Support group for those affected by someone else's drinking thread 5

[pointythings]

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/5473399-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking-thread-4?page=5

A new thread, because the old one is full - link to previous thread above.

These threads are a safe place for anyone who has an alcoholic in their lives. You can ask for help, you can vent, you can say whatever you need to without judgement. We will listen and support you.

I’m sorry, I had to take a minute cos everyone’s being so nice to me! He makes me feel like I’m being dramatic as he isn’t what you’d call a “traditional” alcoholic, but it’s so upsetting to see; 3.30 every Friday you can see him getting excited about the fact he’s going to be able to drink to excess, and I’ve now started to dread every holiday as I know he doesn’t have the excuse of work to reign him in.

Re the trip away, my eldest is 15 and a sensible boy, but really it shouldn’t be his responsibility to manage his dad’s drinking. I’ve told DH that, if he manages to curb it in and not drink to excess the kids can stay with him but if not they’re coming back with me separately. Obviously now he’s not talking to me cos he says I’m suggesting he’s an irresponsible father. Trying to point out that I’m not suggesting anything, just basing it off previous experience hasn’t helped the matter.

Thank you for the advice, it's good to know I'm not alone. Not definitely not stopped drinking, probably drinking even more. He's out of control emotionally when he drinks and I'm still getting the brunt of it.

We've reduced to email contact only to stop the phone calls. I'm definitely done, the abuse he's hurled at me regularly since we separated is unforgivable. He always apologises when he's sober, but I don't want to hear it anymore.

Yes the therapy has helped me keep my boundaries with him and is helping me detach from his behaviour. A few weeks ago I'd be in physical distress when he threatened suicide. Now I deal with it in a more controlled and calm way. I got the therapy through work's employee assistance programme. If anyone has this as a benefit, I'd recommend. I got an appointment within a week.

@Shabang21

He makes me feel like I’m being dramatic as he isn’t what you’d call a “traditional” alcoholic, but it’s so upsetting to see; 3.30 every Friday you can see him getting excited about the fact he’s going to be able to drink to excess,

Actually, that IS pretty traditional for an alcoholic. Just because they can hold it together in the work week doesn't mean they aren't addicted to alcohol. It's also common that when you remove the 'deterrent' they drink to excess. They drink to excess during the 'safe time' because they cannot stop drinking then.

My esDH (estranged DH) was a 'functional' alcoholic for years. Then he hurt his back and couldn't keep himself busy (to avoid drinking) and he spun out of control in the span of 2 months. I was escorted out by our local sheriff 3 months later when it became intolerable. That was 10 months ago and he's still drinking. Our house has been wrecked and only the fact that I separated finances early on kept me financially secure. There's more that's happened but that's enough to show how bad it's gotten.

And yes, it is upsetting! Because we see someone who is normally 'a good man' turn into something 'not so good'. It changes how we live our lives, too. Maybe it's tiptoeing around to avoid their drunk temper, maybe it's just not going out on family days because they'd rather stay home and drink. Or that you avoid family days because they drink then too and make a fool of themselves.

So at some point, sit quietly and review things. Maybe what I say will ring true, maybe you'll be able to honestly say your DH isn't like that. But when it comes to someone who drinks 'too much' it's always better to keep your eyes open and evaluate things often.

@AlanisMorningShed

Sounds like you're keeping your head screwed on right. I hear you about 'abuse then apologize'. As if an 'I'm sorry, but I was drunk" is an apology. It's not, it's a bullshit attempt to excuse their behaviour.

No, defo not alone! I've been sworn at, accused of cheating with multiple men, 'stealing' the dog (that he was neglecting), and 'not warning him I was thinking of leaving'. Phffft!!! Yep. I'm tired of it too. And I don't want to hear the bullshit "I'm sorry. But I...., but you...., but they.....". There's always a reason. Have you gotten the "But you promised for better or for worse" yet? If not, you will. I told him "I didn't promise for better or for drunk and abusive".

Keep on keeping on. He may not get better, but your life certainly will!

