing. But I AM their stepmother, whether I like it or not, and whether they like it or not. Their dad made that decision. And yes, I do have a right to some recognition and some respect - if not from the kids themselves, certainly from the rest of society.

I'm sorry you have problems with your children's stepmother. But I find this attitude really offensive.

'day-to-day care', I meant.

OP - if I have understood you correctly, what you are saying is that because I chose to share my life with a man who has children from a previous marriage, there are expectations of me regarding my acceptance, tolerance and accommodation of his children, but that I shouldn't expect recognition and gratitude for my contribution to their lives?

If what you describe is an accurate account of your DC circumstances, then they have been let down badly by their Dad. A gradual, phased introduction between his new partner and DC would have reduced the chance of their feeling resentment towards her. If your exH has stood by without intervening while his new partner undermined DC relationship with you, their mother, then he is the one who has failed his DC's.
Ultimately, it is the parent who is responsible for the influence their DCs are exposed to in the home - your frustration and anger is directed, IMO, at the 'wrong' person

I can see your problem, springydaffs-the step parent shouldn't be undermining in any way-they should be an added dimention-not taking anything away.
I don't think that DCs are stupid, I think that you just continue your own good relationship and there is no way your DC are going to stop loving you, they do see through anyone who is trying to manipulate them.

brdgrl you are their stepmom if you are looking after them all the time. What I am taking exception to are partners who have the care of the children less than full-time, particularly partners who don't really have care of the children at all, being called step-parents. I still don't see why 'mum's husband' or 'dad's wife' shouldn't be enough. It may sound cold - though it shouldn't! - but it does explain the situation adequately imo.

Disney - yes, their dad has been the villain of the piece but his wife took to it with bells on. She is very wealthy and practically groomed them. Anyways, that was my situation but I still stand by my OP, that imo someone who has less than full care of their partner's children shouldn't be called the children's step parent.

I do have an analogy that sounds preposterous but... I wonder how wives would feel if their husband's secretary/PA were to be called his step-wife, not in jest but in all seriousness, with rights and demands for recognition and equality with the wife. I know that's a ridiculous parallel and not an adequate analogy but it goes some way to explaining how I feel about the thing. I am not bitter or frustrated - outraged, yes, and touchy about it. I'm not the only one though eh. It's a very touchy subject all round.

I can only guess how women (and men) feel when their spouse leaves for someone else, breaking their heart, and the abandoned spouse has to bear the pain of the cuckoo in the nest OW/M assuming a parental role with the children. Ouch. Of course it's better if the new spouse/partmer engages with the children and is not evil but nonetheless that must be a very painful scenario for the abandoned spouse.

Of course it is painful-but the parents are the adults-they hide it -they shouldn't try to divide the loyalties of the DCs or make them feel guilty for being friendly with a stepparent.

This is the definition of the Cambridge dictionary online

the man or woman who is married to someone's mother or father but who is not their real father or mother

I think that anywhere would say more or less the same. It isn't talking about the quality of the parenting. The new partner has a recognised relationship with the DCs.

I don't think that dad's wife describes it at all-it intimates that she only has a relationship with him and is nothing to the DCs.
As said earlier if I was married to a man with DCs I would expect to get very involved with his DCs and would refuse to be placed in a compartment. He doesn't come alone and you can't have him without his DCs.
It wouldn't be an equal relationship if you get shut out of a significant part and are dismissed as 'dad's wife'-if I wasn't 'my step mother'-experience tells me to get out early or life will be impossible.

YANBU -

I know step-mother is a legal term and yadda yadda yadda

But in day-to-day terms I think a step mum or dad is someone who is bringing a child up i.e. where they are resident with them and acting 'as a parent' (most usually where the bio-parent is completely absent or is a very occasional visitor). Anybody else is 'my dad's wife' etc...

I think of the distinction like this, from my experience: My dad married when I was a teenager, I have gone on holiday and spent 'quality' time with his family etc..., but I always thought of his wife as his wife. The day they got divorced I never saw or heard from her again, whereas if she was my 'stepmum' (someone who had brought me up as a 'mum' from childhood) I might be expected to have continued my relationship with her even though she had split up from my dad.

