to not 'do' santa?

[jmt2211]

I don't believe in Santa and refuse to lie to my child about it. The first year he could ask about it was when he was 3 and I just said that lots of people liked to believe in Santa but really he was just pretend.
I have yet to find a single person who has done the same, even if I can get them to agree in principle, no one will agree in practice. I'd love to hear what others think (other than that I am a Scrooge) and see if anyone agrees with me....

Why can they make up their own minds about God but not about Father Christmas?

I am willing to accept that I maybe am too literal, but I raise my child this way because I feel it is the right way. How patronising to ask me to 'think about it carefully' I think it is quite clear that I have not only thought about but cemented my thoughts to the point that I am willing to carry these principals out. I am not willing to blindly follow this whole santa lark just because other people do or because it might upset other families. And as for, not inviting a child to a xmas party because he doesn't believe in santa, that really is mean. If it was because of our faith it would be totally unacceptable thing to say.

notso they can! I've already said I don't say to my children "Santa does not exist, it's all a big lie!" or whatever ... they play the game, talk about Santa and the reindeer, join in with everything that their friends do ... I just don't force-feed them the myth wholesale. There's just no need imo. They have plenty of fun anyway! I think it's a real shame if people think my DC will have a miserable Christmas unless I actively perpetuate the myth.

FWIW I'm super-excited about Christmas this year ...

With regards telling lies to children - my DD of 3 is putting all the mental puzzle pieces together about families, and now understands the links between GPs, mummy, daddy and her. So she asks me where my daddy, her other GD is, and I say he lives far, far away, and can't come and visit. Should I tell her he drinks too much alcohol, is often connected to tubes in a hospital bed, was a crap father, and doesn't bring much to the party as a grandfather?

There will be times you have to lie to your children. You can be sanctimonious about 'breaking a bond of trust' but sometimes telling the truth is actually the sh!tty thing to do.

Obviously I'm not talking about Santa. I'm just saying, stop hiding behind a holier-than-thou attitude that telling the truth about every little thing in the whole wide world makes you a better parent.

Sorry Scarlett I only skim read most of the thread, I assumed you were more of the brutally honest approach like jmt.
Out of interest then how old are your DC and have they actually asked you if FC exists?

"Filling a child's head full of fantasies is setting them up for disappointment! Why not just tell them the truth about life in way they helps them to feel ok about it".

I have to say that's a really sad statement to make (irrespective of the Santa argument). There is only one time where you can really engage in fantasies and that is childhood: I have never met anyone who was really pissed off with their parents because they told them about cinderella, Harry Potter or the tooth fairy (I suppose that's out as well).

At the end of the day it's only your children's loss and it's your decision. But you and the OP are justifying this as a huge black or white ethical argument which simply does not stand in real life (and your kids are very unlikely to thank you for that life lesson I would think...)

You can do whatever you like, your child, your traditions etc. I cannot find it within myself to care very much.

However OP I think that you telling your child that other children get presents not from Santa but from parents who lie to them is utterly out of order. It would be like the other parents telling their children that your son doesn't get presents from Santa because he's a bad little boy

Notso they're 5 and 3. I don't remember them ever asking outright yet, no. I think if they did I'd just say "Well, what do you think?"

If they persisted, something like "Santa's a good fun story, isn't it! It's great to play the game about the reindeer coming - will we leave some food out for them on Christmas Eve? What do you think reindeer like to eat?" or similar, and try and steer the conversation that way. There's always a good distraction tactic!

I don't want them to feel different from their peers, I don't want them to "put their foot in it" and tell other kids outright that Santa doesn't exist, but neither will I actively lie to them.

I'm no brutally honest, just honest- in fact softly(gently)honest. I am helping my child to understand now, rather than later, how life works. I have said this already but I teach him through my actions and words that sometimes bad things happen and sometimes good and we can cope with both. I actually think pretending to kids that bad things don't happen is quite dangerous and that instead you should teach your child to cope when they do.

Back to Santa: If your child could enjoy xmas just as much without you having to lie why wouldn't you choose the honest route.

I could teach my child not to go in the cupboard with cleaning products in it because there is a big scary monster in there...or just say not to go in there because there are things that are dangerous for children and could harm him. Both would get the same result but which is the right one?

well then clearly scarlett you're very different in approach to the OP who has told her child outright it is a lie and deception and that their friends parents lie to their children. which is a pretty disturbing 'truth' to unravel at the age of 3!

that's totally different to what you're saying which is not far off what i think or do.

Scarlett, avoidance tactics similar to myself then.

"Santa is a lie made up by your friends parents. They don't get presents from Santa, their parents buy them. And you can tell them that if you like, because it's the truth and we always tell the truth in our family"

clearly I never said that, you're being ridculous. your issue is with the mother at toddler group not me

jmt - i'm not convinced my DCs would have enjoyed Christmas Day as much without Santa, no. Enjoyed - yes - but not quiiiite as much.

And nor would i when they were little or when i was.

As Christians we've always emphasised the nativity side of it and they have found plenty of awe and wonder in that, as do we However, FC has and does feature, we just do it in a different way, we put out the food/sherry/do a reindeer trail etc etc and do stockings, and one of our Christmas Eve traditions is to snuggle up in new pjs and read Twas the Night Before Christmas. And I love seeing their faces light up at both what we see as the reality of Christmas and at the make-believe too. I firmly believe in celebrating as much as possible.

I would never say bluntly FC doesn't exist, but we have talked about the story of St Nick as being the origin of it etc and they love that. ds remains convinced whatever his big sister says, so there is definitely some personality at play there.

I don't think my DC would enjoy Christmas as much without all the traditions that go with it, because if I we didn't 'do' Father Christmas because I didn't believe, then we wouldn't 'do' church which they love because I don't believe, so a good chunk of our traditions wouldn't exist.

if other people didn't lie to their children I wouldn't be in such an awkward position, you guys have created this problem with your own lies yet I am the bad one for telling my child the truth. Why should I have to cover for you?

Ok your last post has convinced me you are making it all up....good one

Here in Belgium, we have Saint Nicholas who was a genuine person from the 10th century and is depicted and always seen with bishops robes and mitre. I can put my hand on my heart and tell my children that Saint Nicholas was real. (Not so sure about his Moorish assistant, Pere Fouettard who came along to deal with the naughty kids.) Saint Nicholas is celebrated with gifts on 6th December.

I never make claims about the authenticity of Father Christmas! But it does get a bit confusing because the Dutch term for Saint Nicholas is Sinterklaas.

None of it stops my children thoroughly enjoying Christmas!