Yes @AcrossthePond55 are they the same man 🤣. I'm constantly being accused of seeing other men, I haven't done at all. Said I'd made my vows and I owe him the support.

I'm sorry you're still going through it, it's exhausting to think this goes on and on. I've really felt quite flat about it all this week. Do you feel your life has moved on at all?

My therapist did say, remember you are free now. But I don't feel free. When I look back though, I realise my situation has improved beyond what I could have ever hoped for.

It rings incredibly true, especially the avoiding days out cos I know he’ll drink to excess and make an idiot of himself. We went to the theatre with friends once, and while we were waiting for them he tanked about three cocktails while telling me stop ruining his fun cos it’s a day out. Halfway through the performance he started laughing and shouting things out - I was mortified. To be fair he hasn’t been that bad for a while, but I still don’t want to risk it. Thank you for taking time to reply, it’s honestly such a relief to know I’m not just being dramatic

Really feeling free is going to take longer. You've only just started, and it isn't part of you yet.

I got the bit about the vows from mine too - for better, for worse and all that. I told him the day I issued him the ultimatum that 'for worse' didn't mean 'for wilfully chosen harm that drags everyone else along with it'. I also told him he'd had almost 7 years of support from me and I had nothing left to give.

Mine wasn't quite that bad, but before he stopped going on family days out completely, I could always see him starting the tremors when he realised that where we were wasn't licensed for alcohol.

@Shabang21 I would def report him and no way would he be drinking my kids about and risking their lives - even being over the limit the next day will impair his reactions

you def aren’t a shit mum or It means I am. And I know I’m not as I have kicked dh out for dd !

what is a traditional alcoholic ? Anyone who drinks and can’t stop at one and is upsetting their family , is one

and they all seem to drink. Abuse whether shouting or emotional blackmail and going to end their lives

@AlanisMorningShed

are they the same man 🤣.

If we weren't probably 5500 miles apart I'd say we have ourselves a bigamist here! Unless of course, you're in California.

it's exhausting to think this goes on and on.

It does get easier, I promise. Something within you takes over and you start to think "This is a whole lotta 'not my problem'" to their complaints.

Do you feel your life has moved on at all?

I feel I've moved on quite a lot. It helps that I'm retired so don't have to worry about work and that my sons are grown and gone. I love my little flat with all my things in it. I don't worry about my furniture getting broken or spoiled. My little flat doesn't smell of beer or have empties scattered around I have things 'just so'. And the peace, quiet, and calm makes me smile.

Emotionally, I'm still a work in progress. I have accepted that I will probably love esDH until the day I die so I don't 'fight' that anymore. He is my 'soulmate'. But I cannot live with him. But I can cherish our many wonderful memories and it's getting easier and easier to trot them out and relive them. I haven't found perfect peace with that, but I know I wil.

My only downside is that I'm not free to travel. esDH isn't capable of caring for him, so I have the dog. It was really more his than mine. He's 13 yrs old, has separation anxiety and is poorly socialized (thanks to esDH). So I'm a bit 'isolated' as he can't be left on his own and has never been kenneled. He does now go to daycare a day a week so I can run errands. But he's actually a wonderful companion and he deserves to spend his 'senior years in peace, security, and comfort. As do I!!

But I don't feel free.

You will. But it's a different sort of freedom. I can't put it into words exactly. It's not the freedom we had in the 'before times' (before they became alcoholics) or when we were young and single. It's a more 'grounded' freedom. This may sound weird but it's a freedom where you actually know what you're free from. If that makes sense.

I'm glad if my words validated you in any way! We are all united by our common experiences. It's pretty amazing when you tell what you're going through, thinking you're all alone, and there is a loud chorus of "Me too" from many voices who are or have been right where you are now.

I probably would have crawled under my seat at the theatre. But what should we have done? We should have said to ourselves "Fuck this shit" (if you use such language lol) and gotten up and walked out leaving them to act like idiots all alone. But we didn't because we didn't realize we could or we were afraid to. The latter would have been me. But now we know, or we are learning. In the wise words of Dr Maya Angelou; "You did then what you knew how to do. Now that you know better, you'll do better".

