to believe that most feminists are in actual fact giving women a bad name?

[Casey76]

I, along with most women I imagine are grateful that women fought to give us a vote.....

However I believe that things have gone to far..I hate women who moan and bitch about how they can't have everything!!!!!!!!

No your damn right you can not have everything ...if you go to work full time when your children are young, YOU WILL MISS OUT!!!!!

Why should women have it all???

I believe that most feminists think that they are more worthy of having everything then men and guess what you are wrong...men dont have it all...most men still work full time and still miss out on their children..

Men used to provide for their families...Men used to have a little pride...I don't think that that those women all those years ago wanted things to go this far...where some women see men as useless and think they can do everthing with out them..including having children...fair enough if you split up and you end up a single mum thats one thing but choosing to have a baby alone is just plain selfish....women should not be allowed to use a sperm doner if they are single..

So you feminists who think you are better then men and that you can have everything..YOU ARE WRONG...I FEEL SORRY FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh, and I thnk it's a good idea! I love my job and my dh loves being at home with the kids ( he works from home and flexi-time but he's around for school run and after school). What's wrong with that? I do miss out a bit on family time but my kids sure don't - they have a fantastic dad and two fulfilled parents. That's feminism for you!!

Casey - some of the problems you're highlighting are not necessarily the fault of feminists - they're more to do with Liberal politics and policies, ( although most feminists are liberals )

I didn't say it had to be the mum. I was just saying that is how it was..It should be one of the parents, not before school clubs, after school clubs, holiday clubs...I even know of a nursery near me which has over night facilities so those working 'parents' don't even have to collect their children after work!

ChristinedePizan

|If women choice to do a low paying job thats the choice if you go for the same job and a man is doing it to you will get the same pay i work with many men on my team all on same pay so i think your kicking yourself about somthing that is not real ..

Emotional abuse is being shouted at being teased and called names...
Men should not feel they cannot stay at home because it is a MANS job to go out and provide the FOOD! why should they
I feel sorry for anyone who does not know they have a choice and that there is no such thing as a weaker sex

When was this mystical time, when there were no gangs and teenagers presented fewer problems (sorry less)?

More to the point where did all the thick bigoted people come from? Have they always been here?

"I didn't say it had to be the mum. I was just saying that is how it was..It should be one of the parents"

well, then, Casey, you are a closet feminist! It's not about 'women' having it all, it's about creating a work culture that allows flexibility and recognises the caring duties of both men and women. That's what you should be trying to change, not tying women to the kitchen sink!!

o and i dont know why you showed me a graph that said women earned 1.2 % more than men ?????????????????? why would you show me that

Primary carers usually get residency. It is usually women who are the primary carers, for reasons that are complex and that feminists are actively campaigning to resolve.

Most women throughout history have worked.

Feminists are all for equal parenting, providing there are not violence and/or abuse issues.

Gender pay differentials are real.

I can't speak for all feminists, but all the ones I know would speak out about men being discriminated against in relation to childcare issues.

i think you need to read things properly before passing them off as some kind of evidence lol :)

That's not what that graph shows

Here's a quote (re women choosing to do low paid menial jobs): The narrowest pay differences for full-time and all employees are in Professional occupations where the gap ranges from 4.2 per cent to 1.6 per cent.

That may be your experience, it isn't mine (speaking as a higher rate taxpayer so no, I don't do a 'menial low paid job'). But then, my children are going to grow up as thugs apparently. I thought you were a sock puppet but you are contradicting the OP (but are just as wrong-headed). I'm sorry you know people who are ignorant enough to give SAHDs a hard time. Perhaps you need some new friends.

Wow AyeRobot you are using alot of spaces so you must be right.

What are these complex reasons why women are the primary carers which feminists are actively campaigning to resolve?

girl power was the spice girls not the suffragettes
easy to get those mixed up I always think

No i do not know the people on the street who laugh at stay at home dads never said i did i said i know the dads

I can see you as a know it all women who knows all and is better than man you belive what you want

I meant that it may be your experience that women and men get paid the same for doing the same work. It isn't mine. I have had a male boss say to me 'well he has a family to support' as a reason for paying a colleague more for the same job.

