Does this email seem unreasonable?

[LittleAmy]

Hi everyone.

I know I'm posting in the lions den here, but I'd appreciate your views as to whether this email to my husband seems in any way unreasonable or confrontational.

Thank you.

Can you see where I'm coming from at all?

I look after DD all through the day every working day. I exclusively breastfeed our daughter. It's demanding and exhausting.

I've got postnatal depression and I'm not coping very well. I need support to get better. You provide a lot of support and I appreciate it. I will be able to thank you properly when I am better. When you told me K was visiting I was excited. I love K. She is my favourite of your family members. I imagined we would spend some time together. I never got to see K properly last time she visited because you both went to the club so I was looking forward to finally bonding with her this time. But then I found out that you'll be spending the evening in the club again. I was very dissapointed and also frustrated by the 24 hours notice. Would it not have been possible to discuiss the plans with her last week? At least then I would have had a weeks notice to be mentally prepared. Last minute changes to plans is particularly triggering for me because I'm an anxious person.

When I went to dry my hair this evening I mulled everything over in my head to try and figure out if I was being unreasonable, rather than snap at you the moment you said it. I thought with an hour to mull over it then it wouldn't seem as bad, but the more I thought about it, the more inconsiderate your last minute plans seemed. In light of my recent mental state, specifically my struggling to look after DD for longer than 10 hours at a time, I couldn't understand why I was being left with her all day and then all evening, particularly as DD is most grumpy in the evenings. Depending on her temperment it can be a two-person job. Yet I anticipated our argument. Because me communicating my displeasure in something always ends terribly. I anticipated that you would say I hate your family because that is often said in arguments. But I hoped that my effort with your parents yesterday went at least some way to showing that I enjoy your familys company. But my making an effort with them seems to have gone unnoticed. It makes me feel sad that my efforts to bond with your family (particularly your mam) mean little to you and instead you insist that I hate them. It makes no sense to me.

Then I couldn't understand why we couldn't afford to purchase a scarf for K despite the fact that it costs £20 to go to the club for two nights. And that you expect my mam to buy it.

Most of all I'm saddened that despite my best efforts to get through the day keeping DD content and happy I had succeeded until tonight. But our poor little girl has had to watch us shouting and hitting eachother again. She is going to grow up anxious like me. I didn't want her to grow up like me. It's a horrible way to live.

We are failing our little girl. It brakes my heart, even more than your hatred for me.

When we were arguing this evening I heard you shout that it was all my fault, because I wanted children. But I was very careful to include you in the decision to have children. DD was very much planned by both of us. I don't think it helps anyone to keep mentioning that I wanted children. DD was wanted by both of us, so we're both "to blame". You are a grown man with over 40 years experience. When we coneived DD I was confident in your conviction to be a good father and I thought you genuenly wanted her. Was I wrong? It's too late for either of us to have regrets now.

I love you and I believe that you love me too. I don't think you do things like arrange nights out with malace. But it would save lots of heartache if we made joint decisions. When I am kept in the dark it makes me feel that you think my feelings are unimportant. It infantises me. It was assumed that I would be able to look after DD all day Friday then Friday evening on my own and also Sunday evening on my own. It leads me to think that you don't understand the extent of my depression. I don't know what else I can do to communicate the depth of my depression. I always thought I was quite demonstrative and transparent about it.

I would like to hear your thoughts.

x x

P.S. I've been very careful to word this email with "I feel" and "I think" rather than starting sentences with "you". I'm hoping that it will be less confrontational.

I have no advice to offer, but I live relatively nearby,and would be happy to meet up if you wanted. DD2 isn't much older than your DD.

Please please though don't feel like a failure. I don't have PND, and I still sometimes feel like a crap parent. Think the guilt goes a bit with the territory. Your worrying so much about the effect of your illness/your DP's aggression etc shows how much you love your DD.

I really hope the ADs will help.