No, you aren't dramatic. You're sick and tired of it.

Welcome @AlanisMorningShed , you will receive a lot of support on this thread.

I’m so sorry about your DH’s behaviour. You will eventually become numb to the suicide threats, though I absolutely appreciate that this is particularly hard for you given your past experience, and quite frankly your DH is deeply cruel to be using this threat to you when he knows what you have gone through before.

My Ex used suicide threats to keep me in line when I was challenging him too much after relapses. The fear I used to feel was hideous. He would tell me how he was going to do it and then turn his phone off so I would be sick with worry and go looking for him. Once he even did it when I had just had the funeral of a dearly loved family member who I did end of life care for. Evil.

I had a couple of failed attempts at leaving him and each one involved suicide threats in the aftermath. Every time he didn’t go through with it I got a little bit more numb to it to. I knew that he was doing it to punish me, make me worry, for the attention. in the end, every time he started talking about suicide, I would say ‘sorry to hear that, go to A&E if you feel at risk and I’ve texted to let sibling/ friend know’. His family and friends said that he rarely ever texted them the same level of suicide threats as me and they felt it was an abusive behaviour towards me so were happy for me to notify them so that I could remove it from my mental load as much as possible.

The numb will come for you too. I do understand that your past makes it harder though and it’s great that you are having therapy.

I left him for good coming up to a year ago now (wow I have been on this board so long) and sooooo much abuse by message and phone that he is blocked on everything. He could email me (luckily we don’t share children, but we both have two from our first marriages, it must be so much harder when you have children in common) but I didn’t find it as intrusive. I’d check emails in the morning and evening and that was it.

sending you love and strength xx

At one point when I was still with my ex my boss took me to one side to tell me that although husbands/wives/partners were usually welcome to come along to work social events, that invite no longer applied to my (then-)partner. My ex had got too drunk, too many times, for my boss to overlook. I cannot explain just how crushed and mortified I felt at that moment.

And can you believe it still took me years from that horrible conversation before I finally understood the extent of my ex's alcohol problems?

As @Nogoodusername said. It’s only seems us that they do the drunken I’m going to kill myself

ex def doesn’t say to others apart from
his eldest dd (adult) and she’s now more in terms of me and starting to get enough of the lies

@AcrossthePond55 whoops hit send

you still love dh ?

Your dog - can one of your sons have him /stay at yours if you need some time away

@Penguinsandspaniels

Yes, I do. Probably always will. I've found that I can hate who he is now, but that doesn't mean I don't still love who he was. By and large we had a great marriage for 37 years (not all roses and ponies of course), raised two beautiful boys into incredible men (if I do say so myself) and we had 15 great years of retirement and 20 great years of RVing. Nothing that's happened in the last 14 months has changed that. And that's OK. I don't need to not love him to be happy now. And I'm old enough that the last thing I want or need is another man lol.

My eldest son works away often and his schedule is very erratic. The nature of his work means that he can't really commit to a long stretch. He does watch him when he's able. My younger son and his girlfriend both work and have cats. The dog barks incessantly when left alone and gets super stressed so that's a 'no go'. At some point this summer I'm looking to rent a beach house. I've found one that takes dogs so at least it'll be a change of scenery.

Right now he's snuggled up & snoozing right next to me on the sofa. He's a good boy.

@Penguinsandspaniels

You know, your question has made me think. I honestly believe that emotionally speaking I'm closer to the feelings of a widow than a person who has separated from/divorced a spouse. More of grieving sadness than real anger. Not that I don't get angry, I've posted angrily before. But the overriding emotion is sadness. True anger can kill love, but I don't think that sadness always does.