I think that you are all coming at it from the point of the 1st wife who wants the second wife to stay in a box-she can have the ex -but she can't be a proper part of his life.
I am coming from the point of 2nd wife-who doesn't want to take over, but does expect to say what goes in my own house and not do everything through DH-I would not be staying in a box! I would get to know the step children, (not as mother) and see them on my own, go out on my own with them. If I can't do this I would walk away early because it will cause years of hassle. I would expect to be grannyfruits to any grandchildren, have them to stay etc.
If I am going to be kept firmly as 'dad's wife' and someone they don't want to know and will never see without dad ,then I would stop the relationship-saves a lot of anguish in the long run.
You can't have a man with DCs without the DCs. If they don't want you then don't have the man. (it is nothing to do with his DCs mother-who ought to be glad that her DCs are loved-or at least liked).

The other thing is that I would be a permanent fixture!Even if I ceased to be daddy's wife I would expect my relationship with the DCs to continue.

YANBU- I have a friend who is getting married next year to a man who has a 12 yo (she is 22) she refers to herself as his step-mum and he is her step-son.
I dont really see her anymore (for other reasons) but I feel like she is just jumping in and taking over the role, discussing his schooling and trying to fix problems when its not really her place. The boy sees both his parents regularly and they both have input into his life.

She has no children of her own, its as if she is trying to make herself look...I dont know cool or something that she has a 12yo step-son. Really annoys me.

excuse spelling-written in a rush

Lots of people on here who want father's partners to mop up grazed knees, arrange their lives to suit - but want them to have absolutely no acceptance that they do this stuff. Take your marital bitterness out on each other - but dragging your kids into the middle of it (which I think you're doing if you complain about titles to them) is fucking wrong - and I'm speaking as a kid who was used as a weapon in two incredibly hellish divorces.

As for the crap that you only are allowed to call someone step father below the age of 20. My mum married twice - first one I called dad, and very rarely registered that he wasn't my real dad - until the divorce cos he couldn't keep it in his pants when him and his entire family shoved me away as the unwanted kid "foisted" upon him... that's a pleasant experience for a 10 year old but hey ho you move on from it.

She remarried again when I was about 21 - and for a while I carefully (not wanting to accord anyone else the title of father after prat-face mark 2) referred to him as my mum's husband... before deciding bollocks to that - it took too bloody long to say and he's been more of a father to me than my own waste of space and prat-face mark 2 was - and yes, I buy him father's day cards (I tend to avoid ones that actually say Dad on them - mainly because he'd probably collapse in shock at one of them) and the like, and he was one of the tag-team that stitched me up for the father of the bride speech at my wedding (along with a very dear family friend who'd also done most of the dad things for me growing up - who was actually my mum's ex-fiance who introduced her to the guy she eventually married who was his best friend - figure THAT one out for family titles!) and I made the decision to put him in the father space on my marriage certificate - which I think meant a heck of a lot to him really... the one thing I refused to do was be given away by anyone - but that was more a matter of me being a stubborn nowt than anything else.

Point I guess I'm making is anyone can attach (and get pissed off at) arbitrary titles that just describe a marital/familial relationship - but kids ain't daft and sooner or later they'll make the judgement call for themselves. I view it that I have(well had- family friend died in January following a spectacular display of NHS incompetence) two fathers - my mum's husband, and the family friend who did all my driving to teenage pop concerts, uni visits etc - and from about the age of 12 I was smart enough to know the situation myself and take control over who I called what amidst the endless adult bickering and mutual slagging each other off.

Oh and here we go again hammering women who don't have kids. Fucking grow up and quit labelling and judging women by their reproductive status - or accept when people claim all those negative things about not wanting to employ women who have kids who aren't dedicated to their work, or who'll just bugger off on maternity leave etc etc... you know those stereotypes you firmly fight as wrong, judgemental and discriminatory... well fucking well quit doing it to the other side of women yourselves.

SAF - reading your posts shows an amazing lack of understanding about what a good step relationship can be like.

My good friend has three DSDs. He was with their mum for 15 years. They still see him and he still loves and supports them financially, even though he's not their dad and even though he's no longer with their mum. Do you think he can or should stop loving those children, who have been part of his life for so long just because he's no longer with their Mum? Their mum might like it, but those girls won't hear of it.

I don't at all dispute that when my DSD comes to visit, she's there to see her dad, but to suggest that they should exist in a separate bubble when she's there doesn't reflect reality. Our home is just that our home with space in it for her and her friends and her half sibs and her dad and me.

Its absolutely nothing to do with wanting to be her mum, or mothering her or thinking that I have the same level of parental responsibility has her parents. Its about being a decent human being who wants my husbands child step daughter to feel welcome, loved and secure.