I do know someone who was sectioned under the Mental Health Act - who became psychotic - after her baby was born; was hospitalised for some time, and now is fine, and so is her child - things can turn around, if you get the right help, which I think is drugs, counselling AND sorting out the relationship. But you need help through all that, a hand to hold, which it sounds like your mum won't offer.

I'm happy to meet, if you want to.

Two things.

What you describe - paranoia, feeling worthless, feeling everyone is judging you - that is "normal" for PND. Well, that's what I was told when I asked people about my own feelings!

Second. The weighing, feeding etc thing. My ds was notorious for not gaining weight, despite being fatter and longer and needing larger clothes. I came to the conclusion that weighing is only a really good reflection of growth if it is done a truly scientific way - say taking the average of hourly weighing over a full day. Otherwise, it is

Just think - if dd was weighed last time shortly after a feed, she'd be 5-8oz up. This time if she was weighed just before a feed and after one or two full nappies, she could be 5-8oz down. I was so anxious I actually weighed a full nappy, compared to an empty one. I've been in that awful state of mind where it feels like you are failing your child and hindsight tells me I shouldn't have had him weighed, or trusted the person weighing who couldn't get the mark in the right place on the graph AND told me some real rubbish... Ease off on yourself over the weight issue and that might help you be more relaxed about feeding. Easier said than done I know...

I just wanted to help with the bits I could.

You will damage your dd long term if you don't do something with that I do agree, but you ARE seeking help for your pnd. Then you can review your situation. Any violence within the home may well colour her views on how to form stable relationships etc in the future and her emotional stability as an individual. BUT This is not inevitable and you can change things, but I stand by my original point that you really do need to start feeling better in yourself, and getting support from any agency you can will help this.

As for the hitting, Hitting is hitting regardless of the marks it leaves, the fear of your partner inflicts can be just as damaging as bruises and broken bones, it's not a healthy relationship regardless of your dh's warped view (was this normal for his parents?).

I do believe that his depression is another stick to beat you with and make you feel guilty for (his aim?) Don't rise to it tell him to seek the support and help you are also seeking but do not accept the blame.

Cross-posted.... Not having lasting marks doesn't mean it isn't domestic violence. It still is.

I am concerned that you seem to think you are to blame for his violence - that you have caused it by your PND. You haven't, honestly.

Ha - otherwise weighing is a flawed method.

LittleAmy - I'm very sad your HV said PND harms babies. I have no idea... clearly ongoing depression in a mum isn't likely to help but IMO what babies need at this stage is food, clean clothes / nappies / some cuddles / smiles.

I can tell you that my friend was in a truely dreadful state, but now is a great mum. Her DD, now 6, in year 1 is lovely and would never know what it was like when she was born. (Also - my friend's DH also had depression, he explains in the book). My friends MIL ended up coming to stay with them to look after the baby until my friend recovered.

In terms of breastfeeding, again I can just say what I saw for my friend is that breastfeeding made it all so much worse, (also because she couldn't take the medication she needed) although she gave up well before 5 months.

As I said in an earlier post although I am really pro-breastfeeding etc etc I did stop feeding DS1 at 4.5-5 months because it wasn't making me or him happy.

Amy, you are not damaging your baby, really you aren't! if she continued to grow up in a violent household then it would have an effect..peope are just letting you know that to show you what your DH is doing.

YOU are not damaging your child. You are clearly a very loving, very concerned mother.

re the 5 oz - I bet she has suddenly become more active? Babies get a lot less interested in food every time they learn something new like sitting up - and you wait til she starts walking or crawling - they lose weight like mad from the sudden extra movement added to the deparate desire to try it out! If she is well, alert, perky, I would NOT worry about 5oz! My dp went potty over one of DS's weigh-ins and then we discovered that the dot had actually been out in the wrong square...

You need mum-friends to be on your side and share all this with - as well as the professional help and encouragement you need.