I’m sad and angry that he won’t fight for dd. Not me. I’m over that - which considering Feb 24 I was in a right state crying over him to friends and saying if he can stop then it will be hard and I love him but we will get through this. Again

but he killed my love for him with his lies and continual drinking

honestly and truth is what I said to him. I would support him if relapses but be honest

and he couldn’t then and still can’t over 2yrs later be honest

I’m saddened that dd will eventually grow up without a dad and I’m cross and pissed off with him that he knows I know what it’s like to lose a husband after dh 1 dying , yet still threatens and talks about suicide

that’s where my anger comes from

how selfish dh2 is

yet I was never angry at my first dh and I accepted his choice / had to or would have gone mad my self

Maybe as he wasn’t a nasty drunk. Only loving and soppy and cried and said he wanted to stop drinking but didn’t know how to - till I got him detoxed after a fit from cutting down

I do wonder if I attract alcoholics - how unlucky can I be to have not one but two alcoholic dhs!

That really resonates with me. If my husband hadn't become so deeply emotionally abusive towards our teen DC, I think it would have been just sadness for me too. But he did, and it killed my feelings for him.

@AcrossthePond55you sound so peaceful and accepting of it all and that gives me hope for the future. I'm definitely nowhere near California unfortunately, I'm UK based. You sound like you have had a happy marriage, when did it start to unravel due to drinking? I don't feel that I've ever been truly happy, drinking has always been a feature of our relationship, I just didn't realise it until I stopped drinking myself.

@Penguinsandspanielswhere you find the strength to go through this twice, I don't know. Were the warning signs the same or different? Did you feel on high alert the second time and notice it sooner?

I don't think I love my DH either after the nastiness and abuse. I deeply care for him though and wish him happiness. He needs love though and I hope he can get better and find love again.

@Penguinsandspaniels my husband came back from rehab with lots of stuff about addiction to read. One terrifying thing was about people who are “compulsive helpers”
if you’re interested look it up but one of the things in it said if you marry an alcoholic and re marry almost certainly you will marry another alcoholic. If things don’t work out for me I have zero intention of ever having another romantic relationship let alone get married but I think for the younger women on here it’s worth looking at .

@Penguinsandspaniels @pointythings

I think that both of you have/having had younger children is what may make a difference as far as hating vs just sadness. Mine are grown and as adults they are able to understand addiction, explore their emotions 'rationally', and have made the decision to go NC with their dad based on what is right for them. So it is 'safe' for me to be sad, they don't need my anger on their behalf. Young children/teens don't have that maturity and so in most cases they still want a relationship with the addict. I think if my sons had been younger and I had to watch them be disappointed over and over or exposed to drunken possibly abusive behaviour my anger would have overridden any other emotion I felt. Because we always place our children's wellbeing and happiness over our own.

@Penguinsandspaniels You know, I have been amazed at just how many people have come into my life that are either alcoholics or have alcoholic relatives. I don't think we 'attract' alcoholics because of some sort of 'character defect'. I think they are attracted to us because they sense our tendency to caretaking and our acceptance of someone at face value. These are good qualities to have. The problem happens when someone exploits them.

@AlanisMorningShed

You sound like you have had a happy marriage, when did it start to unravel due to drinking?

He'd always been 'a drinker' but it never really created a problem for us. If he 'overindulged' on occasion he usually just 'acted stupid' or fell asleep. Then in March 2025 he injured his back and it all went to hell from there. He'd always been a 'busy bee', having projects and hobbies involving projects that kept him constantly busy. I never thought about it, but now I think the constant busy-ness was his way of subconsciously controlling his drinking. Anyway, the treatment for his back was complete rest. The removal of his 'control mechanism' resulted in him starting to drink more and more, starting earlier and earlier and ending when he passed out. As this happened he became verbally and emotionally abusive. By May 2025 I was contemplating my own future. I originally decided to stay thinking I could carve myself out a separate life. But he just kept drinking more and becoming even more angry and I bore the brunt of it, to the point of him following me around the house cursing me and name calling even as I tried to get away from him. I even took to locking myself upstairs in the guest room but he'd stand at the bottom of the stairs shouting abuse. Finally, something snapped in July 2025 and I called the sheriff to escort me out after DH refused to let me leave peacefully. I was done and have had no second thoughts or regrets. He made his choice, he chose alcohol over me. I made my choice, I chose ME, period.

