To tell my nanny she can't take days of for her wedding.

[Foreverondiet]

Have had same nanny for several years and each year she does some sort of retreat thing in June, 2 weeks. She is allowed 2 weeks holiday when she chooses and the rest when we choose (usually another 4 weeks worth).

Anyway she tells me she is getting married.... I think nothing of it until cleaner says did you know it was in September this year. I ask the nanny and she said, yes she was thinking she's take some unpaid leave. Try to push how much she needs, she wants another couple of weeks. I suggested maybe she wouldn't do the retreat this year but she was almost in tears and said she couldn't believe I wouldn't give her time of for getting married (she's going back home to eastern Europe to get married).

I asked her why she thought it would be ok, as I don't have enough holiday to cover it because we have already committed to go away with DH's parents. And yes I can take unpaid parental leave but this would be very expensive, and leave my boss being a bit annoyed with me.

The reason we have a nanny is that I have 3 DC, aged 4,7 and 9 months and its the only way I can work (full day nursery/childminder for baby plus after school would cost almost the same and this way she looks after older DC if they are ill or during school holidays).

Her wedding is on a Saturday and she works for me Mon/Tues and Thurs so its not as if she HAS to take time off, and if it really was that important to her why does she not cancel the retreat?

Well said spidookly.

I think there is an attitude on this thread that this a poor defenceless girl from Eastern Europe who is subject to some form of slavery.

In fact she is well paid, and in receipt of 6 weeks holidays a year. I think as others have said above, she is not planning on coming back after September so didn't want the OP to know.

OP said her nanny effectively gets six weeks (she works Mon/Tues and Thurs) plus bank holidays. She can choose when to take two weeks out of the six.

The nanny is not asking for additional leave she is asking for part of her holiday entitlement at a specific time.

She gets two weeks fixed, and four weeks not fixed, so she wants additional FIXED time.

It is not unpaid or out of what her normal entitlement is at all.

Can't see the problem when nine months notice has been given. Plenty of time to make alternative arrangements for what is only essentially 3 days care.

And may I present the result of last nights survey?

96% of posters were working when they got married.

88.5% took normal, annual leave for their wedding.

30% took (some) additional leave.

73% say their boss/company influences when they can take leave.

Only 5% of repondants were teachers.

Fabby - she gets 4 weeks - 2 weeks of her choosing and 2 weeks decided by her employer. On top of that she usually gets an extra 2 weeks - presumably when OP is on holiday, so timing also decided by OP.

Nanny wants to use HER 2 chosen weeks to go on a retreat. She now wants extra for the wedding.

Fabby the nanny is asking for additional leave. She wants 2 weeks unpaid extra leave on top of normal annual leave allowance.

Well said spidookly. Loads and loads of very chippy, totally-missing-the-point posts on this thread...

For what it's worth I do think the OP is being somewhat U but I also think the nanny is as well (and WTF is wrong with referring to a nanny on a discussion board as a nanny, when we give our own offspring their own initials (DD, DS, PFB)?

It doesn't sound as if the OP and her nanny have the greatest, not so much relationship, as rapport. When you trust someone with your most precious 'possessions', surely it's in everyone's interests that you all genuinely like each other and get on well. And with that follow courtesies from both sides. But again, that might just be how the OP was written and no reflection of anything.

We have 2 DC and it is way cheaper to have a live-in au pair than to put them into full time nursery, but that's irrelevant as some people just see words like 'nanny' or 'cleaner' and think 'middle class bitch'.

I'm also highly dubious at housework and childcare being described as 'shit work'. Lovely.

Thread still going then zzzzz

Someone strong-arm you into clicking on it, Limara?

montysorry Wed 26-Jan-11 16:47:23

I am not at all resentful of my conditions of employment. They are what they are and I love my job. I was a wee bit disappointed to be stuck with August, but as I said, it comes with the job.

I am just astounded at the level of flaming the OP has received in a way she never would of if this was not a nanny issue. When I compared my situation it was just to say that nobody would think a school was BU not to allow a teacher to take 2wks unpaid leave for a honeymoon.

FWIW, I don't think the OP is being unreasonable. However, I would allow the nanny the time off in the same situation just to retain her if nothing else.

Read slowly and you mayt understand......a teacher is bound by term time, a nanny is not.