Your DH should NOT be hitting you, you have not driven him to it, and hopefully his visit to the GP is a cover fo him to say 'I must be depressed because I hi my lovely partner, I need HELP'. Because the GP CAN help your DH too - with depression, with anger management, with counselling support.

LittleAmy - I just read this post:

The HV came today. She brought the scales and weighed DD. I wasn't expecting it but DD has lost 5oz. It's the first time she's lost any weight. HV wasn't concerned and said it's probably teething but obviously I'm very worried. As I'm soley responsible for DDs nurtrition, any negative effect on her weight is my responsibility and mine alone. No one seems to understand or appreciate this.

I don't know what I can do to improve her weight? I'm feeding on demand but as DD is teething she doesn't want to stay on the breast for long and pulls of then its a constant battle to get her to feed. What can I do?

This is basically why I stopped BFIng DS1 at 5 months and started him on solids and formula. He didn't want to stay on breast, was pulling (and biting), and weight gain was v slow. And waking up loads in the night. I really do understand what you are saying but in my case, switching to solids and formula made a huge difference, like a weight lifted from me (he had some formula from 4 months, at 5 stopped BFing completely). And once weaned was easy to put him onto a routine, 3 meals and 5 bottles a day.

No longer was his nutrition dependent on me. Her weight gain might just be a one-off (eg if weighed before feed rather than after) but really try not to beat yourself up about this.

This discussion is still throwing up comments which reveal all these horrible ideas you are full of. No wonder you are feeling terrible. For what it's worth, I believe that some mother have an "optimum age" that they relate to, above all. Mine, I think, is the teenage years (which means I've got far to go - poor DS), and I am not overly thrilled at the toddler years. Some people prefer their sweet babies, and find the toddlers/teenagers to be monstrous deformations of those sweet babies they remembered. Some people love every stage of their child's life, and those are the very lucky mothers. But please note that I said "lucky", not "good" mothers.

Just try to break down the problems, bit by bit; your DD will benefit from this, no matter what.

Re: the weighing: Have you checked your DD's length? My (bf) DS has always been very skinny, but he does grow in length, and his body would not waste the energy on growing if he hadn't got it.

Sweet dreams.

Hey littleAmy how are you this morning?

LittleAmy I hope you are ok.

I just read your post on your DH hitting you. Whether or not it leaves a mark, its still not acceptable EVER.

I know from earlier posts he might have depression too, but I think you need to be firm on this - say that you want to make it work and you know he is struggling to cope but he must not hit or push you for any reason, its just not acceptible under any circumstances, and that if he does it again you really will not be left with any choice but to report him to the police. And yes they will take it seriously even without bruising. (Start writing down the details of every incident in a notebook.)

If you are drinking heavily (think you mentioned it on another thread) then it will affect your milk supply. Not being judgemental, just a fact that may help you with your decisions.

FWIW I don't think fighting in front of her will have had any effect at such a young age, but it will do in 6 months or a year's time.

Just catching up and read about the breastfeeding. 5oz is a wee or a poo. It's nothing. Breastfed babies don't grow in straight lines, they have times where they stop growing whilst they stockpile calories then they have a growth spurt.

There is a reason she prefers to feed at night and you won't be able to replicate that. Your prolactin levels are highest at night and she instinctively knows it. She knows the better milk is available at night and she will hold out for that as much as possible. You won't be able to force her to feed.

What you have to realise is she is gaining. If you gave her nothing at all then she would have lost far more than 5oz. She is burning a lot more calories now and coupled with the imminent growth spurt she hasn't learnt she needs to take that little bit more.

BTW alcohol doesn't get to breastmilk and there are mixed opinions on whether it affects supply.

PND won't harm the baby. My mum had puerperal psychosis (a very bad form of PDN) after my sister was born and there is nothing wrong with my sister. Even for all the medication Mum was on then. Breastfeeding can help PND because of the way the hormones work but if you're stressing about it working then you're not going to be able to experience that.

Not bruising you is not not that bad, it's just a clever abuser.

