Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this is actually serious neglect

245 replies

scatteredbraincells · 23/08/2010 08:11

DD (almost 15) has been working all hours under the sun during the summer to save up for a trip she wants to go to (and has made me very proud [boasting emoticon])

A neighbour asked her if she'd babysit for them this week, as their childminder had had an accident and was in hospital (she's gonna be ok). 9 hours a day, 7am to 4pm, takes 3yo to nursery at 7.30, looks after 18month old, picks up 3yo at 3pm, pretty straighforward stuff. The family has been living next door for 6 years, we know them quite a bit, have BBQs together etc.

DD went for her first day today and has just called me very upset and doesn't know what to do. Apparently when she arrived 3yo was all dressed so she started dressing 18mo for the school run, mum was still there and said "oh, don't bother with him". DD assumed mum was gonna be there until she went back, but she got back to find the baby all alone cryin hysterically to the point of throwing up. She called the mum and the mum said "don't worry, it's what we noramlly do, it's only 15 minutes and he's used to it. A bit of cryin never hurt anybody".

Now I don't know what to do. First of all, apart from cruel I think it's also dangerous to leave such a young child alone in the house, 15 or 20 minutes is a very long time. Secondly, I don't want DD involved if something were to happen.

AIBU and where do I go from here?

OP posts:
juuule · 23/08/2010 12:53

Scattered's dd isn't doing anything illegal by being unregistered.

You don't have to be registered "If you provide care for children in their own home."

See no.7 in this Ofsted guidance leaflet

ChippingIn · 23/08/2010 12:59

Of course it's not illegal - those saying it is - have you never used a babysitter??

teaandcakeplease · 23/08/2010 13:04

Agree with Booyhoo. I can't believe she doesn't seem to be bothered at all about doing this.

As others have said, what else does she do, if he does this Sad

Glad you're going to have a chat later.

teaandcakeplease · 23/08/2010 13:05

*she

loopyloops · 23/08/2010 13:19

Good luck with the chat, you're absolutely doing the right thing. Maybe she just doesn't know how dodgy it is... Hmm

loopyloops · 23/08/2010 13:21

bit of useful info

diddl · 23/08/2010 13:22

I would have thought that the number of hours would require it to be regulated tbh.

booyhoo · 23/08/2010 13:26

that sets it out really clearly loopy, might be a good idea for OP to print that off and take with her to see the neighbour.

tabouleh · 23/08/2010 13:26

So there was no understanding Sad.

I remember when my DS was only a few weeks old my DB (a uni student) at the time - midunderstood me saying "let me know when your train gets in - if DS isn't asleep - I can easily pop and get you" (meaning me and DS in the car) - he thought I said "if DS is asleep" - and thought I would leave my DS to come and get him. My DB said "you can't leave him on his own tabouleh!". I was Hmm Confused a) that he had misunderstood me and b) that he thought I'd do that!

Anyway - my point is normal people just don't leave their DCs like this.

tortoiseonthehalfshell · 23/08/2010 13:31

I didn't think the daughter had done anything illegal, by the way - someone upthread said they thought that it was illegal to leave a child of this age with an unregistered carer for more than a two hour period. It was the neighbour I was thinking might be breaking the law (in that regard as well as the others).

Flighttattendant · 23/08/2010 13:40

She needs to be explained to that it is WRONG and DANGEROUS not to mention really UNKIND to leave an 18mo alone in the house for 15 minutes.

If she won't listen to you perhaps the police might get through to her.

I can't believe someone can do this and think it is OK in any way Sad

Good luck Scattered, you're being very brave I think.

kickassangel · 23/08/2010 13:41

she's only babysitting for 3 days!!!! not such a big problem, is it?

and i think the op is doing the right thing by chatting to the mum, not charging in with police/ss as it transpires that she only does it when not using the childminder (who doesn't do this). it is worrying that the mum does this, but the 'don't leave a child unattended' style of parenting is quite modern. when i was a baby, everyone walked down to the shop & parked the pram outside, then went to get food & chat to friends. my mum said you could tell who was there by the prams left out the front, and you'd time your trip to meet up with friends. i would not leave a child that age, and see it as worrying, but a gentle approach sounds far more likely to succeed than going in all guns balzing.

diddl · 23/08/2010 13:56

Well, I don´t call 7-4 babysitting-it´s full on childcare imo!

I also think that leaving children alone in the house seems to be a modern thing.

sapphireblue · 23/08/2010 14:10

wow.........this woman seriously thinks it's ok to leave an 18 month old home alone?? All I can ask is what planet does she live on ???!!!

