To tell my nanny she can't take days of for her wedding.

[Foreverondiet]

Have had same nanny for several years and each year she does some sort of retreat thing in June, 2 weeks. She is allowed 2 weeks holiday when she chooses and the rest when we choose (usually another 4 weeks worth).

Anyway she tells me she is getting married.... I think nothing of it until cleaner says did you know it was in September this year. I ask the nanny and she said, yes she was thinking she's take some unpaid leave. Try to push how much she needs, she wants another couple of weeks. I suggested maybe she wouldn't do the retreat this year but she was almost in tears and said she couldn't believe I wouldn't give her time of for getting married (she's going back home to eastern Europe to get married).

I asked her why she thought it would be ok, as I don't have enough holiday to cover it because we have already committed to go away with DH's parents. And yes I can take unpaid parental leave but this would be very expensive, and leave my boss being a bit annoyed with me.

The reason we have a nanny is that I have 3 DC, aged 4,7 and 9 months and its the only way I can work (full day nursery/childminder for baby plus after school would cost almost the same and this way she looks after older DC if they are ill or during school holidays).

Her wedding is on a Saturday and she works for me Mon/Tues and Thurs so its not as if she HAS to take time off, and if it really was that important to her why does she not cancel the retreat?

well sorry but in your first post you said she gets 2 weeks when she chooses, and the rest when you choose (normally 4 weeks)

now it's only 2? so you only give her 4 weeks holiday a year? that's not much is it?

It's not suddenly.
It's in September.

She's not even spoiling their school holidays by being unavailable to have DCs while OP visits her family.

OP - if by 4 weeks, you mean 20 days then you are breaking the law. Statutory minimum is 28 days.

What does your stable boy think anyway?

I think your nanny has been rather cheeky. She's booked time off for a holiday, so why couldn't she tell you about the timing of her wedding and broach the question of unpaid leave properly?

I do think you should try to accomodate her if you don't want her to leave - there is lots of time to get a temp and if her leave is unpaid you shouldn't end up grossly out of pocket.

But I would be having a chat with her about planning, holidays, how much you depend on her etc. I suspect tbh that she thinks that you will have to agree to the unpaid leave (i.e. you'll feel backed into a corner - it's kind of an ultimatum). I can't say my instinct would be to respond well to those tactics, but you need to work out whether you want to keep her or not and come at it from that angle.

"She got to choose when to get married". What a fucking cheek. Clearly this nanny Does Not Know Her Place. Sacking, I suspect, would be Too Good For Her.

Those of you who work, what would your bosses say to this arrangement? Would they let you just take two weeks unpaid leave on a date of your choosing, in addition to the six weeks of paid holiday you get already?

Yes, my bosses would do everything they could to sort this out and arrange cover, because they realise it's a rather important event in someone's life, despite the fact that they get 4 weeks off per year and no real say in when they take it...I get 4 weeks off per year and no say when I take it...but considering how important this is I would assume any employer would try their best and not bitch about it

Oh, and I can't speak for your nanny , but I fucking hate being called "the nanny"

why has she not invited you, your DH and your DC to her wedding if she is such a valued nanny?

From a compassionate point of view you are being a little unreasonable, though I can see your predicament with cover/childcare/work etc. She has put you in a pickle there.

Is there any chance you can allow her to have it off unpaid, but hire an agency nanny for that 2 weeks, assuming the difference between her not being paid and an agency being paid is less than you taking unpaid. So you are a little out of pocket but not majorly so?

From her point of view she was taking a bit of a chance on it being "okay" and really could have discussed it, when she was at the point of setting dates and planning it, bearing in mind she is a long term employee and there is a precedent in place for holidays etc. She was taking a bit of a chance there. I used to have to apply and wait to be approved my leave to go home to Australia for Christmas or otherwise BEFORE I could book anything. It would have been uncompassionate for my employers to say no, I couldn't go home to my family for Christmas, but I still had to go through the correct measures to ensure this was all fine before booking it - I could never assume. Such is the bind of having a job I guess!

