Another woman killed by her ex violent shit of a partner.

[sundayrose10]

It's just so tragic and I feel so angry at another senseless death on a woman by a scum. It's well known leaving an abusive partner is the most dangerous time...why don't the police do more?

It is too sad for words. How can the surviving child even begin to get through something like that?

From the daily fail. I can't link so copied and pasted.

100 threats to kill: Mother handed police texts days before ex-partner gunned down her and their little girl

Shotgun shoved in child's mouth just moments before murders
Watchdog probes claims police knew of volatile situation between parents
A terrified mother handed police 100 menacing text messages from her crazed ex-partner days before he shot her and their two-year-old dead.
Chrissie Chambers, 38, made a formal statement to officers last week about David Oakes?s repeated threats to kill her during a bitter row over access to their daughter.
Nothing was done and yesterday morning Oakes killed Miss Chambers and young Shania in their home.

The killer also shoved his shotgun into the mouth of Shania?s half sister, Chelsea, who saved her life by fleeing through a window and on to the kitchen roof.
Her mother had urged the ten-year-old to ?run, run, save yourself while you can?.
Last night an inquiry was launched by the Independent Police Complaints Commission after it emerged that officers had been called to the house a number of times over the past two years,
It was also claimed that Oakes was subjected to a non-molestation order that prevented him from coming within 100 yards of her.
Stuart Flitt, 26, who is a half brother to Chelsea, said police had been given warning after warning.
?The last time she made a statement was on Thursday ? she was making statements to the police all week,? he said.
?She gave police over 100 text messages but they never took her seriously.
?These texts threatened to kill her ? I had been staying round there for her own safety.?
A close friend of the family said: ?The police said to her ?We cannot do anything until something happens to you?. She was scared ? she sobbed her heart out to me on Friday. This should not have happened.
?The police were in the wrong and they knew about this weeks ago.?

Unemployed Oakes, 50, was under police guard in hospital last night with non life-threatening injuries after turning the gun on himself at the end of a two-hour stand-off at the semi-detached house in Braintree, Essex.
Chelsea?s father, Ian Flitt, said he was woken in the early hours of yesterday morning by Chelsea who was banging on his door.
The 50-year-old said: ?She started screaming ?He is there at the house with a gun? and ?He has put it into Chrissie?s mouth?.?
Oakes killed his former partner before turning the gun on Shania. Chelsea climbed through the window on to the kitchen roof, before dropping ten feet to the ground below and running half a mile barefoot in her nightgown to her father?s house. ?If he was prepared to shoot his own daughter, he would have shot her,? he said.
Oakes, who has been described as an ?abusive, jealous woman hater?, embarked on his killing spree hours before a court appearance over the custody of Shania.
He and Miss Chambers had been together for six years before they split seven weeks ago.
She had had a ten-year relationship with Mr Flitt and they had three children, Levi 16, Guy, 11, and Chelsea, who lived with her and Shania.

Assistant Chief Constable Gary Beautridge of Essex Police said: ?We have had two years of contact between him [Oakes] and the family and as part of the investigation there will be a full and fundamental review of the circumstances of this contact.?
Amid dramatic scenes outside her house yesterday, a distraught man shouted at officers: ?You knew this was going to happen, you could have stopped it.?

Donna Garrod, 20, said Oakes, who is understood to have been a drug dealer, had been violent toward Miss Chambers for years.
?One time he kidnapped Shania and police had to escort Christine to his caravan to get her back,? she said. ?I have seen her with bruises, a black eye and a broken nose.
?The police knew what was going on. I was there most times when the police came round. She had been calling them for two weeks.?
Karran Tomlinson, 35, said she had lived next to Miss Chambers for four years and had heard many violent rows during that time ? including threats from Oakes to kill Shania.
She said: ?Dave was a nasty piece of work. He had been beating her up for years. I think she was just too scared to leave him.
?She finally found the courage to leave him seven weeks ago and now this has happened.?
Police managed to enter the house at around 5.45am, and arrested Oakes who was taken to Broomfield Hospital, in Chelmsford. Last night a life-long friend of Oakes said he had terrorised women for more than 20 years because of his uncontrollable jealously. The woman, who asked not to be named, said: ?As soon as I heard I knew it had to be David.
?He has a vicious temper and is not a man to be crossed.?

BimboNo5 - really? Is that helpful? Potentially the known violence is him assaulting his ex.

It really does read as though bimbo holds the murdered woman responsible for the resulting costs to the public purse, if only women were less feckless these things wouldn't happen would they?

BimboNo5: surely it is unhelpful to put question marks over the women's behaviour or choices? In fact, it's more than unhelpful; it implies they have some responsibility for what then happens to them.

He was assaulting her for years, apparently.

God, I hope he gets what's coming to him in prison.

And during a recession too. It's just fucking selfish.

"why would anyone think a person like that is worth being with?"

God yes, how stupid of her. If only she'd behaved more reasonably.

Dirtymartini - no woman is ever responsible for being assaulted, ever.

But I think bimbo was wondering ( as I have) why women become involved with men like this in the first instance.
Because we do have choices about who we spend time with or sleep with or have children with.