The age of scattered's DD is pretty much irrelevant and not the issue at all as far as I can see. I think it needs to be reported to someone........even if the neighbour says she won't do it again who's to know what will happen? Someone needs to be checking up on her.

EightiesChick · 23/08/2010 14:13

Agree with kickassangel above that a gentle approach might well be the best way to start it. Like many others, I don't think it is at all acceptable to leave the 18 mo alone like this, but the mum is clearly on good terms with the OP, so scattered, if you can have a friendly but firm chat with her about how wrong it is and get her onside, then you might just have more of an impact than sending in SS straight away. I know this is asking a lot and I really wish you luck - give it a go! You are doing the right thing to try this.

I also think tortoise's suggestions for things to say re why you are concerned are v good, and would use these.

To everyone concerned about the long hours, responsibility etc for a 14 yo - let's not lose sight of the fact that this is an emergency arrangement, put in place for one week only while the CM is out of action. So where I would be concerned about a 14yo taking this on longer term, in this context I think it is manageable, and understandable given the circumstances. How would everyone else who uses childcare manage if it was suddenly out of use for a week? Do you all have reliable relatives, friends etc nearby who would be happy to step in? Surely for many people the only option would be taking the whole week off themselves - I think the OP's daughter is a decent option given the situation. It could be said that she may well be providing better care than the mother atm...

booyhoo · 23/08/2010 14:14

the thing with telling the neighbour that if it doesn't stop you will inform SS i sthat how will you know if she does it again? is your dd going to continue looking after the children?

EightiesChick · 23/08/2010 14:17

booyhoo The OP could spontaneously call in one morning and check it out. Or her DD could, under the guise of saying hello to the kids.

The thing with doing it this way round is that the OP can escalate to contacting SS if the conversation doesn't go well. If you go in hard with SS to start with, it's hard to put the brakes on.

Claw3 · 23/08/2010 14:18

"14 year olds
There are a lot of rules that control working hours of children, but the basic ones are:

?during term time, you can only work for two hours on weekdays and Sundays
?during term time, you can only work for five hours on Saturdays
?during a school holiday, you can work for up to five hours on a week day or a Saturday
?during a school holiday, you can't work for more than two hours on a Sunday
?you cannot work before 7.00 am or after 7.00 pm on any day"

If thats any help to you.

booyhoo · 23/08/2010 14:23

very true, never thought of that.

sorrento56 · 23/08/2010 14:31

The child's well being should come well above the relationship with the neighbour! A 14 year old is not qualified to look after a baby alone and I can't believe you allowed it tbh. It is a huge responsibility.

larrygrylls · 23/08/2010 14:39

Scattered,

I say well done to you to allow your daughter to work hard in the school holidays. She sounds like a fantastic girl. You are next door and on a mobile so you can help her should anything happen beyond her ability to sort out. It is great to see a teenager acting like a young adult and not a totally dependent child.

Now, as for your neighbour, what she is doing is clearly wrong. However, do you think it is actually dangerous? If so, inform the police and social services. If not, then have a quiet word with her and see if she might agree to change. I think people are too quick to suggest "professional" intervention. I cannot see that her 18 month old would be better off in a foster home or that her family would actually benefit from the intervention of an overworked social worker. I think there is bad and appalling. A bad or even very bad parent is better than none at all. It has to get to the appalling end of the spectrum to really be worth thinking about intervention.

ThatDamnDog · 23/08/2010 14:46

Surprised how many people think the OP's daughter doing this is as big an issue as the abandoned toddler. I wouldn't have a 14 year old looking after my kids but I did it myself at that age and don't feel too uncomfortable about it in retrospect. As a short term arrangement, if the OP, her daughter and the neighbour are all happy then it's surely not a big deal.

Certainly not on a par with leaving an 18 month old child home alone on a regular basis. That's just inconceivable to me. And yes, what else does this woman consider to be acceptable?

princesspuds · 23/08/2010 14:49

Scattered, whilst what your dd is doing is commendable, she is on very thin ice with regards to the looking after your neighbours lo.

What if something happened when your dd had taken the other child to the CM ? The mum would have baying for blood and it would be very likely that your dd would get the blame as the mum would be aware of the implications.

Also a family near me last year were in their home apart from their 4 yr old dd, mum aclled her in for tea, 5 mins later the whole house went up and both mum and dd perished leaving hubby and 3 sons, such a tragedy, no one expects it to happen near them or to anyone they know, I would be looking at mentioning it to the professionals though.

booyhoo · 23/08/2010 15:06

larry OP isn't next door. she is at work when dd is looking after the children

booyhoo · 23/08/2010 15:08

also larry i do think they will benefit from intervention from SS if they continue to leave the baby alone. no-one has suggested the child should go into foster care.