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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think SHE should pay for smashing up MY car

407 replies

thequeensspeech · 25/02/2011 10:46

Mother in law is staying with us for 2 weeks, normally lives in Spain. Yesterday she asked if she could borrow mine and DH's car. She only has third party insurance. Was not happy about her driving the car. She reassured me that she has 40 years driving experience, no accidents ever, was only going to nip to the shops. Reluctantly I handed over the keys. Of course, sods law she has a crash. Garage now estimating £2000 to repair.

She has checked with her insurance company and obviously they are not going to pay out. She has made it quite clear that she will not be paying for my car to be fixed and ultimately DH and I have to somehow, scrape the money together. Not great when I'm being made redundant in June.

Yes I know it was my fault for giving her the keys to the car but surely to god she should at least volunteer to pay half the costs.

Disclaimer: she and her DH are well off, have house in Spain and 3 houses in the UK 2 of which they rent out and the other they live in for 3 months of the year.

OP posts:
LessNarkyPuffin · 25/02/2011 12:21

Sad You really need to talk to her.

nancydrewfoundaclue · 25/02/2011 12:23

Xposts again there otherside sorry!

Yes the whole thing is a minefield. I have to say I drove illegally for a long time because I was ignorant to the fact that my driving license was not valid Blush. It seems to be a little known fact.

I also found that insurance companies don't make their requirements clear. I got my UK driving license when I was 17 so my understanding (and how I answered the question previously) was that I have held my license for 16 years. The fact that it has been surrendered because I live overesas means they take the date from when you reapplied so I reapplied for a license this year the correct answer to the question how long have you held a UK license should be "less than 1 year" Extremely ambiguous, I think.

You can only imagine what living overseas has done to my premiums!

LisasCat · 25/02/2011 12:23

OP you have to find out if there was someone else involved. All you're getting here is speculation. You need to know:

  • was someone else involved
  • was that other person to blame or was MIL
  • is there damage to the other person's car
If someone else saw her face, you scare the crap out of her by saying that a witness could identify her in a court. The next thing you figure out is the state of her insurance coverage. If it turns out she lied to you, you again scare the crap out of her by explaining the consequences of her being caught driving without insurance. Whatever the scenario, you make it clear to her that making false insurance claims is not an option. Get off the internet, go and phone her / DH / FIL, find out the information you need and then come back here and tell us so we can bitch about her some more! (You know we're all on your side in this, but you have some very important questions to be asking right now and time is of the essence if you want to resolve this before she leaves, and if your DH doesn't want to be getting the train every day next week.)
TheHeathenOfSuburbia · 25/02/2011 12:24

On the slightly more positive side...

Someone ran into the back of me last year, and we didn't have to pay a thing, it all (including courtesy car) went on the other driver's insurance. The damage was as you've described; needed new bumper, lights and boot.

OTOH, the first thing we did was ring up our own insurance company, describe the accident, and they basically sorted it out from there. If MIL has already rung her insurance company and they said 'Nothing to do with us'....

Othersideofthechannel · 25/02/2011 12:27

Well if different advisors at the DVLA are giving different advice, I don't know how the public are supposed to get it right!

nancydrewfoundaclue · 25/02/2011 12:29

otherside I wonder how the UK license can be valid when you come back as a visitor though since you are supposed to physically surrender it which means it technically no longer exists......Confused

My advice is that if you want to be safe you explain to the insurance company exactly what the position is as regards where you live etc and they can make the decision as to whether you are insured or not.

As I said previously PITA

stubbornhubby · 25/02/2011 12:30

TheHeathenOfSuburbia her insurance company would have said "Nada que ver con nosotros, senora"

Grin
foreverondiet · 25/02/2011 12:35

OMG.... she should pay the full amount.

She was BU to ask for the keys when you were not comfortable. And now is BVU to not pay.

Your DH has to speak to her about it. Obviously agree to shop around for quotes but to tell her that she has to pay. Otherwise tell her that you'll tell the insurance company that she took the car without permission and she'll risk prosecution.

crazygracieuk · 25/02/2011 12:35
  1. The DVLA do not permit even British citizens to hold UK driving licenses if their main residence is outside the UK. It must be surrendered and it is a criminal offence not to do so.

