Bloody, twatting, (D)F

[Bunnysoprano]

I am absolutely sick to death and need some perspective. However, I should warn you, this is long.....

This weekend, I parked my car in the drive in front of DF's car. We had two sets of keys - DF lost one set but denies it. Usually, I leave my keys in a glass bowl in the hall but, for some reason this weekend, I stuck them in my bag.

Today, I had to leave the house about 5:30am as was travelling for work. Whilst on the train to Glasgow, I got a text from DF saying he couldn't get his car out as I had blocked it in and taken my keys. Naturally (and I do understand this), he was annoyed.

He then got a taxi to and from work today which cost £50. However, he has used the money that I take out each month from our joint account to pay for the cleaner. I am apparently to pay this back as I need to be "punished" (I kid you not!) for what I did today re the car.

I have arrived home this evening at 10:00pm after travelling to and from Glasgow today an d am rather tired. Therefore, I have not taken very kindly to this and am absolutely fuming. Part of the reason is because F is saying that he can't afford to take a taxi to work and back (notwithstanding the fact that he is pretty much a three figure earner). Now, I do accept that it was wasted money due to my mistake but I earn nearly half of what he does. I have just paid nearly £400 for flights this month for us to go to a wedding which has left me very short on the basis that DF would sub me if I needed any money. I trusted him to do this but obviously this isn't happening.

We both put equal amounts in the joint account but just enough to cover the bills so there is no flex. F is making dire threats about not putting money in this month etc if I don't pay for the taxi etc.

I know this all sounds RIDICULOUSLY childish but I have actually had a moment of utter panic and thought that I can't actually marry someone who is going to treat me like this. What if I am off on maternity leave and need "punished"?!?!? Will I get no money.

I am fuming and have actually taken myself off in the spare bedroom to sleep tonight and think about things.

I am quite prepared for a total flaming as I am SO angry I can't think straight but AIBU about this?!?

Go to Relate before you get married and talk about money and your different attitudes to it.

One of his attitudes seems to be that he thinks he is more 'worthwhile' than you because he earns more. And that he has a right to withhold money from you in the partnership.

You need to sort out how you're going to handle the future as money is the number 2 stress in a relationship.

sorry, but he sounds like an utter twat. He lost his keys. Was he punished? if he is your fiance, then I would expect him to be combining income and paying a fair share.
He has every right to be a bit pissed that your mistake in taking the keys has led to having to spend £100 of your COMBINED income on a taxi, but the whole "punished" thing really makes alarm bells ring and I would be seriously considering whether I want to proceed with the relationship. Sorry this is prob. not you want to hear, but a man believing he needs to punish someone for a basic human error is not ideal husband material, and probably not ideal father material either ..........

SpaceHopper and Noah I think we might all be married to the same man

I do agree the "punishment" bit sounds very OTT, as does paying the £50 back but rather than leave him on the strength of this argument, it's definitely worth looking at the financial side of things before you take the plunge. My DH and I don't earn the same, so we both put in an equal proportion of our salaries into the joint account. It's fair. It's right. It's equal. I would Be Having Serious Words with your F about this.

He may feel, like I have sometimes in the past, that if he's worked hard to save that it's hard to see his hard-earned money go on more frivolous things (if that's what's happened?). Even so, he has to get his head round this sharing money malarkey if he wants you two to have a happy and harmonious marriage.

Why couldn't he take a taxi to the station and then go to work by train? Why did he have to take a taxi all the way. And then all the way back?

There might be reasons why he had to take a taxi all the way there, but all the way back as well? Do you live on the moon, with no public transport services? Surely he could at least have got pub trans home? I think he's wasting money in order to punish you. Pathetic, I would call it.

I would tell him that he's a spendthrift, and that he is never to talk about punishment, offence or transgression again unless he wants to be dumped double quick.

One final thing. If it is this bad now, don't think it will get better when you get married. There is research that shows that people are on their "best behaviour" when living together, and then relax when they get married.

So either get these issues sorted now or do not marry him.

sorry, but this sounds quite bad, and is not in any way normal.

Really sorry, but he does sound weird and a bit scary.

There's also the "I've spent at least £20,000 on you" part. He's not thinking of you as an equal partner here, is he?

How is this going to work when you have children, and he is probably the sole earner for a time?

He thinks that what he earns is his, and that anything he gives you is a favour. A marriage is an economic as well as an emotional partnership, and it should be a merger, not a takeover.

Bunny it's not all bad.

You haven't married him yet.

