to send 4 year old ds to bed at 5pm because he won't eat anything I've made tonight or any other night?

[lotuseener]

My 4 year old has major problems with food. He has gotten progressively worse since his refusal to eat certain foods started at around 18 months. He currently will only eat plain boiled white rice, pasta with butter or cream cheese only mixed in, smooth yogurt,
weetabix, cheerios, and very occasionally toast or crackers. He will absolutely not eat any fruit or vegetables of any kind, not even potatoes. He will not eat meat, chicken or fish of any kind, not even fish fingers. He won't eat hard cheese, peanut butter,eggs, soup or fruit smoothies.

He has an absolute obsession with sugar, so much that we cannot keep any treats in the cupboards. If he knows there is a pack of biscuits in the fridge or ice lollies in the freezer he will obsess over them from the time he wakes up until the time he goes to bed. Going out anywhere that serves or sells food is extremely difficult as he obsesses about what sugary food he can get. For example, we were just at a birthday party where he refused to participate in any of the party games because he knew there was birthday cake there and couldn't focus on anything other than the birthday cake. He asked me about the cake every 5 minutes for the whole 2 hours and did nothing else at the party except cling to me and ask about the cake.

DH and I have tried all the advice we have read about- sticker charts, having him cook with me, having him shop with me, not making a big deal about it, letting him serve himself, etc, etc. A few days ago ds and I made banana bread together, but he made it very clear as we were baking that he would not eat any of it because he doesn't like bananas. He loves to cook and bake with me but will not eat what we make together.

We have made a rule that he has to eat one bite of whatever we are having for dinner before he can get up from the table and do not make special meals for him at dinner any more. This means he puts one bite in his mouth and chews and chews but physically cannot bring himself to swallow. He will either gag his food out or cry to spit it in the bin.

Of course I feel like this is all my fault and beat myself up about it constantly. I desperately want to get to the root of this and help him as I feel this has got to be something greater than just fussy eating. This causes a lot of stress for myself and dh and we fear that he isn't getting the basic nutrition he needs to thrive.

His nursery has been most unhelpful, depsite my pleas for help and advice. He will sit at snack time and pick out every sultana from his scone before he eats the scone. I have picked him up on days where they think that they have finally gotten him to have a bite of apple only to find that the apple is still in his mouth an hour and a half after snack time. As he is a Febuary birthday I have decided to defer his entry to Primary 1 largely based on his problems with eating food.

I have an appointment with the GP on Monday to demand a referral to someone, but I don't know what type of professional can help us. A dietician? I have addressed this issue with the GP before only to be told that he looks healthy and is obviously thriving.

I may be posting in the wrong place but I need some help and some advice please. I don't want to be causing more problems in the long run for my son by doing things like (calmly) sending him to bed early if he won't eat his dinner.

If you are concerned with his iron levels, there are plenty of things you can do, but slowly and surely. Sadly there is no iron in milk at all, and milk prevents the absorption of iron in his body (whereas c vitamin, such as a drink of orange juice aids iron absorption)
It is tricky. If you do want some further advice, pm me, or start a different thread about increasing iron levels in fussy eaters.

WOW This has got heated since I last posted.

Really though there are 2 possibilities here. 1 is a sensory related isue, 1 is fussiness/control.

Its great everyone can share their experiences allowing the op to get all relevant information and push for some support.

I am not an ASD expert but do work with pupils who have ASD, 'white foods' and tv/video obsessions' with 'lack of interest in park/soft play' are indications of ASD, but then again there are plenty of children without ASD who also have the same personalilities/traits. (sorry can't think of a better word). Also food sensory issues are prevelant with dyspraxia (oral and general), dyslexia, over sensitive taste buds, previous illness/ chocking/ allergy and many many more.

What the OP needs is to know if there are sensory issues and what causes these sensory issues, if its just preference in taste etc because this will determine how it moves forward.

None of us (unless I've missed it) are experts in this field but there are many parents (exc myself) with personal experience and surely there advice is valid even if it relates to an SN, thats not diagnoses just information.

FWIW I have sensory issues with food textures - I have a great diet now but there are still certain foods even the thought of putting in my mouth make me gag - so there you go.

And you want to know my problem?? Severe IBS, there you go simple - its a vomiting and food association thing with me.

Chatelaine, as you have seen on this thread, we get judged by the food our child eats, so it is not surprising we then get stressed if they appear not to be eating what society suggests they should be eating. Children have always been fussy.
Grazing is actually healthier in some instances than big meals. It is only "society" that commits us to regular mealtimes anyway. I suppose what people used to graze on was considerably healthier, nuts, seeds, berries. It suits us to have three largish meals a day, but most younger children do better with five small "meals".

.. OR if her dc just does not have the energy to explore and digest other foods than milky and ricy ones, due to medical issues, such as anemia.

Sadly, my uk gp refused to check my sons blood count because "oh little children find needles so upsetting, so we rather not here in this country". It took passing out on holiday and being admitted to a hospital overseas for his uk GP to sit up and take notice, and for me to get a referral....

In either case, DO insist on checking his iron levels, and DO insist on a referral.

I am giving him Boots multi-vitamin liquid for children but I don't know how much good that does. I do know that milk doesn't have iron but I added that bit about the milk because I forgot to add in my earlier posts that it is one thing that he has no problems with consuming, at least he is getting his calcium from that.

I wonder if I should ask the gp to order blood tests? The thought of him getting his blood taken hurts my heart but it may give me answers as to if he is deficient in anything.

I have two fussy eaters - DH & DS1

DH was a fussy eater as a child. Ate next to nothing & little variety. He was force fed on occasions out of frustration & worry rather than malice. As a result he has lots of issues with food & a very limited diet.