LittleAmy take your daughter out of this horrible messy situation or Social Services will.
Hitting is never Ok, even if it doesn't leave bruises.
PND is not uncommon and relegated to people who are awful parents- but your PND may be helped by you leaving a man who thinks it's ok to hit you.

Would you hit your parent, your friend, your relative, your baby-no, because you love them and hitting is bad-so why is it ok to hit you?

LittleAmy

"Jo, how did your DP deal with your PND? How old is your DC now?"

My partner helped make my GP appointments during times the baby was going to be awake, not napping so that I could go & take the baby and not be worried that his sleep would be messed up. He's 11 months old now.

My partner was kind and listened to me, didn't shout and certainly didn't hit me, even when I was having an awful day and not being very reasonable (I think, looking back now) because I was getting angry and shouting.

My partner made calls when I didn't feel up to it, and did the shopping when I couldn't face it. He watched the baby in the mornings so I could get more sleep. He made me a cup of tea when I looked tired, or told me to go have a lie down and he would take care of the baby.

I can't remember all the times and all the ways that my partner supported me. He used to surprise me with flowers, not just on my birthday. It's only when you're not used to support, that you don't understand what that would look or sound like.

so obviously you feel guilty...about all sort of things. About having this child more than he did, about not copying, about been failing and depressed, you also sound some how jealous of this woman (who is she by the way)
Never send that email. Agree totally with what people said before me. You need help for yourself fast!!! You need legal advice from women aid / gingerbread maybe?
You are making excuses for him and this is very often a sign that you are already very affected my this all situation not to see the reality of it. Dangerous!
Please get help

LittleAmy
Please don't think you are alone. Many many women get PND and have experienced violence in a relationship.
If you would like to talk to someone in complete confidence you can ring this women's aid :575757 to talk about how your are feeling. You don't even need to give your name.
The call might show up on a bill so MAKE SURE you ring on a phone where this won't be a problem.
Look after yourself.

I haven't read the whole thread so I apologise if this is a repeat of something someone has already stated.

"But he does kind things regularly. It confuses me."

Abusers have a cycle that they follow. They are mean and hit/yell/scare you then they apologise and promise it will never happen again and become overly nice and attentive. This last part is to lull you into a false sense of security and trust. This cycle is how they break their victims down so that they can assure they have complete control over them.

"If I leave what will I do? I can't look after a baby on my own. I'm barely coping as it is."

If you don't leave, how long do you think it will be before he starts hitting your child? You already state that he doesn't want her. You need to get you and your child away from him now before it's too late.

PND is not an excuse to abuse someone, there is no excuse for it. If you have PND you need to get help.

How are you LittleAmy?

Hi! I'm the child of a violent parent - not toward my mother (he was certainly abusive verbally/mentally but I never rememeber physical violence) but to me.

We spent Christmas Eve talking about it. She feels like a bad mother for not leaving him and me having to cope with it, and still gets bitter and angry over how he was. They spent six months living in the same house, not speaking, with my father eating food from a drawer and throwing the rubbish out of a window as he didn't want to come into contact with her, because they had an argument once and she stood up for herself and spoke back to him. Six months.

I get frequent headaches because I was hit so many times over the head as a child and teenager. I have been diagnosed with PTSD. I get flashbacks. I have almost no confidence in many things. As a young adult, I got in a relationship that was physically abusive - I remember incidents just like the ones you describe, and I remember justifying it to myself - because I didn't know that it wasn't normal. I get upset every Father's Day because I have to walk past cardshop windows with 'Number 1 dad'. I remember how violently I wished for my parents to get divorced, and how I felt actually relieved when he died of cancer because I would no longer have to make a decision about whether to go home at Christmas and pretend things were OK.

You think that it's all your fault and it's because you're hard to cope with. You're wrong. The minute your child annoys him enough she is going to get a punch or a slap as well, and if she doesn't learn that that is the way to solve conflict, she will learn that that's what will happen every time she makes a mistake or does something wrong.