I don't feel that I've ever been truly happy, drinking has always been a feature of our relationship, I just didn't realise it until I stopped drinking myself.

I get the 'part of our relationship' thing. But for me that usually was my one drink to his 'quite a few'. I haven't been a real 'drinker' since the stupidity of my early 20s. I could really put them away back then! I became a strictly 'social drinker' when I had DS1. A cocktail here and there, a glass of wine now and again. I'm now pretty much teetotal, DH has 'ruined' drinking for me. I will never, ever drink alone and I only feel comfortable having one glass of wine with dinner with DS1 but that's it. DS2 is absolutely teetotal and I don't drink in front of him as it bothers him.

We all deserve to be happy. A saying we have here is "you are not required to set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm".

@AcrossthePond55 my eldest was 11 when my husband started spiralling, but he didn't do it rapidly, so we were all very much the 'boiled frogs'. I have to be honest and say that any clashes we had over the years were always, always about parenting. He was raised in a traditional authoritarian way. His parents his their kids and he thought that was normal. I was raised in a much more relaxed way - but still authoritative, we had sensible boundaries but also freedom.

As soon as our DC stopped being cute, compliant and little and started developing their own voices and opinions, we had trouble. That only got worse. I should mention here that our DC were GOOD kids. Well behaved, excellent at school, never in any trouble. But because they dared voice their own opinions and ideas (always respectfully!), he felt they were bad. It got worse the older they got. There were a few things he was very unreasonable about - the main one was using the F-word. His mum hated that word. I pointed out that my kids and I did not have to live by the standards of his late mother. I also pointed out that we had sensible boundaries about swearing - i.e. you never swear AT someone, but if you stub your toe and it hurts, you're absolutely allowed to express that. But no.

Once the idea that our kids were bad kids set in, his behaviour just got worse and so I had to choose their safety. I'm still convinced that part of his issues with alcohol came from him having that very rigid mindset about what was right and wrong. There's a link betweem cognitive rigidity and addiction.

Fortunately for me, the DC wanted nothing at all to do with their dad after he left. And he knew better than to try for contact with a 15 year old and a 17 year old - the courts would have done nothing for him. And believe me, the DC understood every bit of what was going on with his addiction.

Ultimately though, he was so awful to them that it killed my feelings for him. He did not have to behave like that.

@wouldratgerbeunknown

If things don’t work out for me I have zero intention of ever having another romantic relationship let alone get married but I think for the younger women on here it’s worth looking at

Yep, that's me too. I have good memories, good kids, and good friends to keep me happy, contented, and busy. I am complete within myself. The idea of 'breaking in' a new man is anathema to me. I'd rather chew glass. No man will ever plant his boots under my bed again. It's like the old feminist saying from the '70s "A woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle".

Plus most men (ahem) 'in my age range' are looking for a nurse with a purse. Not that they need to be supported financially as well wanting a 'caretaker', but they want one who is financially self-supporting and will add to their lifestyle. Nope. Still not interested.

But for a younger woman with more life on the road in front of her than is in her rearview mirror, she needs to look long and hard at herself to be sure she is ready to take that chance.

That's funny/not funny because we had something a bit similar. When the boys reached their teens it became what I called 'old lion vs young lion' with each of them. The more they asserted their independence, the more DH had to assert his 'authority'. Usually because he was felt he was being 'defied' when it was honestly just them asserting their independence. I navigated it pretty easily with communication on the 'whys and wherefores' whereas DH was more "Because I told you so". It wasn't related to his drinking, I think it was just the way he was. And yes, we had clashes over parenting differences and went to counseling over it. He was pretty much told he needed to stop being so 'offended' when they asserted themselves and to lead by example, not shouting.

According to him he had an 'idyllic' childhood that got more and more perfect over the years, but his parents both died somewhat early in our marriage so I never really got a 'sense' of them as parents IYSWIM. They were certainly lovely to me and wonderful grandparents. But that doesn't tell the whole story, does it?

You made the right decision to leave once you realized you needed to jump out of that pot of boiling water! .