I was a teaching assistant when I got married. We booked it for the bank holiday in August, 18 months ahead of time, meaning that as schools normally had the bank holiday week as the last week of the holiday and then went back on the following Tues or Wed we would have over a week off, I was then going to ask for a couple of unpaid leave days as my class only did mornings for a couple of weeks anyway. Long story short, before I could ask I was approached by the chair of govs and head teacher who informed me that for the year I was marrying they had just had the council school holiday list and we were infact going back to work on the Wed straight after the bank holiday (first time that the teacher I worked with had known this to happen in over 30 years of teaching) and they would not allow me to take any time off, including making me go in on the non pupil day on the Wed which I was extra hours as TA's are not ordinarily paid for non pupil days and are paid extra. I accepted it and delayed my homeymoon until Christmas.
Sorry this has gone on a bit, but just to add although I accepted the decision I was rather put out when in the next April another TA was allowed to take 3 extra days off to the Easter hols as she was going on holiday to DisneyLand (new head had taken over and chair of govs agreed to it).

"Oh FGS. The nanny gets 4 weeks holiday. Two of her choosing, 2 of the OP choosing, plus bank holidays!!!!! "

No- the Op says

"She is allowed 2 weeks holiday when she chooses and the rest when we choose (usually another 4 weeks worth)."

Based on this, she gets 6 weeks in total. The fact that she spends her 2 flexible weeks going to Lourdes is beside the point.

Agree that Sakura's description of childcare as "shit work" is somewhat surprising.

5DollarShake and?

And what?

If you're so bored with the thread that you're falling asleep, Just Stop Reading It, and let others get on with the discussion. Simples.

limara, i am with you, i checked it and made a silly post ages ago, i guess interesting theoretical discussions about conditions of work, but........[yawns]

my observations from reading this post:

1. the nanny was prob thinking of leaving

2. staff always gossip and chat amongst themselves.

3. The power balance in the work/employee relationship is not equal which is why 2) happens

4. Some argue that feminism is not delegating domestic duties to another female as it exploits women (and let's men of the hook)

5. It sounds as though the two do not have a brilliant relationship

6)Loyalty from your employees is not a given it has to be earned by treating your staff with respect.

5DollarShake I can say whatever I want. Did you really feel it necessary to reply to my post? You must be bored too!

Lets be honest, all that needed to be said, has been said. The OP isn't even around now.

Only got to page 2...I see i have another 38 to go. I can't believe you are getting such a flaming.

I agree that it is in her contract therefore as her employer it is at your discretion as to whether she can have extra time off.

Anyway...off to skip to page 40!

The thing is you all keep going about rules and law and other jobs.

We don't even know if this is a proper employment.

Thats the problem with nannying, cleaning etc, it is not always done the proper way and the legal way. You don't know any teacher or accountant who works without legal contract, who's not taking the legal holidays, her employer keeps her passport etc do you? But there are many nanny cases cases like this thats why people question it.

a) Mathanxiety is right, it is strange for a high flying career woman to have nanny (from abroad) for 6 yrs and no back up for illnesses, family member death etc.

b) OP said that she doesn't want to use emergency Agency cover because the cost will be much higher (she only mentioned the dcs stability after some posters did). Emergency cover is usually a bit higher but it shouldn't be massive difference. Unless she pays her nanny very low.

c) Even more strange is her post about SIL. Proper nanny employers don't borrow each other's nanny like this, dont do 'favours' to each other. They speak to the nanny -if they see her as a proffessional - and they ask her if she wants extra work and extra cash. The nanny has the right to refuse. OP's post about this doesn't indicate proffessional employment . Sounds more like expats swapping their Philippinos.

So it is pointless IMO to compare her situation with teachers and lawers.

The holiday thing is common in all sorts of industries, not only nannying for example

6 weeks holiday a year =

2 weeks of the employees choosing
2 weeks during annual factory shutdown
1 week at Christmas
the rest made up of Easter & bank holidays

OP YANBU. Most normal employed pople have to check first before booking any kind of holiday, wedding or otherwise.

I don't see why you get to dictate to this poor woman when she can and can not take holiday.

I think she needs to look for a better job

I'm not long gone but am somewhat amused by the thread. I was very annoyed when this first way mentioned.

Yes the nanny might be planning to leave before September, but unless it was a certainty she should have mentioned the fact that she'd set the date.

FWIW I told her that of couse we would sort it out, but in the future when employed by me or anyone else probably best not to just assume that unpaid leave would be ok.

Yes, she's got an employment contract, we pay the PAYE, she effectively gets 6 weeks a year (although only 2 of her choice), she gets quite a lot more than the minimum wage. I pay full pay when she is sick even if I am out of pocket by taking my annual leave etc.

I have an nanny as if I didn't I couldn't work. Local all day nurseries cost around £70 a day and that would just be for DS2, would still have to find after school and holiday care for DD and DS1.

I said ages ago the OP was probably a troll. I still think so!