To tell the travellers...

[Starbuck999]

By my parents house to please fuck off?

Story is, my parents and their neighbours all clubbed together to buy a lovely piece of land that their terrace of houses over looks. None of them are rich and it was a large buy for them all but they all keep is beautifully and it is a lovely view for them all to enjoy, it's only a small patch of land, not what one could consider to be a field even. i think they have (had) plans to make it a play area for all the local children, or a sports field or something similar.

4 weeks ago, overnight, a few caravans appeared. Of course the residents went to speak to them to say it was private land (which they already knew as there are huge "private" signs all round it and they actually smashed down a large section of the fencing to drive their caravans in.) But the travellers refused to budge. They were very matter of fact and reasonably polite about the fact that they would not be moving and they knew the residents couldnt do anything to make them move right away. Lovely.

Now, whilst I fully appreciate anyone's right to live how they want, surely it should not be at the expense of others. It must be wonderful to live such a free life, moving from place to place if that is what you choose, but how can you not expect to pay? Caravans sites cost say £25 a night, they should be paying to stay in one, or buy their own land and live there.

The field is now horrendous. More and more caravans have been moved in, I'd say there's no about 20. There are huge piles of broken up crates, broken buggies, televisions etc and massive piles of general hosehold rubbish and food waste in black bags that have been split open by foxes I presume all round the edge of the land. It's starting to look like a landfill site!

I don't have the full details but basically the residents have been told nothing can be done to get rid of them right away, it will take time through the courts. Then they will be moved on. That's all that will happen. Now If I parked my car somewhere illegal it would be clamped, towed and I'd have a hefty fine - why doesn't the same apply?

AIBU?

'Scum is a polite way of describing them and their behaviour.'

Would you like to sign your real name under that, LookToWindward?

Would you get away with saying something like that about any other minority community?

Runaway wife

'One of the nicer schools in our area has just been forced to take in a massive amount of children from in illegal traveler camp, so that now a no go school for the rest of us.'

God, you sound charming.

Kinders, I've read many times that Gypsies and Travellers are the most oppressed and persecuted minority groups in europe and after reading some of the bigoted comments on this thread I can see why.

Let me tell you something Kinders. Many of the Showmen I know, from centuries-old travelling families, are wary of being identified with the undesirable behaviour of some other types of traveller and, rightly or wrongly, the public perception of the travelling community. Some of these Showmen won't put down at fairs where there are other travellers selling their wares because they don't want to be associated with the others' activities.

I don't seem to be able to please you. I state a warning based on a great deal of knowledge and experience about some members of a community, not because I have an issue with the community but because I am a bloody fanatic about dogs and I care deeply about them. I also state that I know some members of the community and indicate my respect and affection for them. Either way you seem determined to take a pop at me!

FWIW if you want to know more about my experience and knowledge of many things dog, take a look at some of my posts on the Pets section where I have advised and on many occasions actively helped members off on and beyond MN, as I do elsewhere on the Net. I don't particularly care that you might think I am prejudiced but I do care that you appear to be questioning my experience and knowledge as that could be damaging to my ability to assist others in the future.

Call me what you will but I am not willing to have my honesty put in doubt, my ability to help curtailed or my good reputation as a knowledgable rescuer damaged. The lives and welfare of the animals I seek to help are too important to me for that.

omg, RunawayWife - can you hear yourself - that is a horrific thing to say about the tanks!

And as for the school - they are kids RunawayWife. That is a really horrible post.

Vallhala, my own experience with Travellers is that they are, well just normal really. I have had no bad experiences. I'm not denying that others may have had, there are good and bad Travellers like with any other group.

The point is this thread has degenerated into hate speech against Travellers. People are posting blatant lies (the ASDA story) and the whole point is to convince us they are all this bad. Its hate speech.