No the cleaner is from the same country, and they speak together but cleaner doesn't speak any english and only works a few hours a week for me and has other jobs so can't look after the kids.

All those of you who work, surely if you want to get married you plan your holiday entitelment aorund it, and don't just assume you will be able to take annual leave.

FWIW I gave her a week off at christmas too, on full pay at her choice, but I haven't even counted that.

Peering
But the nanny only gets 4 weeks leave.

Isn't that low for UK?

I have a nanny and a cleaner so apparently I am 'allowed' to comment on this . I still thought this was a joke. Do you read Polly Filler in Private Eye and identify with her?

YABU. She has given you nine months notice of her UNPAID leave. What if she was sick? You'd have to work something out then.

If she is a good nanny try and oh, I don't know, COMPROMISE. Sort out a stand-in through an agency, ask relatives, muddle through, work from home.

lissielou and usualsuspect

"AIBU To tell my nanny she can't take days of for her wedding."

Fuck yes!

what next op? she cant have an afternoon off to attend her mothers funeral, because YOU havent had written notice six months in advance?

I think 9 months notice is enough for you to say yes. I can appreciate its not ideal for you but I think that if I trusted/liked someone enough to look after my 3 children I would like to think I'd care enough to support something as massive as getting married.

Also, it does seem to me that if you're this unreasonable, she was probably trying to find the courage to tell you about this - not as you maintain, just not telling you until you asked.

Ha ha ha at the funny thread.

So basically she only gets to choose two weeks holiday per year?

She chooses those to go on the retreat.

Then you decide when she has the other two weeks holiday. Presumably this year she would like that to be in September, around her wedding, but this is not convenient to you because you own need her to ... what?

this is a joke, right??

The nanny is being UR to assume she can take unpaid leave and not ask you/inform you of the date of the wedding. She is entitled to 2 weeks holiday of her choosing, so she either gets the retreat or the wedding, not both.

I understand the arrangement you have, it is the same one I have with my nanny. Contractually, she is entitled to 2 weeks of her choosing, 2 weeks of yours (I assume you give her the remaining statutory 1.6 weeks as bank holidays? I just do 6 weeks, split 50/50) but you often find that you have "extra" holiday left over from your own employment, so she in turn gets extra paid time off. It is not a contractual obligation for you to provide this, and in some years this may not happen. Am I correct?

I do think you are UR as well though, given your tone towards her. It's her wedding, it's a big event, and given that she has worked for you for some years and (I assume) provided you with an excellent service, I do think it would be in your best interest to sit down with her and try and find a compromise.

So she tells you in January that she wants unpaid leave in September? You've got nearly a year to arrange something. If it's unpaid, coudn;t you use what you would have paid her to employ an agency nanny, for example?

What yowu you do if she was ill? Sack her, presumably!

We scrambled so our nanny could go on an extra week of holiday this year. It was very inconvenient and cost us money but we value her and understood that it was important to her. I'm shocked you wouldn't consider time off unpaid for a wedding. You could always ask around and see if you can get help of pay a recent high school grad for babysitting etc.

I thought it was 20 days min holiday? Does the 28 include Bank HOls?

suggest that she takes the kids with her to the wedding, - problem solved !!!

Oh and usualsuspect..the gardener is probably the groom and I suspect he's not a happy man either, he doesn't even get let out of the shed on his day off....

OP - you must be fucking kidding

OP I don't think you are being completely unreasonable. It doesn't sound like your nanny has handled it brilliantly - obviously she should have spoken to you directly and asked for the unpaid leave.

If you say no though, as others have pointed out, this is going to be a huge issue for her. Is it worth falling out with your nanny over? I wouldn't want major issues between myself and someone who was such a big influence in my kids' lives.

Can you not get an agency nanny in for her 2 unpaid weeks? It might cost you a little more than the unpaid salary, but would solve your problem and preserve your relationship with her?

You gave her a full week at Christmas? Well, that's the root of the problem then, you're spoiling her. Now she think she can swan off to get married without you picking the date for her.

Some people have no idea how to manage staff.