You can use your UK license and be resident in another EU country but you have to get a license for the local country after a certain number of years. Keeping a UK license while living in the EU happens is very popular as another EU country can't apply points to your UK license.

  1. Getting inusred in the UK, even if you do have a UK license but have resided outside the UK in the last 4 years is extremely difficult.

Probably depends on the country you came from. I have have heard of UK citizens not being able to get insurance when they return from another country. When we moved from UK to Germany then back again, Direct Line were happy to insure us and transfer our no claims discount.

Othersideofthechannel · 25/02/2011 12:35

Oh I know for sure that it is absolutely no problem with my insurance.
I am more concerned about the UK police!

I had a look at the site you suggested and still have not seen where it says you have to physically surrender it. And neither of the two DVLA advisor said this was necessary.

crazygracieuk · 25/02/2011 12:36

Back to the OP's dilemma. She should pay 100%!!

I hope that she is covered for your car and not just her own and that she sees sense and coughs up. £2k of damage!!!!

diddl · 25/02/2011 12:39

"I never knew about the surrendering your licence if you move abroad."

My husband & I still have ours although we have been in Germany 10yrs.

However, they have our old UK address on so we assume that they are not valid.

pink4ever · 25/02/2011 12:40

otherside-sorry but I dont understand why you on here dicking about asking us lot for answers?. You need to phone mil and demand she comes back to your house with a full explanantion. Then if the accident was indeed her fault(she sounds guilty as hell) you tell her she must pay!!. You lay it on the line for your dh that if he doesnt back you up then he will be going to join her in spain!!.

crazygracieuk · 25/02/2011 12:41

Diddl- You can't change the address on your UK license so that it has a foreign address.

Othersideofthechannel · 25/02/2011 12:42

crazygracie, please could you show me in writing where it states you have to surrender it?

In France, you have to register your UK license with your local 'prefecture' and that's fine as long as you don't commit any offences. If you commit a point offence, you have to exchange at that point so they can manage the points. I have been stopped dor documentation checks several times by French gendarmes on a UK license, French car, French insurance, French address and never had any problems.

Othersideofthechannel · 25/02/2011 12:44

pink4ever I think you mean to address those remarks to thequeensspeech.

I will gladly accept criticism for being extremely rude and hijacking the thread but leave my lovely MIL out of it!

BaresarkBunny · 25/02/2011 12:46

Is there a different rule for those serving abroad in the army say Germany? I don't know anyone who has surrended their driving licence.

Also when you move from England to Northern Ireland you have to apply for a new one which I was quite shocked by. I thought it would be the same.

pink4ever · 25/02/2011 12:51

Apologies otherside!!

diddl · 25/02/2011 13:00

"Diddl- You can't change the address on your UK license so that it has a foreign address."

Yes I know, that´s why we have assumed that they are no longer valid/legal as theve an address on that we don´t live at-or own!

Needabitofsunshine · 25/02/2011 13:01

What a nightmare! I can't believe she's not desperately sorry and offering to pay. Incredible.

Lots of UK driving licences are also EU ones and are valid for use within EU countries.

nancydrewfoundaclue · 25/02/2011 13:10

otherside I have been looking for the part that says you have to surrender it and can't find it in writing.

All I can tell you is that this is what I was told by the DVLA and more recently by a Police Officer (who was endorsing 3 points for speeding Blush) when I mentioned I was going overseas she said don't forget to surrender your license as it is an offence not to.

What I can find is this page which deals with the fact that you have to notify the DVLA of a change of address and that you cannot register an overseas address on your license here

You can be fined £1000 by the DVLA for not having a valid address on your license.

But is all about as clear as mud.

MmeLindt · 25/02/2011 13:11

In Switzerland we are required by law to surrender our homeland driving licence if we stay more that 12 months. If you don't, you are obliged to take the Swiss driving test.

I hope you get it sorted, TQS. Sounds awful.

weegiemum · 25/02/2011 13:15

Driving without insurance: 6 penalty points and a £300 fine Blush

TragicallyHip · 25/02/2011 13:18

This is quite unbelievable!

She should pay for the whole fucking lot!

hymie · 25/02/2011 13:22

Yes, it is all a bit unbelievable