And if you need any more perspective on the keys thing, my DH once went on a work trip to America taking with him both sets of car keys and house keys.

I had a week at home with two toddlers, not transport and a FRONT WINDOW key. Oh the joy.

He earns much more than you. Does he still insist the bills etc are split 50-50?

Money is a serious issue in relationships - you need to be happy with how things are going to be before you marry him. Because when you have children you will be (even if only temporarily) financially dependent on him.

My sister does this all the time. My BIL has learnt to look on the car roof every time she locks the car and walks off (If he's around). Her handbag/shopping/glasses/keys will be sitting up there waiting for the next person to come and pick them up!
Never heard of any punishment going on there - irritation yes - and now big laughs and stories to tell the grand children after quite a few years perspective.

Dh can also be a twat over all sorts of little things - but when I mess up big time he just wades in and clears the muck - never even brings it up later!!

You need to have a proper discussion about this. I don't see why you're paying 50:50 bills when he earns twice as much. Especially as you've contributed £20k towards the deposit. This is grossly unfair, and doesn't bode well should things go wrong.
Who's name is the house in?

If he is controlling with money now, I'd be willing to take a bet that he'll be ten times worse when you're married. He is an arse.

Hmmm... Well, as other people have said, this could be a warning sign. I suppose it could also be a miscommunication- many people aren't too good with words when they're upset. You know this man- you need to carefully assess his behaviour as a whole. It certainly sounds like his attitudes to money need to be discussed, especially from your other posts.

One thing I find incredibly worrying is that in order to "punish" you(everyone's covered how questionable that is), he's threatening not to pay the cleaner. Innocent third-party being deprived of pay to satisfy a grudge against your fiancee? Does he understand the concept of fairness at all? How does he generally treat people like waiters/waitresses? Or anyone junior to him?

Hi All - just a quick post. Have read all of your posts and appreciate the advice.

I agree that we need to sort out the money thing and I will speak to him this evening about it. I wish he would agree to go to counselling as I think that having an objective third party would be really helpful. However, he has said previously that he would NEVER do this. I suspect that he wouldn't wish have to justify or explain his behaviour as it is inherently unreasonable.

We have no children and aren't getting married until September 2011 so still sometime to sort this out.

However, I know that I CANNOT live like this. It is not how my parents live and how I have been brought up and it is not how I want to live. My parents actually gave us a £40,000 deposit and therefore £20,000 would be his "half". I had a choice when we bought the house to either use that money to pay off the mortgage on my flat or to use it as a deposit. I chose to use the money as a way to benefit BOTH of us as I saw that as the appropriate thing to do in a partnership.

There have been issues in the past (as I have explained) but I have always hoped that the issue would resolve itself as time went on and once we got married (niave, I know).

The reason I feel so hurt and upset about this is that I trusted him this month and used most of my disposbale income to buy these flights on the basis that he would "sub" me if I needed any money. Clearly, that wont happen and I now have no more money this month (£50 disposable to last me to the end of the month) and I am also meant to reimburse the £40 to the cleaner.

My sister has been married for a year and I spoke to her very generally about money. She and her husband have just got a fully joint account. However, before that, they split the bills on the basis of who earned what. I asked my sister what would happen if she "ran" out of money if she had some big expenditure and she just said that she would ask her DH for some money on the basis that "he would give me money if I needed it". She clearly trusted him totally not to leave her in the shit financially - quite simple. I feel that I have tried to do this, this month, on the basis that this would be how we should be operating and I have been totally let down.

I quite understand that F is not a cash machine and I can't demand money if I decide to go out and buy a Mulburry handbag. However, I am sick and tired of being treated as someone who constantly tries to "rip him off" when I feel that I give far more than my fair share in every way.

Have to stop now as at work and worried that I will start to cry.

Hi I just read your post Something similar happened but with a different attitude from DH.

I had borrowed his car for a short while and put his keys in my handbag and yes, forgot about them! I then went out in my car to work. I was a way Friday to Sunday tea time with no phone contact. Dh had the kids all weekend and had errands to do and places to take the kids. I had put the spare keys in a 'safe place' admittedly DH wasn't over the moon with happiness when I came home but no way did 'punishment' com into it.
All I got was Oi muppet!! ( which is what we both use with each other when the other has been a prat!) Thanks a bloody lot blah blah......'

Ooppps!

Oh Bunny, you poor thing.

Let's hear some of the stuff he does that is nice - see if we can understand why you've put up with his twattishness in the past.