Sorry, to add.
If we say women have no choices or are powerless then we are in serious danger saying women are all at the mercy of men.

Why this autimatic assumption that the police did nothing? None of the details, as far as I am aware have been made public yet. Why not wait till then rather than think the worst of the police.

There is a zero tolerance towards DV nowadays and most of the time the police will do as much as they can

Abusive men are perfectly capable of being sweetness and light until they have you trapped, have isolated you and stripped away your confidence.
Say what you like, a woman has lost her life, a BABY has lost her life, a child has lost her mother and her sister.
And yet, the woman should have made a better choice.

Un-fucking-believable.

Yes, we mustn't assume that just because she showed the police the threats to kill her that they didn't arrest him, charge him and that he wasn't remanded in custody just because he appeared to be left at liberty to kill her and their two year old.

Do you people slating the police not realise that it is the HOME OFFICE who determines laws and punishments, not the police?

I also think that if there is DV in an asian family there is more action from the police as the Home Office requires this to prevent "honour killings". Dare I say one rule for one and one rule for another.

I am sure that the majority of the police would like to have shot this man straight in the head and forego any procedures, I would have been happy with that.

As Nickynacky said, there is probably alot that has not been publicised yet so hold off on the police bashing.

This is just too appalling for words :(

No doubt there will be "an investigation", a ton of money spent only to come up with the answer "xyz admit failings and LESSONS WILL BE LEARNT"

Fucking usless.

like laugh and joke with the man who is being accused and tell the woman that he's a good bloke and they doubt he could do something like that?

Yes fabulous.

onlywantsone I'll PM you the link I don;t want a support thread linked on here IYSWIM. It sounds like you have experience with this sort of thing so maybe you can help

OK well, I think it's still a highly suspect way of looking at the situation to question the victim's thinking rather than the offender's behaviour. It can never be a productive approach, and it's morally dodgy as fuck.

But since you are so troubled and mystified up in your ivory tower, let me propose a few possibilities:

• Abusive and deadly men can and often do make a big charm/pressure/persuasion campaign at the start of a relationship that can be hard to resist
• A woman may not have gotten around to doing a full background check on every one of her partners
• And she may not, in fact, be psychic
• She may come from an abusive background, have low self-esteem or for other reasons believe that she can't expect any better (in fact, violent men often seem to target vulnerable women)

A million other reasons. Point is it doesn't matter, because asking the question "why do women get involved with these men" cannot ever lead to a reduction in the hurting and killing that the men do. For that, you need to stop focusing on the women and their "choices" and, dare I suggest it, consider the behaviour of the damn men.

geekcool.

I know this. But whilst they are trapping you and isolating you , you stay, yes?

We DO have choices and to suggest women are somehow under the spell of evil men and incapable of leaving is odd at best and offensive at worst.
We've all met men like that.

Sadly, some women lack self esteem and lack confidence and support and vile men focus on these women.
So what we can do, each of us with daughters, is do everything we can to help our daughters know that being with scum like that is not a choice they have to make.

You're right, not the fault of the police that there were no laws pertaining to firearms, harassment, threatening behaviour and so on for them to enforce.

Hurry up parliament, make some laws.

(my last post was to the racist above)

Where has it been published re threats/beatings etc? Like I said I haven't read that. The future enquiry will establish if there is fault on the police's part. And like it has already been said, it isn't the police that prosecute, convict and sentance

I'm not bashing the police per se. I am worried and angry that a vulnerable woman and her children have been left in that situation.

I am livid that the establishments which should be protecting her have failed.

I am hurt and despairing that this happens to so many women. That they keep being killed and hurt and that nothing seems to be happening at a bureaucratic level to keep them safe.

Doesn't it make you feel angry in any way cookcleanerchaufferetc?

SUNDAYROSE....What a magnificent post you delivered. It takes my breath away. Bless.

Dirtymartini - I agree with the majority of your post .

There are thousands of scummy, vile and abusive men and we need greater detection rates and convictions.
In the meantime, we need to support women to stay the fuck away from them. You can't be an abuser without a victim.

I think many of us know women in less than ideal relationships. I have a friend in a very controlling situation but she will not ever leave or expect him to change for reasons best known to herself.

greenstocking when I got with my ex I was not lacking in confidence (usual 19 year old body worries). He seemed fabulous. Abusive men don't tend to just turn on you the second date, it is a slow gradual process and for many women (myself included) you become the apologist when the rows start. It's such a process you don't notice it. I didn't, does that make me stupid?

"we are in serious danger of saying women are all at the mercy of men"

Women, children, and even other men (e.g. Raoul Moat's male victim, his ex's partner), ARE all at the mercy of a violent, controlling abusive killer. If a man is the type of person who has it within himself to kill a woman and child, then he is fucking dangerous, and anyone who happens to cross him IS at his mercy.

Wittering about the choices the victim made gets you nowhere. I think you have a huge blind spot about the way your thinking, no matter how much you dress it up with talk of choices and women not being at the mercy of men, is putting blame on victims in a massively inappropriate way.