DS1 would eat well & then live on joghurt, pureed carrots & milk whenever he hit a bout of teething but go back to normal afterwards. Except one time (around 1yr-18months) he didn't. At three he still has quite a limited range of foods that he will eat but I always put a little of what we are having on his plate, knowing full well that it will end up in the bin. Somedays I will ask if he has tried the X, some days he will try it, others he wont. I am really hoping that if we put no presure on him, he will "grow out of it"

DS would also have the odd allergic reaction to foodstuffs (rash, diarroah, vomiting puffy, streaming eyes etc) but we couldn't always put our finger on the triggers. He also had horrible acidy yellow runny poos. We got nowhere at the hospital and he seems to have outgrown these reactions now, although still big question mark over nuts. I wonder if these reactions are what made him so fussy?

x post qs!

To be honest, lotuseener, the iron levels is the easiest thing to check! Easier than most of the suggestions on this tread. And you will have your answer quickly. If the iron levels is the problem, then at least you know, and can act accordingly. One potential checked out, and off the list.

Soccer my DP is a fussy bugger too, no fruit/veg/pasta/fish for him I actually wondered if DS' issues with food were as a result of his dad but to my recollection he has never shown revulsion or anything infront of him.

This may be a stupid question but can anyone advise what the best supplements would be for a fussy child?

Well d'you know what it's the last time I post on a thread to try and help when I'm not saying what everyone wants to hear. All I was saying is that some kids who are fussy eaters have sn and some do not. Not pandering to kids can help to give kids a more balanced diet providing it is just fussiness and not sn.
And whoever said I have been aggressive I did apologise and I was provoked by being told to fuck off for expressing an opinion but obviously if you're in the 'in crowd' you can say what you like.
OP I hope you get the help you need to resolve your sons food issues whatever they may be.

mamadiva I think you can get vitamins free from your health visitor

In my professional life, I really have seen children slowly starve themselves, so if you've tried all the usual things, I would always be of the mindset to get professional advice and also get bloods done whenever possible, overseas if necessary.

I should add, the multivitamins with iron is good for keeping the iron levels stable, but does not build up iron reserves.

If he loves sugar, you can even try him on black pudding with plenty of sugar. Black pudding is insanely rich in iron. And give him puddings of berries, such as black currants, red currants, rasberries and strawberries, sprinkled with sugar. Redcurrants and blackcurrants are rich in both iron and vitamin C, so excellent for adding iron and aiding iron absorption. The dietician even hailed macdonalds as a good way of getting iron in to the diet, even chicken nuggets and chips. Forget the transfats for a moment, you can tackle those issues later. The point is to make meals fun and relaxed, and get the child to eat without realizing it is good for him. Add the snack carrots and the fruit to the meal. Ask for orange juice rather than fizzy drinks and milkshake. etc . At every meal you have to bear in mind Iron content and absorption. Does not mean you should stop him having milk, just not milk at meals where you try to give him iron. etc

I apologise to chatelaine and pudenda for naming you in my post. It was unnecessary and rather unkind. Sorry.

Actually that is an excellent point about the iron. I mentioned ^^ about my own lack of appitite and food issues - I am chronically aneamic and when my period finishes I crave sweet foods - mostly my friend just laugh at me being backwards! but it could be related to iron levels dipping.

Excellent advice quintessential

Chatelaine, you are the one coming across as the playground bully

mumbar, quite possibly you crave sweet foods because you are lacking in energy. sweet foods give you energy, but as anemic, it will give you the wrong kind of energy. You need iron, not sugar. But your body does not know that. even dark chocolate is a good source of energy (like 70% cocoa. I would even sprinkle this on ds1s fruits, along with sugar, to make it more appealing)

What wonderfully helpful advice yet again from here. Shame about the two assholes who decided to have a bitch feast on here.

Do people not think that SOME kids can just be extremely fussy and actually quite manipulative though? And before anyone jumps on me I'm not referring to anyone's kids on this thread. I'm thinking of a friend of mine whose child is a very fussy eater. Her mum is a fab mum and obviously concerned about her childs health. She gives her whatever she will eat just so she eats something. This causes the problem that she is often not sufficiently hungry to eat her meals because mum does not want to deny her food if she asks close to mealtimes because she is worried about her intake. Also she will throw terrible tantrums if her mum tries to offer her healthy food because she knows her mum is worried and will give her what she wants so she's got something inside her. This child has no sn as far as anyone is aware (she is 4 and her mum has no other concerns other than the food issue).

I also meant to say that the mum I'm talking about hates to see her daughter upset (like most mums but it seems to really get her iyswim) so her dd knows that if she has a tantrum she will get what she wants. Her mum is at the end of her tether with her eating.

Yes I agree Pudenda that some kids are like that...but I also know of another child who went on a school trip and passed out on day 3 because he had been unable to eat anything put in front of him

Signs Of Oral Input Dysfunction:
From www.sensory-processing-disorder.com/sensory-processing-disorder-checklist.html

1. Hypersensitivity To Oral Input (Oral Defensiveness):

__ picky eater, often with extreme food preferences; i.e., limited repertoire of foods, picky about brands, resistive to trying new foods or restaurants, and may not eat at other people's houses)

__ may only eat "soft" or pureed foods past 24 months of age

__ may gag with textured foods

__ has difficulty with sucking, chewing, and swallowing; may choke or have a fear of choking

__ resists/refuses/extremely fearful of going to the dentist or having dental work done

__ may only eat hot or cold foods

__ refuses to lick envelopes, stamps, or stickers because of their taste

__ dislikes or complains about toothpaste and mouthwash

__ avoids seasoned, spicy, sweet, sour or salty foods; prefers bland foods

Yes, pundenda, nobody is refuting that some children just need guidance on their food choices.

This thread is about something else though,