to think that the middle-classes suck the very soul out of parenting (and life in generally actually)?

[bejeezus]

Ive been on/reading a few threads- about Unconditional Parenting, Attachment Parenting, Steiner blah blah blah. 99.9% of each of these 'philosophies' is common sense, the other 0.1% is deranged and warped interpretation of what started out as a description of common sense.

I am sick of people researching and 'reading round' subjects, analyzing and LABELLING EVERY activity and aspect of growing kids. People (and animals!) have been doing it since time began.

Is it because middle-classers have all been raised by nannies/ have no parental role-models/ have poles up their asses/ lack imagination/ HAVE no intuition/ have no faith in their abilities/ need to feel superior - WHAT is it??

What is wrong with intuition, spontaneity and getting it wrong? in fact I bet my socks there is some research some-where, that says that those are essential aspects of child-rearing and if you dont embrace them whole-heartedly, your childrens teeth will fall out/ they will loose the ability to speak and be in prison by the age of 25 years and 7 months.

Why am I bothered?;

I said on a Steiner thread in parenting that 'I hate wooden toys and all they stand for'

Then I got to thinking; actually I hate what they now stand for but I DONT hate wooden toys. I love wooden toys; the smell, the feel, the memories. But we used to scavenge the tips for timber/rob neighbours fence posts then get dad/grandad/uncle to help us build go karts/benches/huts with an excess of nail string and glue. Where is the soul and creativity in parents spending a weeks/ a months wage (or even a penny) on some imported sustainably sourced wooden toy fashioned by a stranger or mass produced in a factory? It has no more educational/ developmental value than a brightly coloured plastic toy. It is not more enjoyable for the child. It is more enjoyable for the parents BECAUSE IT LOOKS NICE IN THEIR HOUSE!!

Middle class parents are like the anti-Rastamouse;

'always there to make a good thing bad'

Class War- Bring it!

Yes I think the OP's whole issue is with a type of parent that hardly exist out of the confines of Islington or the Guardian/Sunday Times family sections.

One important peice of advice to all MC parents with aspirations - make the most of it when the are young. It doesn't last'

I remember visiting a quite nice fish restaurant in Cornwall with DD and DS1 - they were about 1 and 3 respectively. The sat down and polished off a huge bowl of moule mariniere - under the delighted and approving gaze of the cook and waiting staff. FF a few years and they didn't touch fish if it wasn't enrobed in les petit pillules de pain and deep-fried and accompanied by chips. Similarly DS2 used to bring me ectasies of MC maternal pride in the supermarket by demanding 'trout for lunch' mummy and wanting to eat his raw chanterelle carrots at the check out That didn't last either.

I kind of get that conspicuous middle class 'parenting' is irritating and signifies a certain status which they want to maintai . But the flip side is the "move" school of parenting which involves shuffling through the rails in Primark and bellowing "moooove" in bewildered toddler's ear as you move on to the next example of polyester tat.

I'll hasten to add I am middle-class skint and also shop in Primark which makes a change from charity shops.

Sorry .. i may be middle class and maybe a bit of a tw*t but i really like wooden toys.....a) you can't break them and b) they don't make a lot of noise!
Does everything haveto stand for something?

That's why it eases off once the DC can talk and has outside influence Ormirian. I remember DS asking for milk or water at parties -he didn't like fizzy at the time-I can think of lots of examples like that. He wasn't doing it by 6yrs.

@LeQueen have you written the chapter yet where you explain that drums are not the raight musical instrument for the (ahem) socially mobile - I may need it :)

DS has just informed me he wants to play the drums.

All my aspirations down the drain, nooooooooooo...

:O

:o , rather

And a lot better for your DC to go to friends houses and be exposed to chicken nuggets etc than have mother vetting and controlling everything-or trying to. What you do most of the time is what matters.

"One important peice of advice to all MC parents with aspirations - make the most of it when the are young. It doesn't last"

If anything I think my DC have got worse more aspirational with age. I started off with hundereds of good intentions with my pfb... no TV, only organic, no plastic tat etc. However I rather lost the way by the time I had 3 DC under 4 (obviously I didn't have time to read the parenting books anymore!) But now they are all school age I actually find that they have turned out exactly how I hoped they would. They would usually rather read a book than watch TV, they choose the local organic cafe over McDonalds, get excited when the veg box arrives as it might contain new things to try, would rather wear clothes without logos than shop in Sports Direct (apart from the odd replica football shirt, which they only wear to actually play football in). If I ask them what they want to do on a Saturday morning it usually involves either the library, the museum or a walk around the local nature reserve.

Of course, I still have teen rebellion to come...

I think I secretly sympathise with small children wanting to eat takeaway, watch telly and play with plastic crap instead of eating organic mussels and playing with tasteful wooden toys because that's actually what I'm like, deep down. When I was at university, after a day of lectures/library/seminars/tutes I felt so full up of academia that I just had to go and watch an entire box-set of Sex and the City and paint my toenails. Felt gooood.

Jemima, I am especially interested in whether your children go to the local comp.

Jemima, what's wrong with kids wearing football tops even if they aren't playing football in them? I'm not keen on logos a lot of the time either but what's wrong with shopping in Sports Direct - it's cheap.

@gegon @jemima I'm afraid you've already shown your kids are oiks, you should know that only rugby replica shirts are acceptable.

Its all over, I'd just buy in a job lot of froot shoots and plastic toys and sink onto your Dhs sofa with the chardonnay :o

*begon

capri suns in this house please - cos they're much classier, dontcha know!

What's supposed to be wrong with TV/ X-Box/ Facebook/ plastic toys? I don't get it.

We have capri suns, tv, FB, Wii, DSi, chocoate. Dd gets marks in the high 90s at school. Everything in moderation.

With mine, she is supposedly at an educational disadvantage - she goes to french speaking school and we speak english at home. The best way, we have discovered, after research into the subject, is to let her watch the same shit in tv as the rest of her classmates.