(FWIW - my dh is klutzish too - went to London last week and didn't pay the congestion charge! Car is in my name so I had a lovely bill come through.. but after beating him over the head with said bill (joke) he gave me a kiss to say sorry and bought me some flowers the next day).

Our account is fully joint. He earns way more than me, but I know that if I really wanted one (and we had the money) I could go and buy a Mulberry bag and he'd be fine about it. After looking a bit he just wants me to be happy.

That's nice GrooveyGretel and as it should be. I just feel we are constantly fighting against each other rather than with each other.

His point (which is fair) is that he has a big tax bill to pay at the moment (self employed) and can't afford to pay for my stupidity etc, etc. My point is that we should therefore look at what money we BOTH have left this month and decide who pays what. Not that I should be "punished".

He can be generous in a monetary level in that I have a very expensive engagement ring (very high 5 figures - I say that not as a boast and I hope it doesn't appear that way. I only know as I know the insurable value). However, the generosity is very much on HIS terms so I always feel slightly unbalanced and never quite sure.

Discussing things can be difficult as he can stonewall or shout in the first instance. That makes me tend to shout back or, alternatively, withdraw as I just can't deal with the shouting or trying to coax him to talk to me - particularly if work is very stressful. This is interpreted by him as me "sulking". After cooling off, he will discuss.

He is very reliable in that I trust him implicitly and I wouldn't ever worry about him cheating on me. Separately, we have a lot of the same values and place a lot of importance on family. Although, as I have said, I am scared about what will happen when I am on maternity leave.

Hi reliability in a certain emotional sense is what is/was the biggest attraction for me as I went out with someone whom I loved increadibly (first real love) who treated me quite badly in that he constantly "wasn't sure" of the relationship and would keep me dangling on. If I tried to break away, he would come running after me. If I had been older, I would have left him the first time he did it but instead I waited and tried to be "better" for three years. His timing for this would be terrible - the day after I arrived in Australia to stay with him for 6 months as he was working over there, for example. The day after I arrived in London to move in with him.

He basically left me for another woman (although I only realised this on receiving some further information years later) who got pregnant very quickly after they met and he married her.

Funnily enough, for all of his bad points (and there were many) money was NEVER an issue. He had a very well paid job and I was a student when we met. I would pay for things that I could afford and he paid for the rest and never mentioned it. He also told me that I was always to ask him for money if I needed it. I wish that F could have seen how that went as, funnily enough, I never really did. While F seems to have a view that I would empty his bank account overnight.

I knew I couldn't cope with going through that ever again and hence F's emotional reliability (as I see it) is a huge draw.

What a ramble.....!

bunny, so for you. Have an unMNly ((hug)) to help you through the day.

Meanness/stinginess/tightness, call it what you want, is an unattractive trait - couple that with him letting you down when you thought you should be able to trust him to help you out, not leave you in the shit - it's not painting a good picture. If he is refusing point blank to ever consider some kind of counselling/3rd party mediation, then he clearly believes he has nothing to work on - and it comes back to this:
Do you want to spend the rest of your life with a man like this?

You have time on your side - think long and hard about it.

You have an eighty grand engagement ring?

Bunny, the fact is that there seems to be a marked inequality in the relationship i.e. your finances and he is doing nothing to reassure you that this is not a problem or to address your concerns. In fact his actions are the opposite and are not the actions of a partner who sees you as an equal. IMVHO I think that you are right to be concerned and the fact that you are hearing alarm bells means that something is wrong. Trust your instincts, you are the one in the relationship.

You mention that you are attracted to him because you can trust him. But you can't can you really? As you are worried about going on maternity leave or perhaps what happens if you lose your job. You do not trust him to do what is best for you as a couple. Doesn't matter whether that is financial or emotional.

If you want to confirm your instincts then try and test him as tortoise suggested. Again, though the very fact that you are having to test him also confirms that something isn't right.

Been there and done that btw with a previous bf who seemed convinced that I was going to wipe him out (despite the fact I was more than capable of earning my own money and never asked him for a penny). He too had his own issues (I say politely!).

SORRY - I do not have an £80,000 engagement ring. I meant 4 figures!!!! Perhaps that is why F does not trust me with access to his account!

Rowing - I have never, even considered what would happen if I lost my job.

However, my very first thought was "Oh God, I'd have to ask my parents to help me". I am not 100% sure that F would not help me. However, I am not 100% sure that he would. Therefore, I would have to ask my parents if I need help as I know that they would, whatever the case.

Just answered my own question really.

Sorry, that should say "Oh God, I'd have to ask my parents to help me"

giving up now - I meant it to be in italics!