Just caught up with this thread - turned out as bigoted as it promised to be. Windward: 'I hold a relatively senior rank in a force in the north of England.' You are really happy to admit that and share your opinion that:'Scum is a polite way of describing them and their behaviour' Does the phrase 'Institutionally Racist' ring any bells? I'm outta here.

'Kinders, I've read many times that Gypsies and Travellers are the most oppressed and persecuted minority groups in europe and after reading some of the bigoted comments on this thread I can see why.'

Ever spent time being black or Middle-Eastern in France then?

I'd say the same thing about a group of martians: camping on someone's else's property without the owners' permission, trashing their property and not cleaning up after yourself is wrong and the owner should not have to put up with it just because the campers are martian.

"Would you like to sign your real name under that, LookToWindward?

Would you get away with saying something like that about any other minority community?"

I post anonymously as I do not wish to my identity as a police officer to interfere my private life and vice versa. If you object to my posts then argue with the content.

There is no difference between describing the "travellers" I have met as "scum" and the inhabitants of two houses in a particularly infamous estate on my patch as such. There's nothing "minority" about them other than the way they chose to live. They're certainly not "romani" if that's what your inferring.

Criminality is not a "minority community".

Thank you for sharing your experiences with travellers, Kinder, but that wasn't what i asked. I asked about your experience in rescue and lost dogs as you appear to be questioning mine.

Vallhala, I can see that you do care deeply for dogs.I'm sure you are a great rescuer, that is not something I have questioned.

What I have said is that you tarred these Travellers with the same brush. We know nothing about these particular Travellers, they have just arrived, yet you warned the OP in no uncertain terms. Based on your experience of some Travellers.

Fucking hell at the school being a no go comment.

Why? The schools round here all have traveller children in them. I bet you wouldnt be able to pick them out.

Can we please stop this rubbish about "minority communities" and "racism".

The last time I was involved significantly with one of these the research indicated that the number of actual "Romani Gypsy" travelling communities in the UK can be counted on one hand.

The vast majority are little more than groups of travelling criminals, hiding under the "minority" label to delay and hinder the legal machinations required to remove them from a site.

Institutionally racist?? Oh, FFS [eye rolling emoticon]

I think there are a few on here that haven't ever got over reading The Diddakoi when they were about 10. Open you ears and listen to what you are being told by people who have far more experience in dealing with travellers/tinkers than you do.

Now you're just stirring, KM

Windward, you aren't fit to be holding a position of authority with thoise views. That is offensive racist bullshit. Actually its probably illegal.

"Groups of travelling criminals"... priceless.

They are not all Romani, (Roma we call them here), of course not, thats just a small minority where I live and very separate from the Irish Travellers, who have been here, for thousands of years, probably similar to the ones in England too. Thats why they are called 'Travellers' not Roma! Didn't you wonder or were you so busy shoring up evidence of their criminality that you mised it?

You're not making a great example of the police here I must say.

Kinders, please drop the "Don't tar them all with the same brush line".
We do know a few things about these travellers, they smashed their way into private land, they are refusing to leave and have turned the field into what looks like a landfill site.
Fair enough not all travellers are like this but from the OP we know travellers are.

**I meant we know these travellers are.

So we know they steal dogs, horses, kidnap children, rape women, are violent, criminal scum?

Yes, SESF, I got all that from the OP too.

Kinders - this lot are criminals and should be treated as the vermin they are.

This all started because someone made mention of a group of travellers who are destroying private property.

In that case, we can tar all THOSE people with the same brush, but only a fool would think that all travelling people are of the same inclination.

As Vallhala has said - more than once - there are different groups etc within the group, some of whom are very law abiding and respectful of property etc - and there's evidence from various sources on here (not the urban myth ones) that crime and animal theft is disproportionately higher when some travelling communities are in town, but not all.

It's only hate speech if you say ALL travellers are thieving pikeys. To say that the ones that are caught by LookToWindward's are thieving pikeys is probably true as she's the one arresting them.

Jesus KM, stop talking about shooting them!

Really, Kinders? Sure fooled me.