"So when in the majority of households the men worked and the women looked after the children there were less problems with teenagers and gangs etc because the children were being looked after by their mothers....what was the problem with that?"

When was this?

Although mean and median hourly rates provide useful comparisons between the earnings of men and women, they do not necessarily indicate differences in rates of pay for comparable jobs. Pay averages are affected by the different work patterns of men and women, such as the proportions in different occupations, their length of time in jobs, and whether they work full-time or part-time.

full-time women earned 2.1 per cent more than full-time men and part-time women earned 1.7 per cent more than part-time men.

all from your edvidence :)

Casey76 Sun 05-Jun-11 20:25:40
"So when in the majority of households the men worked and the women looked after the children there were less problems with teenagers and gangs etc because the children were being looked after by their mothers....what was the problem with that? "

not so sure there really was:

*reading my granddads autobiography...

*working on various projects in medieval history...

*researching the Early Modern period for a writing project I'm thinking of...

*and reading descriptions of the London Mob pre-WW2...

I am getting the impression that there was at least as much teenage drunkenness, fighting, vandalism, unwanted pregnancies in those days.

Casey - AyeRobot is a highly intelligent feminist who is taking the time to contribute to your thread. Lay off!

ChristinedePizan

haha maybe he thought he did a better job than you i didnt want to offend you lol

Of course Mitchiest is right: there never was a time when the majority of women could concentrate on childrearing. Except perhaps for a short window after WW2. It's not just that the mythical period of well behaved teens never existed.

I dont agree..the level of violence in this country is getting worse all the time...although to be fair I don't blame feminists for that..I blame illegal immigrants and the goverment for not having stricter laws.

Casey - the main reasons women are primary carer

1. they are often paid less so in many families it is the women who stays home with the children

2. they have been raised in a sexist society which sees caring for children as women's work

3. they have husbands who are unwilling to down-size their careers in any way such as working part time or shorter hours, so after having children, many women take step down the career ladder to work flexibly and be there to pick their children up from school.

Men can't refuse to be an equal partner in caring for his children - refusing to take as many days off for sick children, working flexibly etc etc, and then complain when the courts see his wife, who has done all these things, as the better parent.

Feminists are actively campaigning against these things - we want men to take more responsibility their own children, we want industry to willingly allow everyone to work flexibly so that men don't feel their jobs are at risk if they down-scale their hours when their children are little. And we want childcare to be seem as parent's work, not women's work. Should make life better for everyone.

How weird that you came to a totally different conclusion from those statistics than the ONS did.

In April 2010 hourly rates for men were £13.01 for full-timers, £7.69 for part-timers and £12.35 for all employees. For women, hourly rates were £11.68 for full-timers, £8.00 for part-timers and £9.90 for all employees.

Yes, women earn a whacking 31p an hour more than men in part time work. But otherwise they earn less. Where are you getting your figures from?

I'm not a 'know it all' woman but it is a fact that women get paid less. It might be illegal, but happens. And I'm really sorry that some of your male friends get grief from random people on the street but I repeat, that isn't emotional abuse. It's verbal abuse. You can't be emotionally abused by random strangers on the street really. That's totally undermining what really emotional abuse is. In my opinion, just so I don't get called a know it all.

And that does not mean that men are worse off because of feminism. Feminism has allowed them to stay at home with their children, because it's allowed some people to realise that not every family needs to conform to the dad working/mum staying at home model that we have all had to subscribe to for far too long.

rofl @ 'I blame illegal immigrants '

No, I'm right because, er, I'm right. Those are facts, not opinion.

A few examples - Lack of childcare at the right price and the right times, lack of flexibility for fathers to undertake parenting duties as well, changing attitudes so that parenting and running a household is viewed as shared.

I'm not really listing them for you, Casey, because I know you're not interested in hearing anything that contradicts your world view. Oh, and gangs have been around for ages. Even girl ones.